Thiago Alcantara

[BBZ8800]

Slightly offtopic, but about thugs.
A lot of guys here are mentioning all the time: if Dembele would have played against Roma, we wouldn't lose 3:0.
Maybe.

On the other hand, if we didn't have a team of pussies who are pushed off easily in key matches, we would never have lost 3:0 to Roma.

People are laughing at Van Bommel, Edmilson and Motta.
But when things are tough, these guys will offer a fight. (I am not saying that we should play with these 3 CMs, but our team could use 1-2 thugs).

Remember matches against Psg 4:0, Juve 3:0, Roma 3:0 with Iniesta, Busi, Messi and others just "watching" and not doing anything.

Thugs would inject some blood, energy and spirit into our team.

Would you rather have 3 schoolboys in midfield, OR 2 schoolboys and one thug?
I would play with at least 1 thug/workhorse:

Our team is too soft, too short, too nice, too technical.

 

[jamrock]

Man you sure as hell like to write long posts when a few lines would be sufficient, anyways 1 I will never use CL as a mark of success, thats your little go to, constantly to try & undermind cryuffs run, & make rijkaards look like the greatest in out history & I love rijkaard just to be clear.

Anyways are we talking about the same van gaal that brought us xavi & iniesta?

The same rijkaard who used xavi & deco whenever they were both fit.

The same rijkaard that needed iniesta off the bench to change the CL final.

You constantly act like a certain section of the fan base is saying we have no use for a keita or Davids in the squad,which is not the case but to start a midfield of van bommel, edmilson, motta is just

Facts are this, in the history of the cl I would go back & check for day 1 myself but can't right now, but certainly in modern history, the teams that have won the CL since that's your main focus, have been dominated by those with technically gifted midfielders & those with the facking runners have won few & far between.

Milan: pirlo, seedorf, gattuso*
Bayern: kroos, Bastian
Barca: xavi, iniesta
Mardid: after years of going with physical players in midfield trying to counter us,got modric & kroos the rest is history.

Those teams have been the dominant force in the CL for what the better part of 2 decades are close to it.

On the international stage much of the same thing.

So there is nothing to indicate that your constant claims of starting 2/3 of these types of players work on a consistent basis, which is the key issue.

You would even think that with this past season where you pretty much got what you asked for & we got our ass handed to us in the CL this would make you back off, but instead you keep doubling down.

Again to summarize, no one is saying there isn't a need for a keita, a van bommel,in a squad but there is nothing to prove your weak point of starting 2/3 of these players is the key to success on the international stage.

I await your reply saying something along the lines of kroos, bastian or who ever was 6" tall completely missing the point or cerrypicking a time we lose to chelsea something along those lines.

But at the end of the day teams who prioritize technically gifted midfielders above all else wins more often times than they lose & it's not even close either.

 

[ASordidGod]

Gerard was sold with buyback option, how is that even comparable?



I think that is his point.



You know we played with Edmilson and Motta as our DM in 433 before? we also used Davis there. Playing with a player like Kante doesn't take our identity.
Our team right now lack lungs in it, in all honesty Kante in 433 would push Busquets to CM and relie him from his defensive duties which he has struggled a lot this year.
Though Kante isn't available anyway

Kante isn't actually a great def mid imo, he's great when he's all action, playing him as a sole dm would be a waste of what makes him special. As for Busquets, the further forward he plays the worse he gets. However he IS a fantastic dm, the best imo, when he's played in his position. Why move him? Achieves nothing. As to previous dm's, there's a huge difference between having technically adept ball winners (which is what those players you listed were) and a 442 system with no control, ceding possession/impetus and a Kante type as one of only two cms.

 

[Jcar]

I dont understand why Barcelona still didn't bought him. Its cristal clear for me that we have a problem without a CM that controls the midfield and also can create. Thiago is crazy good... Just let Arthur come in January as a reserve for Thiago.

If he is still injury prone, then lets use him as a substitute for Arthur.

If we let him go to other team, we may be really regretful in the future.

 

[DonAK]

Busquets was tried as a CM for a few games some years back and he wasn't very impressive to say the least.

 

[serghei]

Busquets can only play DM.

 

[ASordidGod]

We played 442 with some thugs in midfield in early 2000s.
And 433 under Rijkaard with thugs like Edmilson, Van Bommel, Motta in midfield.

No offense, have you fell in love with Barca during Pep?
Because he turned a page in an extreme light snd technical direction and people nowadays often confuse Pep's way with Barca's way.

No, actually, but I won't lie, I love Pep's way of playing. All I really mean about Barca's identity, at least as far as I understand it, is a love for the football, and the courage to play with it. That's all I want. I want players 'tough' enough to willingly receive the ball in tight spaces, to progress play whenever they can; not a team of players thinking they're tough because they kicked someone. There's an element of romanticism in my vision, I accept that, and I'm not saying we need ONLY artist; only that there's a way of winning and then there's a Barca way of winning, and i really hope we can focus on that.

 

[MessiCam]

We played 442 with some thugs in midfield in early 2000s.
And 433 under Rijkaard with thugs like Edmilson, Van Bommel, Motta in midfield.

No offense, have you fell in love with Barca during Pep?
Because he turned a page in an extreme light snd technical direction and people nowadays often confuse Pep's way with Barca's way.

What are you talking about?

The only managers that I can say played anything other than a 3-4-3 or 4-3-3 was van Gaal and Rexach. Van Gaal played 3-5-2 while Rexach was more flexible using 4-4-2/4-3-3. Maybe Antic did too because Requelme was still around.

 

[YodaMaster]

We played 442 with some thugs in midfield in early 2000s.
And 433 under Rijkaard with thugs like Edmilson, Van Bommel, Motta in midfield.

No offense, have you fell in love with Barca during Pep?
Because he turned a page in an extreme light snd technical direction and people nowadays often confuse Pep's way with Barca's way.

OMG wtf is BBZ talking about ? Why does he have the rights to come to this forum and tell all the lies in the world ?
How is Motta a "thug/workhorse" ? Dude is a Masia product, he's a similar player to Busquets. Great on the ball, perfect Barça style DM. Go watch PSG with and without Motta, completely different team just like Barca is without Busquets. The difference with Busquets is that Motta's more aggressive and a less good player altogether (cause Busquets is GOAT material). Plus, under Rijkard, the starting midfield was Motta/Van Bommel/Edmilson/Márquez-Xavi-Deco with Iniesta getting more and more minutes by the time (which is normal cause he was only 20yo). The 3 guys you named were never starting at the same time. So STOP YOUR LIES.
Using your logic, I could say that Pep's team had a lot of physical midfielders with Touré, Keita and Hleb. Which is completely irrelevant cause they weren't the 3 starting midfielders.

BTW, Edmilson and Van Bommel were better players on the ball than Paulinho and Kanté. Marquez who also played DM was pure technical DM, like Busquets and Motta. What your brain can't understand is that a workhorse player doesn't have to be a fraud with the ball at his feet like Paulinho and Rakitic are. Xavi used to run 13-15km/match, he was a workhorse when the team was dispossessed. Busquets on a good day and IN TYPICAL BARCA SYSTEM wins far more tackles than both Paulinho and Rakitic at the same time.

This dude BBZ comes here and tries to make people believe his lies. What are you trying to tell us ? A midfield with technical players can't work ? How the hell did Busquets-Xavi-Iniesta work ? What happened when their team was dispossessed ? Was it Messi who went and get the ball back from opposition ? No, they did the work perfectly without the ball because TECHNICAL PLAYER doesn't automatically means that he doesn't do shit once he's dispossessed. All midfielders aren't Ozil. Look at Thiago's statistics. He makes a ton of tackles and wins a ton of balls from opposition. Far more than Rakitic and Paulinho and Gomes who are all supposed to be those workhorses you love so much. Therefore, he's more a workhorse than your favourite workhorses.
Get your stuff together and STOP LYING.

Why is Madrid working while playing with all the most technical (Thiago style) midfielders in the world ???
Are you Pep Segura's wife ? Or Pep Segura himself ?

And what's is up with that new "thug' stupidity ??? Are we supposed to take that serious ? We already have thugs with Alba and Suarez and they're just annoying when they start their "thug" stuff. What do you want ? A team with 11 thugs on the field ? Messi isn't thug at all. We should sell him and buy Roy Keane's son, right ?

 

[BADGERBHOY]

OMG wtf is BBZ talking about ? Why does he have the rights to come to this forum and tell all the lies in the world ?
How is Motta a "thug/workhorse" ? Dude is a Masia product, he's a similar player to Busquets. Great on the ball, perfect Barça style DM. Go watch PSG with and without Motta, completely different team just like Barca is without Busquets. The difference with Busquets is that Motta's more aggressive and a less good player altogether (cause Busquets is GOAT material). Plus, under Rijkard, the starting midfield was Motta/Van Bommel/Edmilson/Márquez-Xavi-Deco with Iniesta getting more and more minutes by the time (which is normal cause he was only 20yo). The 3 guys you named were never starting at the same time. So STOP YOUR LIES.
Using your logic, I could say that Pep's team had a lot of physical midfielders with Touré, Keita and Hleb. Which is completely irrelevant cause they weren't the 3 starting midfielders.

BTW, Edmilson and Van Bommel were better players on the ball than Paulinho and Kanté. Marquez who also played DM was pure technical DM, like Busquets and Motta. What your brain can't understand is that a workhorse player doesn't have to be a fraud with the ball at his feet like Paulinho and Rakitic are. Xavi used to run 13-15km/match, he was a workhorse when the team was dispossessed. Busquets on a good day and IN TYPICAL BARCA SYSTEM wins far more tackles than both Paulinho and Rakitic at the same time.

This dude BBZ comes here and tries to make people believe his lies. What are you trying to tell us ? A midfield with technical players can't work ? How the hell did Busquets-Xavi-Iniesta work ? What happened when their team was dispossessed ? Was it Messi who went and get the ball back from opposition ? No, they did the work perfectly without the ball because TECHNICAL PLAYER doesn't automatically means that he doesn't do shit once he's dispossessed. All midfielders aren't Ozil. Look at Thiago's statistics. He makes a ton of tackles and wins a ton of balls from opposition. Far more than Rakitic and Paulinho and Gomes who are all supposed to be those workhorses you love so much. Therefore, he's more a workhorse than your favourite workhorses.
Get your stuff together and STOP LYING.

Why is Madrid working while playing with all the most technical (Thiago style) midfielders in the world ???
Are you Pep Segura's wife ? Or Pep Segura himself ?

And what's is up with that new "thug' stupidity ??? Are we supposed to take that serious ? We already have thugs with Alba and Suarez and they're just annoying when they start their "thug" stuff. What do you want ? A team with 11 thugs on the field ? Messi isn't thug at all. We should sell him and buy Roy Keane's son, right ?

 

[clemente]

Would be a good post but wtf is this?

fraud with the ball at his feet like Paulinho and Rakitic

I consider Rakitic an elite passer, his possession/passing stats are up there with Kroos and Modric, how is he a fraud with the ball?

 

[DonAK]

Rakitic is not an elite passer in the level of Kroos and Modric. That's blatant fanboyism.

 

[Vilarrubi]

Rakitic is not an elite passer in the level of Kroos and Modric. That's blatant fanboyism.

+1

Probably has the same passing % but doesn’t count when it’s mostly sideways and backwards.

 

[MTL_Barca]

Rakitic isn't bad on the ball, but also not exactly brilliant. He can do a lot of things (very) good but nothing is too spectacular. Pretty slow, not really that strong/tall, good passer but no Xavi of course, can be decent on attack but there are better for that etc. Its someone you can always play and is good to have but the fact that he currently is our only strong CM for next season is pretty telling regarding our midfield.

I also don't get the thug talk, it sounds like we already have enough good technical CMs but we simply dont have them. And Valverde is a factor too here. We are Barca but we cannot control the game properly vs pressing teams, it's a shame. You cant keep possession with Gomes or Paulinho and just hoping for Cou (he is great and will do good in midfield IMO but we don't know), Arthur (looks promising but who knows) and Alena (also more AM and we don't know how good he ends up being) is risky.

Another quality CM like Thiago would make our midfield so much better compared to last season. If that is done we can still kick out Paulinho for a better "thug". He sucks in that role anyway, all the listed "thugs" were at least decent at defending, most of them even were DMs. Paulinho cant pass AND is average at defending too, would you ever play Paulinho on Busquets position? No. He only adds something unique on offense and he was really good there but that simply isn't enough to warrant a spot on the team and i'd rather rely on a plan b striker and long range shots from Coutinho than subbing on Paulinho and give up control.

 

[gr98]

OMG wtf is BBZ talking about ? Why does he have the rights to come to this forum and tell all the lies in the world ?
How is Motta a "thug/workhorse" ? Dude is a Masia product, he's a similar player to Busquets. Great on the ball, perfect Barça style DM. Go watch PSG with and without Motta, completely different team just like Barca is without Busquets. The difference with Busquets is that Motta's more aggressive and a less good player altogether (cause Busquets is GOAT material). Plus, under Rijkard, the starting midfield was Motta/Van Bommel/Edmilson/Márquez-Xavi-Deco with Iniesta getting more and more minutes by the time (which is normal cause he was only 20yo). The 3 guys you named were never starting at the same time. So STOP YOUR LIES.
Using your logic, I could say that Pep's team had a lot of physical midfielders with Touré, Keita and Hleb. Which is completely irrelevant cause they weren't the 3 starting midfielders.

BTW, Edmilson and Van Bommel were better players on the ball than Paulinho and Kanté. Marquez who also played DM was pure technical DM, like Busquets and Motta. What your brain can't understand is that a workhorse player doesn't have to be a fraud with the ball at his feet like Paulinho and Rakitic are. Xavi used to run 13-15km/match, he was a workhorse when the team was dispossessed. Busquets on a good day and IN TYPICAL BARCA SYSTEM wins far more tackles than both Paulinho and Rakitic at the same time.

This dude BBZ comes here and tries to make people believe his lies. What are you trying to tell us ? A midfield with technical players can't work ? How the hell did Busquets-Xavi-Iniesta work ? What happened when their team was dispossessed ? Was it Messi who went and get the ball back from opposition ? No, they did the work perfectly without the ball because TECHNICAL PLAYER doesn't automatically means that he doesn't do shit once he's dispossessed. All midfielders aren't Ozil. Look at Thiago's statistics. He makes a ton of tackles and wins a ton of balls from opposition. Far more than Rakitic and Paulinho and Gomes who are all supposed to be those workhorses you love so much. Therefore, he's more a workhorse than your favourite workhorses.
Get your stuff together and STOP LYING.

Why is Madrid working while playing with all the most technical (Thiago style) midfielders in the world ???
Are you Pep Segura's wife ? Or Pep Segura himself ?

And what's is up with that new "thug' stupidity ??? Are we supposed to take that serious ? We already have thugs with Alba and Suarez and they're just annoying when they start their "thug" stuff. What do you want ? A team with 11 thugs on the field ? Messi isn't thug at all. We should sell him and buy Roy Keane's son, right ?