Dean Huijsen

[jamrock]

Yes, as I told you. You can reduce the chance of defenders fucking up individually by defending more compact with more men behind the ball. You're still acting as if it's acceptable for Barca level players to play like Segunda Division bums.

No I've blamed araujo he fucked up, said that already.

But the post I just made explains why I'm not jumping on that as the first thing.

 

[serghei]

I agree with you, except in reverse lol.

No defender bar a flick team, would be put in that position to behind with.

Cubarsi should have been the one to cut that ball out, but instead he was dragged to the LB position, to do the job raph or a midfielder should have been doing, which is cover Martin.

CAUSE POOR DEFENSE setup
Effect, No CL final.

At Barca that's how the team is expected to play. I agree it's extreme, but nothing was asked from the players that shouldn't be expected playing at this level for this club.

 

[jamrock]

At Barca that's how the team is expected to play. I agree it's extreme, but nothing was asked from the players that shouldn't be expected playing at this level for this club.

Not a thing about Barca in all our history suggest we play like that with 5 minutes left.

Peak Barca under pep, we aren't doing that with a 1 goal lead, with 5 minutes left.

Now you're just living in make belief world.

This is HOW flick plays, it's great I love him for it.

But it fucked us in the last 5 minutes because it was completely unnecessary

 

[serghei]

We made stupid errors with Pep also. Vs Inter in 2010 we conceded 3 goals on counters while leading 1-0 in Milano. Pep is not a great example, he also paid a big price in CL for some errors, especially in 2010.

The error of Flick in the end was already discussed and agreed. What I don't agree with is that the system caused the players to feck up. It did not. The players, some of them, made individual mistakes that were very big for this level.

Araujo for example fecked up at a corner in the first leg. He can feck up individually at any moment. The worst mistake from Flick imo was subbing Araujo. Was just one of the worst subs ever in CL semis.

 

[jamrock]

Close our eyes and imagine two scenarios.

1. Raphinha is back to cover Martin, Cubarsi is in his correct position, pedri/ de Jong is covering the space in front of the box, looking for any runners for them to go with and cover.

Martin slips/gets foul.

Dumfries gets the ball.


Scenario 2.

We have Ashley Cole, he slips.
VVD has to come over to cover
Dumfries gets the ball and crosses it, because no raph to cover

The box is wide, no midfielders to cover runners.

The ball gets in, the inter attacker is on the wrong side of puyol.

In what situation are we less likely to concede a goal?.

The one with some of the best defenders ever or the one where we didn't send half our team forward to score an unnecessary goal?.

 

[jamrock]

We made stupid errors with Pep also. Vs Inter in 2010 we conceded 3 goals on counters while leading 1-0 in Milano. Pep is not a great example, he also paid a big price in CL for some errors, especially in 2010.

The error of Flick in the end was already discussed and agreed. What I don't agree with is that the system caused the players to feck up. It did not. The players, some of them, made individual mistakes that were very big for this level.

Araujo for example fecked up at a corner in the first leg. He can feck up individually at any moment. The worst mistake from Flick imo was subbing Araujo. Was just one of the worst subs ever in CL semis.

Were we leading by 1 with 3 minutes to go?

 

[serghei]

Close our eyes and imagine two scenarios.

1. Raphinha is back to cover Martin, Cubarsi is in his correct position, pedri/ de Jong is covering the space in front of the box, looking for any runners for them to go with and cover.

Martin slips/gets foul.

Dumfries gets the ball.


Scenario 2.

We have Ashley Cole, he slips.
VVD has to come over to cover
Dumfries gets the ball and crosses it, because no raph to cover

The box is wide, no midfielders to cover runners.

The ball gets in, the inter attacker is on the wrong side of puyol.

In what situation are we less likely to concede a goal?.

The one with some of the best defenders ever or the one where we didn't send half our team forward to score an unnecessary goal?.

It is obvious putting players behind the ball should have been done. Then keeping the ball when we get in possession and wasting time, winning free kicks, throw-ins, corner kicks, whatever to drive the clock.

If we do that we probably play the final. If we don't do it, and we don't fuck up individually in defense, we also play the final. We took an unnecessary risk at the wrong time and paid the price.

I agree with you in most of what you say except that one part where you said the errors were caused by the system, as they were not. But I agree we should not have allowed it to be decided by Araujo vs Acerbi 1 vs 1. Even if Araujo has no excuse for defending like a bum. You simply have a lot of tools on hand at that moment to not take the risk and choose the easier option.

 

[serghei]

Flick fecking up, and players letting us down individually are not only possible, but what really happened late in this match after 3-2 goal. If either of those two doesn't happen, we probably play the final. They both happened unfortunately.

 

[jamrock]

It is obvious putting players behind the ball should have been done. Then keeping the ball when we get in possession and wasting time, winning free kicks, throw-ins, corner kicks, whatever to drive the clock.

If we do that we probably play the final. If we don't do it, and we don't fuck up individually in defense, we also play the final. We took an unnecessary risk at the wrong time and paid the price.

I agree with you in most of what you say except that one part where you said the errors were caused by the system, and they were not. But I agree we should not have let it went to a Araujo vs Acerbi. Should have done more to stop that duel from happening, even if Araujo has no excuse for defending like a bum.

Exactly so the issue is the system first not the players.

Do the best defenders ever reduce the chance of us conceding yesterday in the exact same situation?. yes.

But do they reduce it significantly?. No.

What does is what I said above and what everyone who I've said who understands football has said.

Did araujo fuck up? Absolutely he did, why the fuck is the attacker on your weak side.

But he shouldn't have been put in that position in the first place

The system fail the players first yesterday, before the players failed us the fans.

It's that simple really.

 

[khaled_a_d]

3 consecutive years of European defensive humiliation isn't on the system that has changed. Trying to make the discussion about the last minute goal to say we don't need CB is deflection of the arguments.

Facts are there, under different coaches

 

[jamrock]

3 consecutive years of European defensive humiliation isn't on the system that has changed. Trying to make the discussion about the last minute goal to say we don't need CB is deflection of the arguments.

Facts are there, under different coaches

That happens we don't concede.

Deal with it and stop talking nonsense.

 

[khaled_a_d]

That happens we don't concede.

Deal with it and stop talking nonsense.

Again, not the discussion and irrelevant.

 

[jamrock]

Again, not the discussion and irrelevant.

Very relevant and is what is being discussed.

Same players position differently, we win.

Total fuckery you're talking about different players would have made a difference.

Best players in history and we are still very likely to concede that.

Conceded less goals with 10 men last season.

 

[khaled_a_d]

Different players position themselves right.
Even if the goal was avoided, it is the same results.
Out CB rotation is below the ambitions of the club. This is the discussion from the start. Not which goals could have been avoided.

 

[draconifire]

Have to disagree with you @jamrock

Yes, we should have a different approach during the dying moments of the game.
But it was individual mistakes that has costs us this tie. Same as last year. And same as the year before.
At some point, we need to look at this in terms of the personal.
But Araujo simply has to go now. There is no other choice. And Christensen didnt even play this year, he is so unreliable. He has to leave.
We need to find two CBs to fill them. Tah for free and another option.
In my perspective, we use the money we get from Araujo and Christensen and buy Huijsen. But I am open to other options.

Having said that, I love our players pushing for a goal more during those minutes. Its shows their rawness and hunger. Which is what we lacked for a decade.
This hunger has given us this result. No other team in the world will play against this Inter in San Siro and score 3 goals, while also arguably should have scored more. I can guarantee you that.

With how error-prone our players were, you never know a cross could have come in the 94th minute and Inter scores, because we tried to defend and sat back.