Ballon d'Or 2025

[vegitot]

I bet I am older than you.
I started watching football in 1994, and I have seen all of Rivaldo since he joined Barca.

You post a bicycle kick goal against UTD, as if it proves something.
You cite the Ballon D Or, as a proof, while in reality it's whole point of contest, and the one that needs to be proven. This is a common logical fallacy

Again you don't understand basic concepts:
- Rivaldo in 98-99 was a cog in the wheel of well oiled machine by LVG. Great cog, but still a cog.
- Rivaldo 00-02 under Serra Ferrer and Rexach was a different beast: an one-team man. The one carrying a disjointed and dysfunctional team with his heroics. Something like Messi under Valverde.
A simple look at his numbers proves that, even if you don't remember

He deserved much more a Ballon D Or based on individual performances in 2001 or 2002, after the WC, but Owen and Ronaldo got them because of titles. He could have gotten the 2002 at least

So Beckham carried Utd alone to the treble? You tried to talk shit abot Rivaldo, claimed he won shit in 1999 year while he won both Liga tittle and Copa America, being absolute the best player. Mighty Beckham never reached a semi final with his NT

His best year was 1999 (and extended to 2001). 2002 he started to show glisme of his declince.

Scolari had said in interviews that Rivaldo, and not Ronaldo, was the best and most valuable player for his Brazil 2002 side.

The player himself had said that 2002 was his best ever year, and that the 2002 WC his best version having worked so hard that not even prime Neymar could take his spot.

The whole development of his career, based on both eye-test and data, tells you Rivaldo peaked between 2000 and 2002, and not earlier. Even statements by the player himself say that.

But hey, keep believing he was better in 1999 because he won Copa America , or because some voted for him in the Ballon D Or, or some others did not vote for him in 2002 and voted for Ronaldo.
Top-notch criteria...

Yes, Scolari said Rivaldo was the best player of 2002 WC (schooled your mighty Beckham ). He won WC in 2002, which was why he said that was his best year. And he played in his favourite position from 2000-2002, rather than play from wing in his first two seasons with Barca, so he had his point.

Go and watch his 1998/99 season (i posted a lot above). He was way quicker and more explosive. This was his best performance for Brazil NT, in 1999.

But hey, Mighty Beckham was better than Rivaldo in 1999 because Utd won UCL by pure luck

Dare to compare their stats and performances in 1999???

 

[vegitot]

Rivaldo is officially the most underrated player in history when there is somebody out there think he robbed freaking Beckham of all players

 

[vegitot]

He was superb before that too, though. He was excellent for Deportivo, superb at France '98 (especially against Denmark, who were really good then) and brilliant in 1999. Even if the player himself said he was better after, that doesn't mean he wasn't operating on the very highest of levels even in the late 90s.

I respect your opinion that he didn't deserve the award that year. But I don't agree Beckham was better - Beckham was excellent, but wasn't the best player in his own team in my opinion, Keane was. Beckham just got all the glory because of his fame off the pitch and the 'redemption narrative' after being sent off against Argentina the previous year. You can also argue guys like Basler, Effenberg, Shevchenko deserved it.

If you think Beckham deserved it then okay (I definitely don't) but claiming Rivaldo 'robbed' him, as if Rivaldo was significantly inferior to him over the season, just isn't true from watching that season.

The overall point though is that Beckham - while a very good player - doesn't come close to Rivaldo in football ability. A pre-peak Rivaldo is better than Beckham's best ever level. I know the award is about performance, not overall ability, but still it's true.

Berkamp missed a pk and Giggs scored a solo goal to win vs Arsenal in FA Cup.

Keane started their comeback vs Juventus in semi final of UCL.

Beckham made two corner kicks in the UCL final and he was the true winner of Ballon Dor

Some logic here.

Same level with Jorginho best player in the world in 2021

 

[Maradona37]

Berkamp missed a pk and Giggs scored a solo goal to win vs Arsenal in FA Cup.

Keane started their comeback vs Juventus in semi final of UCL.

Beckham made two corner kicks in the UCL final and he was the true winner of Ballon Dor

Some logic here.

Same level with Jorginho best player in the world in 2021

Yeah, Beckham was obviously excellent that season, but from Man United alone there were many great moments of others, and I think Keane was their standout performer that year. Cole and Yorke were also excellent. Like you say there were a lot of big moments that went United's way like the FA Cup semi you reference and Keane with the header that kickstarted things in Turin. Beckham did put those two corners in, but prior to that he'd been dominated as he stood in for Scholes and Keane in CM (as both were suspended).

Yeah the Jorginho one makes little sense either. He did win everything, and was a key player, but he was far from the best individual player. Even then, he didn't make near the same impact in midfield that Rodri did when he won the award.

I mean I think Beckham was really good that year, and deserved credit, but in no way was he as good as Rivaldo for me. I like Birdy so don't wanna argue with him but must disagree strongly on this matter.

 

[vegitot]

Back to 2025 edition, Yamal is now having a bit advantage. Spain already started his campaign.

 

[Maradona37]

Rivaldo is officially the most underrated player in history when there is somebody out there think he robbed freaking Beckham of all players

So true about Beckham's international career too. I do think he was a top player but he was a major failure for England.

1998 - sent off, England eliminated
2000 - average at best like his team-mates as they go out in groups.
2002 - jumped out of tackle with Roberto Carlos that led to (of all people) Rivaldo's equaliser. Out they go
2004 - very poor and missed penalties both against France and in the decisive shootout with Portugal. The latter was skied.
2006 - pretty medicore again and sat bawling his eyes out after he was subbed (as captain) and realised his international career was effectively over.
2008 qualification after he came back - he passed the ball straight to Croatia from RB position. Croatia directly scored the goal that eliminated England.

You wouldn't believe how many times some moron has said to me 'how was Beckham not brilliant for England? Remember Greece?!' Yes, one game - a qualifier- in 115 caps, where he ran about leaving gaps and finally scored with his 8th freekick attempt. Fair play for that but it was a qualifier against Greece, three years before they would become European Champions (which was them playing above their level anyway). Nobody can ever name a big game he played well in an actual tournament. He's a lot like CR in fact there, with people wanking over his qualification games and ignoring poor performances at tournaments.

And aside from all the above, I haven't mentioned the destabilising effect on the England team the WAG culture he started had outside the pitch.

He was a great club player at Man United and at times for Real Madrid, but his international career is a massive disappointment. If someone isn't his fanboy and analyses it objectively.

 

[Temptation]

When Beckham and Keane played for Yanited in their peak, literally nobody rated Paul Scholes as a better Footballer than them.

In his 20 odd years at the club, the United players and staff never voted him as one of the top 3 United players of the season. Not once! This is from the people who played with him everyday not some Twitter kids.

And now you have people rating him alongside Xavi and Pirlo because of some nice quotes from Zidane and Iniesta (quotes which they have said for multiple players BTW). What a joke!

Scholes was an outstanding passer and could strike the ball well but completely lacked the ball manipulation ability of a Xavi or a Pirlo. He was a notoriously bad defender who made awful tackles. Physically he was crap too. He didn't have the close control, touch and dribbling/press resistance of a Xavi, Modric or Pirlo.

When he was playing for the NT, every manager built the team around Gerrard and Lampard. Scholes was shifted out to the left and then retired from international football prematurely. Ferguson was desperate to sign Gerrard when he had Prime Scholes (confirmed by Neville multiple times).

Scholes went from being an underrated player people with knowledge rave about to being comically overrated and forced into conversations he doesn't belong to. The United PR is crazy. Disgusting club and fanbase.

Prime Beckham and Keane were simply better players and far more influential to United than Scholes. Anyone who watched them knows this. I'd argue that Prime Giggs when he was a flying left winger was considered a bigger talent too.

Rant over. 😤

 

[MonteCuler]

Tebas said the ballon d'or should be decided between Lamine and...

You will never, ever, in your life guess who

Hint: won absolutely nothing and had a worse season than Ferran Torres but he evidently has a whole PR nation behind him.

Known for crying, complaining, diving, behaving like a bitch and moaning when he loses the ballon d'or to fair winner.

 

[RedxMAK]

Tebas said the ballon d'or should be decided between Lamine and...

You will never, ever, in your life guess who

Hint: won absolutely nothing and had a worse season than Ferran Torres but he evidently has a whole PR nation behind him.

Known for crying, complaining, diving, behaving like a bitch and moaning when he loses the ballon d'or to fair winner.

Hmm, Mbappe?

 

[RedxMAK]

Tebas said the ballon d'or should be decided between Lamine and...

You will never, ever, in your life guess who

Hint: won absolutely nothing and had a worse season than Ferran Torres but he evidently has a whole PR nation behind him.

Known for crying, complaining, diving, behaving like a bitch and moaning when he loses the ballon d'or to fair winner.

Or Ronaldo?

 

[MonteCuler]

Hmm, Mbappe?

His haircut might be harmful to eyes so here is a safe image of his

 

[Joan]

he evidently has a whole PR nation behind him.

He appears to be Real’s Mats.

 

[Maradona37]

Deleted my post to keep it on-topic

 

[Birdy]

So Beckham carried Utd alone to the treble? You tried to talk shit abot Rivaldo, claimed he won shit in 1999 year while he won both Liga tittle and Copa America, being absolute the best player. Mighty Beckham never reached a semi final with his NT

His best year was 1999 (and extended to 2001). 2002 he started to show glisme of his declince.


Yes, Scolari said Rivaldo was the best player of 2002 WC (schooled your mighty Beckham ). He won WC in 2002, which was why he said that was his best year. And he played in his favourite position from 2000-2002, rather than play from wing in his first two seasons with Barca, so he had his point.

Go and watch his 1998/99 season (i posted a lot above). He was way quicker and more explosive. This was his best performance for Brazil NT, in 1999.

But hey, Mighty Beckham was better than Rivaldo in 1999 because Utd won UCL by pure luck

Dare to compare their stats and performances in 1999???

You keep strawman-ing and drifting off-topic to save your ass, after being slapped in the face with Scolari's and Rivaldo's own statements...

But I will give it one last try:
1) I never said Beckham carried anyone. I said him and Giggs were IMO the best players of that treble-winning UTD. Some might add Keane, that's OK

2) No, his best individual season in numbers was 00-01, and 2002 WC the best version of himself according to his own statements.

3) I don't give a fuck whether he was more explosive in 1999, as this is not the point of the argument at all. The question is WHEN he was best individually, and that according to both data, eye-test, and statements of the protagonist themselves, including the player, is not the 98-99

4) No matter how you spin it, Copa America is a small NT title, can't be compared to Euro, let alone WC.

5) Since, you still distort the argument on purpose, I will write it one last time: the Ballon D'Or is not decided only on best individual performances, but also on importance for the sides that won the most important titles (which is neither Copa America, nor LL). It has always been a pendulum between the two

In sum: Take your huge L for being stubborn on things you don't know, and walk

 

[Don Juan Laporta Estruch]

There isn't even a Man Utd fan in this world that wouldn't laugh in your face if you told him that Beckham deserved a Ballon Dor.

Jesus Christ, this thread