Cr150

BarcaOG

BarcaOG

Banned
KingLeo10 said:
I also think you're holding unrealistic standards for what a GOAT tier player is in football (being decisive all the time)...because I think you're using basketball or other sports standards where one player can have a lot of influence on the outcome.

Football players also don't age well because they the legs are usually the first thing to go and football is about core strength and leg strength.
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Not really. I think you can have bad games and games in which you are invisible and still be the GOAT. The key question for me is whether there is a clear and demonstrable pattern. You can lose this or that final, be knocked out of this or that semi-final, etc etc. You don't have to win it all or score every game.
But I simply do not think that it is worthy of the title GOAT--the best player EVER to kick a football--to be invisible in SO many important matches: the WC final for Argentina, the 3 (was it 3?) finals against Chile with Argentina, every single clasico since like 2017, year after year of humiliating CL exists. All of that looks rather bad for a player who is supposed to be 'the best EVER'. I just don't think it can work like that.

It's also very telling to me that Barcelona's best player ever (which Messi for sure is) played during a time in which Real won 4 CLs, taking their total from 9 to 13. This was supposed to be our best era, lol. Hence why I think our standards should be higher, especially if you're going to say Messi is the best of 2021 so far or the GOAT.

If you are willing to concede that, actually, he is no longer the world's best, then I too will relax my criticism; I am using your standards after all.
 
Messigician

Messigician

Senior Member
BarcaOG said:
You are hardly one to laugh around here considering you think EV is the epitome of a manager even as he delivered the most humiliating CL eliminations ever recorded
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4-4 And 4-3 aggregate.

I don't give a shit. If players didn't suck back to back tables dawgs.

To quote Valverde it is what it is
 
Rassvet

Rassvet

Well-known member
It's gonna much more fun and relaxing watching him these next few Serie A matches after this CL fracaso. He still has Serie A top scorer and maybe even the Serie A scoring record to fight for, so there should be some exciting drama to watch.
 
M

Morten

Senior Member
Juventus made a big mistake getting rid of Allegri, maybe things were getting a bit stale toward the end, but still way better for Juve than the replacements.

Also i dont know Juventus finances, but judging by signings in recent years, it appears they couldnt really afford Ronaldo and build a team around him at the same time.

One have to wonder what the club was thinking signing a 33 year old that will cripple the finances.
 
R

Rory

Senior Member
Here's a stat. In the last decade the 3 worst seasons for Juventus have all occurred in the years Ronaldo has played for them.

He's had a great career but he hasn't made Juventus more competitive or anything positive in a sporting sense.

Same people aggressively defending him would be using these last 3 years as fuel to knock Messi for the next decade as evidenced by revisionism of previous losses Messi has been part of. Don't believe for a moment some people here are barca fans. Their comments read too much like the sort of crap you see on twitter in the cringe ronaldo v messi debates but oddly in favour of ronaldo... here... on a barca forum. Stranger thing is that these same people have a history of shitting on Messi and praising ronaldo despite poor performances. Hmmmm interesting.
 
Vilarrubi

Vilarrubi

New member
That’s the thing, Juve been dumped out of CL by Ajax, Lyon and Porto. Not downplaying our humiliations but we got knocked out by Juve (finalists that year), Roma was a massive L, Liverpool (winners that year), Bayern (winners that year) and PSG (finalists last season). There’s literally no defending Juve’s exits, really terrible, just read Juve forums.
 
MagIX

MagIX

Senior Member
Morten said:
Juventus made a big mistake getting rid of Allegri, maybe things were getting a bit stale toward the end, but still way better for Juve than the replacements.

Also i dont know Juventus finances, but judging by signings in recent years, it appears they couldnt really afford Ronaldo and build a team around him at the same time.

One have to wonder what the club was thinking signing a 33 year old that will cripple the finances.
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I agree, getting rid of Allegri was a big mistake.
 
Sorin

Sorin

Well-known member
It seems that the people in charge of Juventus had the same thought process as the Cronaldo fanboys that spouted left and right how he carried RM to 3 consecutive CLs. Some of them still haven't realized that not one player has won it alone, not even Maradona despite the overblown stories surounding his world cup win and everything.

Applies to some of our fans as well. They know who they are.
 
serghei

serghei

Senior Member
Vilarrubi said:
That?s the thing, Juve been dumped out of CL by Ajax, Lyon and Porto. Not downplaying our humiliations but we got knocked out by Juve (finalists that year), Roma was a massive L, Liverpool (winners that year), Bayern (winners that year) and PSG (finalists last season). There?s literally no defending Juve?s exits, really terrible, just read Juve forums.
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Roma is the only nonfinalist or champion that knocked us out from CL. And this goes back 15 years.

2006 champions
2007 eliminated by finalists
2008 eliminated by champions
2009 champions
2010 eliminated by champions
2011 champions
2012 eliminated by champions
2013 eliminated by champions
2014 eliminated by finalists
2015 champions
2016 eliminated by finalists
2017 eliminated by finalists
2018 eliminated by Roma EV recordbreaker
2019 eliminated by champions
2020 eliminated by champions
2021 Pending...
 
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