Ousmane Dembélé

[KingLeo10]

The examples you cited do not demonstrate 'football IQ'.

I cited 4 high level achievements in 4 separate instances. Football IQ is a component of high level achievements.

Unless you believe football IQ is merely ability on the ball, in which case we'd be reducing off the ball movement masters like CR7 to football idiots.

What is your definition of 'football IQ' then?

 

[Andrew M]

I cited 4 high level achievements in 4 separate instances. Football IQ is a component of high level achievements.

Unless you believe football IQ is merely ability on the ball, in which case we'd be reducing off the ball movement masters like CR7 to football idiots.

What is your definition of 'football IQ' then?

In Bale we're talking about a guy with incredible pace and physical ability. His skinning of Bartra in CDR was pure speed and power against a physically weak opponent. His overhead goal vs Liverpool was an illustration of athleticism and spontaneity. Without his athletic abilities what use is Bale on a football pitch?

Players like Pirlo, Scholes, Xavi, Lampard etc have high IQ.

 

[Havesaks]

In Bale we're talking about a guy with incredible pace and physical ability. His skinning of Bartra in CDR was pure speed and power against a physically weak opponent. His overhead goal vs Liverpool was an illustration of athleticism and spontaneity. Without his athletic abilities what use is Bale on a football pitch?

Players like Pirlo, Scholes, Xavi, Lampard etc have high IQ.

Exactly!

 

[KingLeo10]

In Bale we're talking about a guy with incredible pace and physical ability. His skinning of Bartra in CDR was pure speed and power against a physically weak opponent. His overhead goal vs Liverpool was an illustration of athleticism and spontaneity. Without his athletic abilities what use is Bale on a football pitch?

Players like Pirlo, Scholes, Xavi, Lampard etc have high IQ.

That's a very simplistic view IMO. Which is why I prefaced by giving CR7 as a counter example of where football IQ doesn't have to be the Pirlo, Scholes, or Xavi.

Football intelligence to me is making a difference at the highest level. Something Dembele hasn't managed to do more often than not when we needed him (this is why the comparison even began in the first place). Yes, Bale is exceptionally gifted physically but you still have to make the right runs/time those runs, recognize weaknesses/overloads before the defense adjusts and the like.

With regards to the CDR goal, he actually outfoxed Bartra by stepping out of bounds and catching him at an angle. He knew he had the speed advantage and maximized it. Hence, football IQ.

 

[KingLeo10]

[youtube]bCeQ6XjEftk[/youtube]

Sort of what I mean. Obviously, Bale is no CR7 but this is what I'm alluding to.

 

[Andrew M]

That's a very simplistic view IMO. Which is why I prefaced by giving CR7 as a counter example of where football IQ doesn't have to be the Pirlo, Scholes, or Xavi.

Football intelligence to me is making a difference at the highest level. Something Dembele hasn't managed to do more often than not when we needed him (this is why the comparison even began in the first place). Yes, Bale is exceptionally gifted physically but you still have to make the right runs/time those runs, recognize weaknesses/overloads before the defense adjusts and the like.

With regards to the CDR goal, he actually outfoxed Bartra by stepping out of bounds and catching him at an angle. He knew he had the speed advantage and maximized it. Hence, football IQ.

I definitely agree that CR7 is clearly intelligent. He's been naturally endowed with great athletic qualities yet as they decline he has adapted to rely on positioning, timing etc. So I'm not saying that no fast players can be smart.

But it seems our definition of football IQ is different. I don't necessarily equate being able to make the difference at the highest level (goals in this case) with football IQ. Some players just have more natural ability and so they can create something out of nothing and do magical things around the box or goal with their pace, quick touch, shot power, aim etc. The majority of the best thinkers in football have poorer athletic abilities in my opinion because they could never rely on pace etc to get them through their career.

A player like Lampard (he is known for having a very high IQ from tests at Chelsea) is a fine example because he has very little athletic qualities yet made the most of what he had by hard work and intelligence. Now he is doing well as a coach.

But Bale just doesn't strike me as that type of player who can adapt to diminishing athletic abilities. Without his pace he is pretty useless. Can you see him adapting to playing deeper like Messi or being a fox in the box like CR7? Or even coaching lol

Maybe that's why Messi and Ronaldo are so good as they have both intelligence and incredible ability, whereas many gifted players are pretty dumb

 

[Andresito]

'Football IQ' in particular is such a broad definition depending on how you use it. It's become a regular thing to say in here after BBZ used it to dumb down players very simplistically.

Football IQ consists of so many different things, some things that come to mind:
- Positioning (defenders and attackers being in the right place at the right time, think VvD, CR7, prime Busi)
- Vision (doing two things simultaneously: ex. controling the ball and looking for teammates in good positions)
- Decision making (having many alternatives but mostly choosing the right one)
- Awareness of your surroundings (thinking what you'll do before you or when a teammate receives the ball)
..are all part of a player's smartness on the field.

Now these abilities are totally irrelevant of how technical or physical a player is. You can know what to do and what the right decision is, but you lack the skill to execute it properly, for example when a teammate makes a good run but the pass isn't good enough. Could compare it to coaches, knowing what to do but can't do it themselves anymore.

It's probably better to use another definition/word when talking about a players football IQ, because there are probably as many ways to define football smartness as there are forum users in here.

 

[Laplacian]

'Football IQ' in particular is such a broad definition depending on how you use it. It's become a regular thing to say in here after BBZ used it to dumb down players very simplistically.

Football IQ consists of so many different things, some things that come to mind:
- Positioning (defenders and attackers being in the right place at the right time, think VvD, CR7, prime Busi)
- Vision (doing two things simultaneously: ex. controling the ball and looking for teammates in good positions)
- Decision making (having many alternatives but mostly choosing the right one)
- Awareness of your surroundings (thinking what you'll do before you or when a teammate receives the ball)
..are all part of a player's smartness on the field.

Now these abilities are totally irrelevant of how technical or physical a player is. You can know what to do and what the right decision is, but you lack the skill to execute it properly, for example when a teammate makes a good run but the pass isn't good enough. Could compare it to coaches, knowing what to do but can't do it themselves anymore.

It's probably better to use another definition/word when talking about a players football IQ, because there are probably as many ways to define football smartness as there are forum users in here.

Agreed, and if we're taking your definitions into consideration it's easy to see Dembele has some elements of football intelligence. He has the ability and vision to create things out of nowhere, but he does lack in positioning, awareness, and decision making. Honestly i think he's just in the wrong environment, all that talent he showed in Dortmund can't be just a fluke.

 

[Nucky]

Heard Dembouz is finally back, hope he gets some minutes tomorrow vs Leganes in Copa and let's hope he lasts at least a few games before gettin injured again. We all know he won't last very long but at least few matches so Fati gets some rest would be great.

 

[Devils]

Unbelievable composure.

Only a few days until we are back.

 

[jairzinho]

Heard Dembouz is finally back, hope he gets some minutes tomorrow vs Leganes in Copa and let's hope he lasts at least a few games before gettin injured again. We all know he won't last very long but at least few matches so Fati gets some rest would be great.

Lol. Hopefully his stay in Qatar did him some good.

 

[Kul_z]

God please, forgive the doubters because dembouz wont #nomercy

 

[vegitot]

when will he be injured again?

 

[Barcilliant]

Unbelievable composure.

Only a few days until we are back.

I'm a fan of his talent but his attitude and injuries are not helping him.

 

[Nucky]

Lol. Hopefully his stay in Qatar did him some good.

Maybe now he will last at least 5 matches before gettin injured again.