Champions League

[serghei]

There's a top 4 atm for me. Liverpool, Bayern, PSG, City. And even then, City's place in top 4 is sketchy considering they keep fucking up hilariously in CL against lower level teams.

Madrid, Dortmund, Spurs, Juventus, Barca, Leipzig, Atletico, Chelsea, are around the same level normally (bad form excluded).

 

[JamDav1982]

There's a top 4 atm for me. Liverpool, Bayern, PSG, City. And even then, City's place in top 4 is sketchy considering they keep fucking up hilariously in CL against lower level teams.

Madrid, Dortmund, Spurs, Juventus, Barca, Leipzig, Atletico, Chelsea, are around the same level normally (bad form excluded).

I wouldnt group PSG in with the other three but to claim Chelsea are 'nowhere near' that Juve side is not accurate for me.

Would rather Barca faced Juve over two legs than Chelsea.

 

[Yannik]

What have Spurs, Atletico and Dortmund done? Or those teams just being dropped now?

Yes they are logically dropped because I named 10 teams competing for 5 spots and we can both agree these teams are rather around 6-10 than 1-5 (which is the bar).
I don't understand what you are struggling with. Do I need to draw a logic matrix called "how to be top 5"?

 

[serghei]

I wouldnt group PSG in with the other three but to claim Chelsea are 'nowhere near' that Juve side is not accurate for me.

Would rather Barca faced Juve over two legs than Chelsea.

Depends on what you base it on. Achievement wise in CL, Chelsea's been pretty bad for many years (even had a couple of seasons they didn't even play CL football IIRC). Visually, if you look at Chelsea games, they are on the way up, and paying some of the best football in EPL.

Barca and Juve are in the same pool imo, if both are full strength, with no injuries. I might even give us an edge.

PSG are third. They slack off because they are star-driven and it goes with the territory, but when they need to focus, they usually play well and sort it out. I wouldn't be surprised to see them making the final again.

Bayern vs Liverpool is the match-up I wanna see in two legs. Last time they've met Bayern wasn't the finished product.

 

[JamDav1982]

Yes they are logically dropped because I named 10 teams competing for 5 spots and we can both agree are rather 6-10 than 1-5 (which is the bar).
I don't understand what you are struggling with. Do I need to draw a logic matrix called "how to be top 5"?

You claim Chelsea are 'nowhere near' Juve in top 5.

Juve are not a good side and would have Chelsea on par with them if not better.

Which teams are nearer to top 5 than Chelsea? Or are all these teams like Atletico, Dortmund, Chelsea etc all miles off Juve?

 

[JamDav1982]

Depends on what you base it on. Achievement wise in CL, Chelsea's been pretty bad for many years (even had a couple of seasons they didn't even play CL football IIRC). Visually, if you look at Chelsea games, they are on the way up, and paying some of the best football in EPL.

Barca and Juve are in the same pool imo, if both are full strenght.

I am basing it on the teams as they are now. Dont really care about the history in CL of largely different sides for most of the teams discussed.

 

[serghei]

I am basing it on the teams as they are now. Dont really care about the history in CL of largely different sides for most of the teams discussed.

Yea, but if you look at us these days, outplayed by Cadiz, we're not even in top 15, but a lot can change in some months. Hard to judge where Juve is currently. Very inconsistent.

 

[FinBarcelonafan]

There's a top 4 atm for me. Liverpool, Bayern, PSG, City. And even then, City's place in top 4 is sketchy considering they keep fucking up hilariously in CL against lower level teams.

Madrid, Dortmund, Spurs, Juventus, Barca, Leipzig, Atletico, Chelsea, are around the same level normally (bad form excluded).

I would rate them this: (more tiers)

1. Bayern and Liverpool
2. City and PSG
3. Others
4. Lazio, Monchenglacha yada yada.

 

[Yannik]

You claim Chelsea are 'nowhere near' Juve in top 5.

Really? Can I have the "nowhere near" part quoted?
But yes, I do consider Juventus to be better than Chelsea.

I would rate them this:

1. Bayern and Liverpool
2. City and PSG
3. Others
4. Lazio, Monchenglacha yada yada.

Well while we are at it. My personal Tier List:

Tier S: 1-2. Bayern, Liverpool
Tier A+: 3-4. City, PSG
Tier A: 5-6. Madrid, Juventus
Tier B: 7-13. Atletico, Tottenham, Milan, Chelsea, Dortmund, Leipzig
Tier C: 14-X. Rest
Tier stop fucking frustrating me every week: Hannover 96

Milan obviously not part of the "who wins CL" discussion, but I consider them top 13 strengthwise regardless.

 

[serghei]

Well while we are at it. My personal Tier List:

Tier S: 1-2. Bayern, Liverpool
Tier A+: 3-4. City, PSG
Tier A: 5-6. Madrid, Juventus
Tier B: 7-13. Atletico, Tottenham, Milan, Chelsea, Dortmund, Leipzig
Tier C: 14-X. Rest
Tier stop fucking frustrating me every week: Hannover 96

Milan obviously not part of the "who wins CL" discussion, but I consider them top 13 strengthwise regardless.

Where is Barca ?

 

[Yannik]

Where is Barca ?

Nah seriously, Tier B would actually be fine.
Big teams can be in shit form, yet always find ways.

 

[JamDav1982]

Really? Can I have the "nowhere near" part quoted?
But yes, I do consider Juventus to be better than Chelsea.

'Not anywhere' not 'nowhere near' but exact same meaning...unless means something else?

Yes they are improved, no question, being consistent vs 10-20 teams is great and the defensive record is a big upgrade.
But they are not anywhere a top 5 side is my point, and they are a different team facing Sheffield & co. than facing a big team.

 

[Yannik]

'Not anywhere near' not 'nowhere near' but exact same meaning.

Yes they are improved, no question, being consistent vs 10-20 teams is great and the defensive record is a big upgrade.
But they are not anywhere a top 5 side is my point, and they are a different team facing Sheffield & co. than facing a big team.

You then said Juve is a top 5 side.... so Chelsea 'not anywhere near' Juve is the claim.

I said Juve is a top 6 side. I named 6 teams including Juve which are uncontroversial picks for a top 5, leaving you to decide who you rank 1-5 and which one is just missing out.
For me either one of Madrid or Juve complete the top 5. That means the respective other 6th placed team is "near" the top 5.

But everyone that comes after that are a full Tier below, and thus I don't see them "near" the top 5 right now.

 

[BarcaOG]

Can't believe so many people bought that troll

you got me mate

 

[JamDav1982]

I said Juve is a top 6 side. Either one of Madrid or Juve for me complete the top 5.
That means the respective other 6th placed team is "near" the top 5, but everyone that comes after that is an absolute Tier below and not "near" the top 5 right now.

Agree to disagree then. Lets see how Chelsea do compared to those teams in EPL and in CL.