Sergi Samper

[Messi983]

You are talking about starting potential and I agree that Samper is not on that level yet and possibly will never be a starter here. But we need good (and possibly cheap) backups too and I think Samper can develop into that when he gets more La Liga experience which will hopefully happen this season. From what we know Lucho sees him only as DM so I also won't consider him as CM (until Lucho is our manager or if he won't start to use him there often) but if Xavi or another manager takes over in the next year or two he could also easily use Samper more as CM. We can probably all agree that no player in the world could come in and take over Busquets spot for the next 4-5 years so I don't think we should expect Samper to do that to justify him staying here.

Only problem for Samper could be if Lucho continues to play Gomes as DM this season (which he probably will) and he develops really good there so Lucho will decide that he don't need Samper to return next season. But I believe Gomes was brought as competition and possible longterm replacement for Rakitić and/or Iniesta (I'm still not sure which will be his best position as he has skill sets to play both but we have time to find that out). His versatility will only help him to get more playing time like it helped Roberto last year until he finally established himself as starter at one position.

 

[MessiDinho10]

So, Paco Jemez sacked...

 

[navidjaan]

4-5 levels above everyone in Barca B?!?! Jesus...what a statement!
Yes he is even a little bit better than Busquets...at least 1 level
He wasn't even dominant in the game against Villanovense!

Huh? Is Busquets a B player now? And what's more legitimate here: arguing with one game or 3 seasons? And no, he wasn't "dominant" vs Villanovense, but he was great away against Leverkusen. But whatever fits your agenda.

 

[Raketa10]

For guys who believe in Samper, for comparison, our starter La Masia midfielders:
By the age of 22, Xavi had 4 seasons of playing as a starter, he was a key player in youth NT teams, plus when he played for A team he was very good RIGHT AWAY.
3/3 factors, let's say.
Iniesta, more or less the same.
Busi, the same.

Samper isn't a starter here aged 22.
He isn't a key player or one of the best youth midfielders in the world on that level and when he plays for Barca, he is far from good, he actually looks clumsy, lost and not good enough.

Yes, in Xavi's era those were different times, but still.
Some will reply: no one can get to Xavi-Iniesta's level.
True, but that doesn't mean that Barca will play with average midfielders either.
If we won't be able to produce new Xavis or Iniestas, we will just go out and buy 3-4 new players like Andre Gomes, Pogba, Gundogan and similar.

Currently it seems that Samper won't reach Xavi-Iniesta level surely.
Plus, he also won't reach a level of Andre Gomes and similar players (he is 22 also).
Unless he improve a looot in upcoming 1-2-3 years, that's it for him at Barca's jersey.

Barca as a club needs a level of Xavi-Iniesta-Busi for our starting midfielders.
If we can't produce new players of that level, we will buy players of a similar quality or of a quality somewhat close to theirs.

There is not much room left for emotions and playing good (but not good enough for Barca's standards) La Masia players just because they are our products and because they are devoted to a club.

I agree 100%!

 

[BarçaBarça]

So, Paco Jemez sacked...

Yes, that is not great news for him. I hope he will manage to get into the team, he really needs experience right now, if he doesn't play a lot I fear that Lucho might let him go.
The big breakthrough hasn't come yet, but he hasn't been trusted by Lucho - and when Gumbao plays before you it is hard to really prove yourself.

Of course it is not certain that a natural talent will make it at senior-level, but I really hope that Samper does (although it might be La Masia romanticism).

 

[God Serena]

Oh, shit.

Recall Samper and just let him be a sub here.

 

[khaled_a_d]

Way too early in the season to judge Samper experience,don't like Paco firing for him but the team isn't the best he surely can be starter there with any coach with hard work.
Time will tell

as he's on loan, which is usually reserved for those who are indeed almost ready.

hmm,loan are for those we hope can improve to be ready or those we can't get rid of them (Tello/Song) not for almost ready.

If you think he hasn't improved with the B team in the past two years you're basically saying he's as good now as he was with Juvenil A, which... Lol.

He left Juvenil A three years ago actually. Had lots of up and downs through them. Would say there was times of improvements and others where he stagnated

He should've been promoted back in the summer of 2014. Could've been competing with Busquets by now.

There is a chance it could have happened,but I would say there was bigger chance he followed Sandro. He was nowhere ready in 2015 or 2014.
There was a time when he lost his place for the likes of Gumbau & Patric in 14/15 season and even early in last season with Lucho.

Currently it seems that Samper won't reach Xavi-Iniesta level surely.
Plus, he also won't reach a level of Andre Gomes and similar players (he is 22 also).
Unless he improve a looot in upcoming 1-2-3 years, that's it for him at Barca's jersey.

Barca as a club needs a level of Xavi-Iniesta-Busi for our starting midfielders.
If we can't produce new players of that level, we will buy players of a similar quality or of a quality somewhat close to theirs.

He is a year and half younger than Gomes.
And we are a team who pays 15-30M for back up players. If Samper can turn good enough to be back up for us it is a success for both the club and him.

 

[navidjaan]

He was nowhere ready in 2015 or 2014.
There was a time when he lost his place for the likes of Gumbau & Patric in 14/15 season and even early in last season with Lucho.

That's just not true. Patric never played DM, he only played CM towards the end of the season under Vinyals, who played Palencia at RB, where Samper played every game. Yes, Eusebio did play Gumbau at DM ahead of Samper for a couple of games, but that was just one small period in the entire season where Samper was arguably one of the best players in the league at times when he was just scary good. Under any circumstances, he (and Grimaldo) should've been promoted that following summer. Especially when we still had to deal with the transfer ban and lacked midfielders (besides Samper, Grimaldo can also play there) and a full back, before.

There was once a time when even average players were promoted to the first team (Roberto, who is now a massive succes), but at a time where it was needed, the best two talents of an entire La Masia generation weren't promoted because they relegated with their team, despite being the two best and leading players on the team.

 

[navidjaan]

I'm just going to ask this question: would Lucho have promoted Roberto after we sold Thiago back in 2013? He has a serious issue in this area and it could be fatal for the next big talents coming up, Aleñá being the next. Lucho already favors Marlon (ahead of Tarin whom he loves to ignore), but, of course, he isn't from La Masia.

 

[khaled_a_d]

That's just not true. Patric never played DM, he only played CM towards the end of the season under Vinyals, who played Palencia at RB, where Samper played every game. Yes, Eusebio did play Gumbau at DM ahead of Samper for a couple of games, but that was just one small period in the entire season where Samper was arguably one of the best players in the league at times when he was just scary good. Under any circumstances, he (and Grimaldo) should've been promoted that following summer. Especially when we still had to deal with the transfer ban and lacked midfielders (besides Samper, Grimaldo can also play there) and a full back, before.

There was once a time when even average players were promoted to the first team (Roberto, who is now a massive succes), but at a time where it was needed, the best two talents of an entire La Masia generation weren't promoted because they relegated with their team, despite being the two best and leading players on the team.

I am not sure if you are having a memory loss or twisting facts,Samper was dropped for a period of time under Vinyals for a midfield trio of Patric(DM) Gumbau(CM) & Halilovic (AM) and initially there were actual an improvement of form after dropping Samper then we continued to be shit.
http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/sergi-samper/leistungsdaten/spieler/181112/plus/0?saison=2014
It was in April,4 consecutive games with no starts.
And Samper wasn't by any mean one of the best players in the league in 14/15 ,he was playing his worst football at the second half of that year. showing his weaknesses and it was the time when many (including me) was 1st to to doubt him after being considered the sure thing. And in general the whole team was shit.we were the worst team in the league.
Samper was good at his 1st season,and rebounded last season. but that 14/15 season put red flags.
And let's remember that Roberto was never considered average by Lucho,Lucho (whom many tend to forget that he is one of Barca B best ever coaches) was his coach for couple of years and he knew what is his qualities. surely he can know what Samper qualities too and he called him ton of times with 1st team.
Lucho made a mistake when he called someone like Sandro too early and he was also needed during the ban,but that was h

 

[khaled_a_d]

I'm just going to ask this question: would Lucho have promoted Roberto after we sold Thiago back in 2013? He has a serious issue in this area and it could be fatal for the next big talents coming up, Aleñá being the next. Lucho already favors Marlon (ahead of Tarin whom he loves to ignore), but, of course, he isn't from La Masia.

For sure,he was one of his favorites in Barca B and the decision to promote him in was political anyway. Not like Tito or Tata liked Roberto in the 1st place
And Lucho has brought Rafinha,Denis,Munir,Sandro to 1st team.
And there is yet a La Masia kid that has proved Lucho wrong,may be Grimaldo would be able to do that soon but still too early.
At the end,may be we are just overrating our own prospects?
One more thing,Barca 1st team coach should treat everyone who is connected to this club same way and based on merits. He should never by any mean has any favor of Tarin over Marlon b/c one is La Masia graduate and the other isn't. Nor he should favor Rafinha over Denis for same reason. For him they are all Barca players/prospects

 

[Messi983]

Don't know what Granada are doing. They should know the way Paco Jemez works when they hired him. They got him a bunch of 20 yo kids and 6 new signings on last day of transfer window (some of them like Carcela and Bueno are looking good) and they expected to have immediate results.

We'll see who their new coach will be and how Samper will do under him but maybe it would be good to return Samper in January if possible.

 

[khaled_a_d]

Don't know what Granada are doing. They should know the way Paco Jemez works when they hired him. They got him a bunch of 20 yo kids and 6 new signings on last day of transfer window (some of them like Carcela and Bueno are looking good) and they expected to have immediate results.

We'll see who their new coach will be and how Samper will do under him but maybe it would be good to return Samper in January if possible.

Granada isn't full of quality tbh,a young team with many loaned player.
If Samper is anywhere near as good for us then he should still getting a starting spot their.while yes they may not operate the best system for him but he should at least get Liga experience.
Only way I would bring him back is either they are running a totally different system that doesn't fit him or he failed to convince a new coach and in that case it should be loaning him to another club most probably. Doubt he will get a chance returning with the team in 2nd half of the season when Lucho actually decrease his rotation.
Anyway,way too early and it is just pure speculation.he was just their for a month and injured through it.still has 3 months tell January.
Think he will prove himself useful for them.

 

[Robbie]

If he barely plays this season, then his Barca career is over. It's harsh, but all clubs are cutthroat these days when it comes to decisions like that.

 

[Alarcón]

That's just not true. Patric never played DM, he only played CM towards the end of the season under Vinyals, who played Palencia at RB, where Samper played every game. Yes, Eusebio did play Gumbau at DM ahead of Samper for a couple of games, but that was just one small period in the entire season where Samper was arguably one of the best players in the league at times when he was just scary good. Under any circumstances, he (and Grimaldo) should've been promoted that following summer. Especially when we still had to deal with the transfer ban and lacked midfielders (besides Samper, Grimaldo can also play there) and a full back, before.

There was once a time when even average players were promoted to the first team (Roberto, who is now a massive succes), but at a time where it was needed, the best two talents of an entire La Masia generation weren't promoted because they relegated with their team, despite being the two best and leading players on the team.

It's easier to promote average players and let them rot on the bench because they accept it and you don't care if they don't progress. Samper can't afford to get Roberto minutes for years to come before finally stepping in Busquets' shoes, because then he won't be good enough. Thiago was promoted early, didn't get enough playing time for his liking as he had the then 2 best midfielders in the world ahead of him, and left. He was too good to be on the bench, and not good enough to be a starter. Same way Samper is not good enough to replace Busquets. Letting him get playing time at a smaller club is the logical thing to do.