Malcom

[RMU ReBorn]

Xavi being votes at the best player in Euro 2008 doesn't mean he was considered the best midfielder in the world, like Iniesta. Actually Xavi said he wanted to leave Barca because Rijkaard and the media wanted a more physical midfield.

Messi wasn't considered the best player in the world before Pep arrived and never scored 40 goals like he did in 2009.

Simeone didn't want to sell Turan, Turan asked to leave Atletico because he said he was too lazy to run like an Atletico player does.

Xavi and Iniesta were peaking and already proven themselves at international stage before Pep arrived . It's not even remotely close to what Simeone had when he took over . Messi wasn't worlds best , but everyone knew what he was capable off . That's why Juve was after him during 2005 season . They all peaked in during Pep's era . He deserves credit for providing a system for them to unleash , but noway it can be compared to the challenges that simeone had during his initial phase and the way he transformed Atleti . Along with talents like Messi -Xavi - Iniesta , Pep had a big signing every season be it Zlatan or Villa . How many of such transfers happened under simeone ? ...

 

[BBZ8800]

What about the 90M they spent on Vinicius and Rodrygo??

I thought that we are talking about buying young players (aged 24, lol) who made it at Real/Barca, not about just buying young players.
Whether Vinicius and Rodrygo have made it, we'll know the answer around 2024'

 

[Devils]

[youtube]rXRNQdfT5VI[/youtube]

Unreal player.

 

[xXKonan]

Kinda crazy we paid 4 million less for Malcom than Real did for Vinicius Jr and Rodygo, who both are teenagers and haven't played in Europe yet.

 

[Joan]

fair enough but what would Pep need to do in your eyes to equal Simeone? maybe a CL final or actually win it?

anyways i guess we shouldn't go offtopic anymore

Seems nobody planning to stop so why not...

What Pep did here was amazing, still is, but in City he still has to prove himself.

Needs to do well with the team for some years, actually play good vs. serious competition in the CL, reach the final. Etc. But I have huge respect for what Simeone has done, can't compete with it in one season.

 

[Stoichkov1]

Xavi and Iniesta were peaking and already proven themselves at international stage before Pep arrived . It's not even remotely close to what Simeone had when he took over . Messi wasn't worlds best , but everyone knew what he was capable off . That's why Juve was after him during 2005 season . They all peaked in during Pep's era . He deserves credit for providing a system for them to unleash , but noway it can be compared to the challenges that simeone had during his initial phase and the way he transformed Atleti . Along with talents like Messi -Xavi - Iniesta , Pep had a big signing every season be it Zlatan or Villa . How many of such transfers happened under simeone ? ...

Well if we want to be honest Atletico already won an Europa League without Simeone in 2010.

He also had players like Falcao and Courtois who were already proven before he arrived. Falcao basically won the EL single-handedly for them.

 

[RMU ReBorn]

Well if we want to be honest Atletico already won an Europa League without Simeone in 2010.

He also had players like Falcao and Courtois who were already proven before he arrived. Falcao basically won the EL single-handedly for them.

Hell , Europa isn't Simeone's biggest achievement in his profile . Atletico used to get beaten heavily by Rm in derbys . Since Simeone took over rivalry took a completely different turn . Falcao wasn't even part of their La liga win or Cl final campaign . And he played another Cl without Falcao and developing another beast of a Gk in Oblack who has been better than Courtois for Atm . You are arguing with Falcao and Courtois as examples to counter my argument of Pep having Messi , Xavi , Iniesta ,puyol at his disposal ? . Ha ha
Simeone's La liga win tops everything that Pep has done with City and Bayern . Haven't even mentioned two Cl final appearances which Pep hasn't managed to reach without Xavi , Messi and Iniesta

 

[Stoichkov1]

Hell , Europa isn't Simeone's biggest achievement in his profile . Atletico used to get beaten heavily by Rm in derbys . Since Simeone took over rivalry took a completely different turn . Falcao wasn't even part of their La liga win or Cl final campaign . And he played another Cl without Falcao and developing another beast of a Gk in Oblack who has been better than Courtois for Atm . You are arguing with Falcao and Courtois as examples to counter my argument of Pep having Messi , Xavi , Iniesta ,puyol at his disposal ? . Ha ha
Simeone's La liga win tops everything that Pep has done with City and Bayern . Haven't even mentioned two Cl final appearances which Pep hasn't managed to reach without Xavi , Messi and Iniesta

Falcao wasn't part of their la liga win but Atletico bought Diego Costa to replace him. Diego Costa was unproven but he was considered the revelation player by Sid Lowe in 2012 for example.

Simeone developed him but Costa was actually a good player before he joined Atletico.

Pep worked with better players as I said many times but the type of football Simeone and Pep teams play is completely different. Ofc for the brand of football Pep wants to play he needs more technically gifted players.

I said that I don't care much about what the coaches do in the CL as it's mostly about luck and referee decisions. If Muller didn't miss a penalty in 2016 the CL final would have been Real-Bayern.

 

[Donatello]

I thought that we are talking about buying young players (aged 24, lol) who made it at Real/Barca, not about just buying young players.
Whether Vinicius and Rodrygo have made it, we'll know the answer around 2024'

You're willing to give six seasons to Vinicius and five to Rodrygo (by that time they will be around 23) to prove their worth.

But, when it comes to Dembele ppl want him to start delivering right off the bat,despite him coming here at 20.

And pls don't bring the price tag here, its irrelevant to when players reach peak.

 

[RMU ReBorn]

Falcao wasn't part of their la liga win but Atletico bought Diego Costa to replace him. Diego Costa was unproven but he was considered the revelation player by Sid Lowe in 2012 for example.

Simeone developed him but Costa was actually a good player before he joined Atletico.

Pep worked with better players as I said many times but the type of football Simeone and Pep teams play is completely different. Ofc for the brand of football Pep wants to play he needs more technically gifted players.

I said that I don't care much about what the coaches do in the CL as it's mostly about luck and referee decisions. If Muller didn't miss a penalty in 2016 the CL final would have been Real-Bayern.

There is no ifs and buts . what Simeone achieved is part of history . You can't change that no matter what . What a lame logic mate . If Refree was good enough to give one penalty to chelsea in 2009 we wouldn't have won the cl .

From one point to another you are moving the goal post to suit your theorys . From the players that Both had to playing style , now what ? . Don't care about what purists think . At the end of the day winning a La liga over Barca and real shits on everything that pep has done at City and Bayern . Period

Costa was a proven talent ? How far can you go to defend pep ? . Costa was proven , Courtois was world class and then Pep pulled out rabbit from the hat with Messi , xavi and Iniesta . Enough of this . Move one

 

[footyfan]

Even Ev played great football in La liga , i don't think he was all negative as the majority of this forum is dispersing him off . Van Gaal is criticized for the way he treated Rivaldo and Riquelmi and even said once that 'Pique will never make it big' .

I thought this was the most boring Barca I've ever seen in my life, even in La liga. The football under EV was nowhere close to great aesthetically.

What has Pep done with Bayern and City that was is so amazing? I'm not impressed at all by teams dominating their leagues with the biggest budgets

With City this season - playing some of the most, if not the most, gorgeous football the Premier League has seen and accumulating 100 points with this football.

Stripping the beauty of football away from the teams and looking at it only in terms of results does Pep a disservice.

 

[ZerkerXror]

Your avatar gives me the heebie jeebies.

Henry looks like Neymar.

I'm hoping that's a good thing homie.
I made it my avatar cause I loved seeing these three play together, even though it didn't last that long

 

[Stoichkov1]

There is no ifs and buts . what Simeone achieved is part of history . You can't change that no matter what . What a lame logic mate . If Refree was good enough to give one penalty to chelsea in 2009 we wouldn't have won the cl .

From one point to another you are moving the goal post to suit your theorys . From the players that Both had to playing style , now what ? . Don't care about what purists think . At the end of the day winning a La liga over Barca and real shits on everything that pep has done at City and Bayern . Period

Costa was a proven talent ? How far can you go to defend pep ? . Costa was proven , Courtois was world class and then Pep pulled out rabbit from the hat with Messi , xavi and Iniesta . Enough of this . Move one

The first sentence confirms what I think about the CL. In 2009 we eliminated Chelsea with the only shot on target we had over two legs and in 2012 we were knocked out after one of the most one sided matches in CL history. Zidane will probably win the best coach award after being outplayed by Juve, Bayern and Liverpool before Ramos decided to injure Salah. A coach's quality isn't judged on a tournament where referee decisions and luck play a big part but on a competition where the team plays 38 matches.

You just mentioned in your post a point I've never made. I've never said that what Pep has done at City eclipses what Simeone has done at Atletico, I said that Simeone Atletico doesn't outshine what Pep did at Barca and City.

 

[RMU ReBorn]

I thought this was the most boring Barca I've ever seen in my life, even in La liga. The football under EV was nowhere close to great aesthetically.



With City this season - playing some of the most, if not the most, gorgeous football the Premier League has seen and accumulating 100 points with this football.

Stripping the beauty of football away from the teams and looking at it only in terms of results does Pep a disservice.

Term 'boring ' in football is subjective . Many finds Barca's tiki taka boring . Some finds counter attacking football entertaining compared to the brand of football under Pep . So yeah may be you would have found Ev boring for Barca but not for me . Pep's Barca played entertaining football but there were instances were they played painful football by just passing it to each other with no intent

 

[RMU ReBorn]

The first sentence confirms what I think about the CL. In 2009 we eliminated Chelsea with the only shot on target we had over two legs and in 2012 we were knocked out after one of the most one sided matches in CL history. Zidane will probably win the best coach award after being outplayed by Juve, Bayern and Liverpool before Ramos decided to injure Salah. A coach's quality isn't judged on a tournament where referee decisions and luck play a big part but on a competition when the team plays 38 matches.

You just mentioned in your post a point I've never made. I've never said that what Pep has done at City eclipses what Simeone has done at Atletico, I said that Simeone Atletico doesn't outshine what Pep did at Barca and City.

Well , what does outshine means in your book . Playing attacking football ? Then what the heck are we debating. I have been explaining for hours that, what Simeone achieved i repeat achieved is much above everything that Pep has done with city and Bayern . I don't have to take in to account two Cl finals that simeone reached . Just La liga title with a inferior squad compared to Bayern and city is enough to put Simeone's achievement over Pep's projects in City and Bayern . It's 5:00 am here in India , and i haven't slept yet . If you are still gonna repeat the same ,please i don't want a reply for this post