DonAK
President of FC Barcelona
Yeah, although it's a low-risk arena for experimenting with different tactics and roles. I think he'll take over a Spanish team next year.
Ernesto Valverde
- Thread starter Messigician
- Start date
Yeah, although it's a low-risk arena for experimenting with different tactics and roles. I think he'll take over a Spanish team next year.
BBZ8800
Senior Member
Xavi has a few red flags, but maybe he will learn.
1. He said that Samper will be his successor
2. He said that Jean Michel Sari is the right player for us
3. This summer he said, if he were a coach, Puig would be a starter today, lol
4. Also, those comments when he was a player how when we lost but had lots of possession.
I have some fears that Xavi is stuck in 2009'.
And that he would play Spanish 460 or 451 with a false 9 and 80% of sterile, slow possession.
I am not sure what he thinks about modern football tendencies and faster and more direct football.
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KingLeo10
Senior Member
A lot of people are remembering Xavi's later years and forgetting how dynamic he was in his prime.
If you watch his absolute peak, this dude was a midfield dynamo. 13 km every game, incisive passes and completely attacking mindset.
30+ assists in 08-09, ~10 goals, 4 assists in the 6-2 v RM at Bernabeu.
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DonAK
President of FC Barcelona
Not sure why Xavi saying dumb shit is brought up as an argument against him while you've had Pep say a lot of crazy stuff for years. Who can forget him saying he want 1000s of Dantes in his team.
What Xavi says about a player that's linked to Barcelona or a youth player doesn't say anything about him as a potential manager.
What Xavi says about a player that's linked to Barcelona or a youth player doesn't say anything about him as a potential manager.
Leo_Messi
New member
[MENTION=16942]BBZ8800[/MENTION]
That is not Xavi "saying dumb" things in public that is merely the Xavi of old that is always going to publicly praise local canteranos. That and most of our signings btw. I expected you to know this already seeing that you are one of the older fans here who will remember that part of Xavi very well. He says the same things about the national team BTW.
It should not be taken at face value every single time. After all he was in their boat once and had the experience of almost leaving (despite not wanting) due to neglect of the scandalous Gaspart board.
The important thing is that Xavi ticks a lot of the same boxes that Pep did (Lucho as well) and that he is a truthful follower of the Barça sporting model which cannot be underestimated after 9 years of neglect of our essentials as a club by the current useless board. Nothing close to Malmierda which the current board and the local media tried to sell as some kind of Cruyff disciple as well.
I will take the likes of Xavi over any half-proven outsider that has no or little clue about what it means to manage Barça, no clue about La Liga, cannot speak a word of Spanish and is more likely to flop than succeed.
Either go after elite coaches with proven track records or stick to people with a club relation who know what they are going into. The other options are too risky IMO.
Let's make a simple example. Do you think that an unproven (managerial wise) Xavi will do better or some experienced above average manager coming from abroad from say Italy, France, Germany, England or South America?
I know who I would be inclined to pick at first glance, that is for sure. And who I would have the greater confidence in terms of implementing the Cruyff sporting model on the field. Xavi is that man for sure. Whether he would succeed is unknown for any one of us until he gets such an opportunity to prove himself or the opposite.
That is not Xavi "saying dumb" things in public that is merely the Xavi of old that is always going to publicly praise local canteranos. That and most of our signings btw. I expected you to know this already seeing that you are one of the older fans here who will remember that part of Xavi very well. He says the same things about the national team BTW.
It should not be taken at face value every single time. After all he was in their boat once and had the experience of almost leaving (despite not wanting) due to neglect of the scandalous Gaspart board.
The important thing is that Xavi ticks a lot of the same boxes that Pep did (Lucho as well) and that he is a truthful follower of the Barça sporting model which cannot be underestimated after 9 years of neglect of our essentials as a club by the current useless board. Nothing close to Malmierda which the current board and the local media tried to sell as some kind of Cruyff disciple as well.
I will take the likes of Xavi over any half-proven outsider that has no or little clue about what it means to manage Barça, no clue about La Liga, cannot speak a word of Spanish and is more likely to flop than succeed.
Either go after elite coaches with proven track records or stick to people with a club relation who know what they are going into. The other options are too risky IMO.
Let's make a simple example. Do you think that an unproven (managerial wise) Xavi will do better or some experienced above average manager coming from abroad from say Italy, France, Germany, England or South America?
I know who I would be inclined to pick at first glance, that is for sure. And who I would have the greater confidence in terms of implementing the Cruyff sporting model on the field. Xavi is that man for sure. Whether he would succeed is unknown for any one of us until he gets such an opportunity to prove himself or the opposite.
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BBZ8800
Senior Member
Ok, regarding his comments then.
Regarding him as a coach, I have a feeling that some of you would hire him tomorrow.
Can we wait at least a single season of his experience, at least in Barca B or something?
We struck gold with Pep.
True.
Lucho was so-so.
But even then, you have to take into an account that we had Messi.
Even EV without MSN won 2 La Ligas.
So, it is hard to tell how good Lucho was and how much importance Messi alone or MSN had.
So my point is: if someone says that our last 2 coaches without experience were awesome, not true.
Out of 36 Months, Lucho's team was in a downfall for 24 Months.
First 6 Months in 2014/15.
Last 6 Months in 2015/16 when we lost 10 points advantage in La Liga.
And the whole 2016/17 when we couldn't string 3 La liga victories in a row in the first 30 rounds iirc.
So, EV sucks.
But Lucho wasn't too great either when you remove Messi's impact.
So, maybe we should aim a little higher than Lucho and EV and wait until Xavi achieves anything in his career.
I can see a new trend:
Let's try Xavi.
If he fails.
Ok, let's try Valdes now. He is motivated also.
If he fails...
Puyol sounds motivated.
Or, oh, look Iniesta wcould get a chance.
I have some fears that in the next 10-20 years, we will give a chance to too many unproven coaches from a former golden 2008-2012 generation.
I just hope that Messi won't try to be a coach also.
Since nobody could say no to him as a coach.
Imo, you are giving too much credits to former legendary players just because they were legendary players.
I don't see leadership abilities in Xavi for now. Pep had them even on a field. He was always yelling and gesturing to everyone.
Xavi and co are a bunch of the most quiet and nicest people ever.
Lucho is a leader but lacks tactical knowledge.
Can you guys name one extremely soft and quiet guy who turned into a world class coach?
That is how I see Xavi as a teacher.
Regarding him as a coach, I have a feeling that some of you would hire him tomorrow.
Can we wait at least a single season of his experience, at least in Barca B or something?
We struck gold with Pep.
True.
Lucho was so-so.
But even then, you have to take into an account that we had Messi.
Even EV without MSN won 2 La Ligas.
So, it is hard to tell how good Lucho was and how much importance Messi alone or MSN had.
So my point is: if someone says that our last 2 coaches without experience were awesome, not true.
Out of 36 Months, Lucho's team was in a downfall for 24 Months.
First 6 Months in 2014/15.
Last 6 Months in 2015/16 when we lost 10 points advantage in La Liga.
And the whole 2016/17 when we couldn't string 3 La liga victories in a row in the first 30 rounds iirc.
So, EV sucks.
But Lucho wasn't too great either when you remove Messi's impact.
So, maybe we should aim a little higher than Lucho and EV and wait until Xavi achieves anything in his career.
I can see a new trend:
Let's try Xavi.
If he fails.
Ok, let's try Valdes now. He is motivated also.
If he fails...
Puyol sounds motivated.
Or, oh, look Iniesta wcould get a chance.
I have some fears that in the next 10-20 years, we will give a chance to too many unproven coaches from a former golden 2008-2012 generation.
I just hope that Messi won't try to be a coach also.
Since nobody could say no to him as a coach.
Imo, you are giving too much credits to former legendary players just because they were legendary players.
I don't see leadership abilities in Xavi for now. Pep had them even on a field. He was always yelling and gesturing to everyone.
Xavi and co are a bunch of the most quiet and nicest people ever.
Lucho is a leader but lacks tactical knowledge.
Can you guys name one extremely soft and quiet guy who turned into a world class coach?
That is how I see Xavi as a teacher.
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EdmondDantes
New member
Nuno Espirito Santo is proving to be a great coach/manager at Wolves - and he's only getting started.
BBZ8800
Senior Member
By a great coach, I mean winning CLs, World cups or at least league titles.
Not overachieving with ending 12th with a team who should have ended 18th.
xXKonan
Senior Member
Valdes has a pretty good tactical plan in place and not only that he seems to have that Ironfisted personality in the vein of someone like Lucho.
This is what the current team really needs right now, someone that has a real plan and someone that has a tough personality to keep egos in check and help players to develop. Not talking about Mou levels of douchebaggery but someone that can show some tough love.
This is what the current team really needs right now, someone that has a real plan and someone that has a tough personality to keep egos in check and help players to develop. Not talking about Mou levels of douchebaggery but someone that can show some tough love.
Messigician
Senior Member
I reckon Wenger could do a good job here tbh.
BBZ8800
Senior Member
I haven't read it till now.
Can you tell me more about his tactical plan?
I am quite cautious about a tactical plan of a guy who never made a forward pass or had to break a bus or escape a pressure with a great movement.
So, his knowledge comes down to a teoretical and not practical knowledge.
Look, guys like Rijkaard and Pep played football as midfielders, won CLs and Euros as midfielders.
And then, they were coached and learned from Van Gaal and Crujff himself.
Rijkaard coached a Dutch NT before Barca.
Pep was one of a kind.
Other masterminds like Mourinho or Ten Haag learned as assistants for years.
And then you have Valdes.
Never played as a midfielder, never played in build up and movement, never coached anyone and never worked as an assistant for a famous coach where he could have learned.
Sorry if I am sceptical about his tactical ideas.
Some will reply: everything is better than EV.
Well, with Valdes, there is a high chance that we will break that myth very fast.
EdmondDantes
New member
Your statement was too ambiguous then because you can be a great coach whilst managing a smaller side with smaller aspirations. Especially at the start of one's career like Nuno.
JohnN
Senior Member
I disagree that we need a "proven veteran coach" as much as I disagree we need an "inexperienced former legend coach" per se. Both options would fail without a sporting project. Without a plan, be it short or long term.
It all depends on your viewpoint, and this is mine:
A "proven veteran coach" at this point would be useful in order to prolong this Barca Era. Let's not kid kid ourselves, this Barca era will be officially over when Leo hangs up his boots or age finally catches up with him. We shouldn't expect major changes or any long term success following this road, not even so much better football. We should, although, expect better results at some important games and perhaps another CL title, as a last hurray, for this core.
An "inexperienced former legend coach" at this point would be out of his depth, status wise, even if he turns out to be a great tactician. He would need to make a huge revamp to the squad, letting off most of the seniors, as it will be very hard to impose himself as a Coach when dealing with friends. This would mean that the team would be in a rebuilding phase, and we should not have expectations for any titles for the next couple of years at least. And this is key.. the next couple of years is the time in which Messi is still here.
For me it boils down to this:
Are we prepared to waste this period, trophy wise, hoping that in a couple of years time this team will rise again to the standards it once had. Or should we try and utilize an aging, but World Class or even once in a lifetime, core of players, pair them with some hungry and talented youngsters, in order to extend our trophy cabinet and cement our status.
I'd go with the second option. Even if Xavi was now ready take over, which he isn't, he would be the wrong choice at this point in time.
It all depends on your viewpoint, and this is mine:
A "proven veteran coach" at this point would be useful in order to prolong this Barca Era. Let's not kid kid ourselves, this Barca era will be officially over when Leo hangs up his boots or age finally catches up with him. We shouldn't expect major changes or any long term success following this road, not even so much better football. We should, although, expect better results at some important games and perhaps another CL title, as a last hurray, for this core.
An "inexperienced former legend coach" at this point would be out of his depth, status wise, even if he turns out to be a great tactician. He would need to make a huge revamp to the squad, letting off most of the seniors, as it will be very hard to impose himself as a Coach when dealing with friends. This would mean that the team would be in a rebuilding phase, and we should not have expectations for any titles for the next couple of years at least. And this is key.. the next couple of years is the time in which Messi is still here.
For me it boils down to this:
Are we prepared to waste this period, trophy wise, hoping that in a couple of years time this team will rise again to the standards it once had. Or should we try and utilize an aging, but World Class or even once in a lifetime, core of players, pair them with some hungry and talented youngsters, in order to extend our trophy cabinet and cement our status.
I'd go with the second option. Even if Xavi was now ready take over, which he isn't, he would be the wrong choice at this point in time.
Neymessi
Active member
Very good chances that Xavi will end up being an average coach for us. His statements are definitely things that put up a lot of red flags. Started to forget a lot of his dumb comments but I remember how he prioritizes possession over anything which is nothing but suicidal in 2019 and a mentality that took us a lot of time to leave behind.
That being said he will at least be ten times a coach EV ever was.
That being said he will at least be ten times a coach EV ever was.
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