Ernesto Valverde
- Thread starter Messigician
- Start date
That'a debatable. Setien has the same squad yet he is thousand times worse.
I think EV will do better in this team than Koeman. Not sure how far he can go though.
BBZ8800
Senior Member
But we could compare it to, let's say: 2019/20 and 2020/21.
Results are similar.
No, we didn't have the same squad.
Our players deteriorated massively in 7 days between EV nad Setien.
So, it's not comparable at all. EV had miles better and younger players.
BBZ8800
Senior Member
Hasn't it been debunked a lot of times?
1. EV played first 5 matches without Messi.
Suarez got injured in the first round, first half vs Bilbao.
Dembele was injured after the first match.
Coutinho was loaned.
So, he played Carles Perez, Fati and similar.
2. when Messi and Suarez returned, our results were good again.
3. Setien won 2 points more iirc, but he played with Messi+Suarez all the time and the last few rounds were friendly games since the league was decided and some midtable teams out of a relegation zone had nothing to play for.
4. plus epic 2:8 vs Bayern in only 90 minutes.
When you sum it all, Setien didn't win more points than EV.
bbz there's no way in hell you'd give other coaches the let off you've just given Valverde with the start of the season rhetoric. You were also saying back then how Messi makes the team function less. So by your own logic Valverde should have been doing better when Messi wasn't there.
Setien won more points in the league. And he's a shit manager. Even if you take into account the start of the season. You're also completely ignoring the point that you even comparing Valverde to Setien doesn't do Valverde any favours.
Shall I compare a microwaved steak to one cooked at an average restaurant? Probably not. Just because one is better than the other doesn't make it great.
Setien won more points in the league. And he's a shit manager. Even if you take into account the start of the season. You're also completely ignoring the point that you even comparing Valverde to Setien doesn't do Valverde any favours.
Shall I compare a microwaved steak to one cooked at an average restaurant? Probably not. Just because one is better than the other doesn't make it great.
So you think EV would get the same number of points in the first half of season if he still remained as Barca coach??? That's stupid and naive.
The point here is people said something like if Barca sack EV the Barca will rule the world or how two coaches with same squad but EV is way better.
Last edited:
Well, actually EV had some really good games without Messi when Barca thrashed Inter, Real Madrid with ease. Though Messi is always important, no matter who is Barca's coach.
And for your points won which is a stupid stat, Setien gets three points in the last game of seaso vs Alaves which is meaningless game because RM already won Liga. So go by actual points, he only gets 39
What's your point? That Setien is a shit coach? xD
Heavy defeat against Munich was inevitable - with or without Valverde. Setien even opted for his classic 442 with Roberto and Vidal
Barca would lose to Bayern but probably would do better in domestic league. At least players wouldn't turn their back against him like they did against Setien.
BBZ8800
Senior Member
Back then we had some awesome games even without Messi.
Even MSN played without Messi because there was enough of star power and more movement without him.
But Messi-Suarez team without Messi (and also Suarez) isn't the thing which I wanted to see WITHOUT Messi.
If you add that Cou was loaned and Dembele was forever injured, we had to rely on Griezz who came to a club 30 days earlier, 16 years old Fati and Carles Perez.
For example: Osasuna:Barcelona 2:2, lineup:
Mats - Alba, Lenglet, Pique, Semedo - Busi, Frenkie, Roberto - Rafinha, Griezz, Carles Perez.
Does that team look any better than the current team at all?
Imo, no.
And EV managed to still be on the 1st position when he was sacked even though he played the first 5 matches with this lineup.
Ev's La Liga summary:
1st season (2017/18) = winner (Real CL winner in 2016, 2017, 2018)
2nd season (2018/19) = winner
3rd season (2020) = first 5 matches playing without a lot of players, still managed to being tied with RM after 19 rounds when he was sacked
A guy was on top of the table for 2 and a half years straight.
We sack him and reach almost Uefa cup level afterwards, but it has nothing to do with EV.
I don't really know how many EV would get. He'd have probably got more than Setien. Hardly a huge achievement though because Setien is nowhere near the standard to be barca manager. People said just get Valverde out yes of course they did after the humiliating defeats. A competent replacement was expected, not a cow herder.
We didn't thrash inter we won 2-1. The points stat isn't stupid it shows they were roughly similar despite Setien being nowhere near the standard required to coach us. Doing slightly worse than Setien, or if we use your points total, slightly better, it isn't a worthy achievement.
Does that team look better? Yes. A younger Alba, Pique, Busquets, a Roberto that isn't useless. Semedo is about as capable in defence as Dest is. Is that version of Lenglet worse than Garcia? I would say no. Only players we start with now that are better is swapping Memphis for either Rafinha or Perez.
Setien only gets 39 points. 3 points in the last game vs Alaves is when Laliga is over, RM is already the champion. Pointless game btw.
Point won is not really thing you should bring to this dicussion. EV could win more than 40 if he continued. Just like how RM won more points in their second half of season with same Zidane.
Or else Pogba should have 152 assists because he has 4 assists in his opening game this season in PL.
Home of Barca Fans
