Diego Simeone

[Temptation]

Dortmund and Atletico are basically B clubs. I know of 2-3 stories of great underdog success at club level. Porto with Mou, Dortmund with Klopp, and Atletico with Simeone. Simeone stuck around. The other two used the B clubs as a career trampoline.

Porto is operating at a considerably lower financial and sporting level than Atletico. Definitely can't be in the same tier.

Leaving the club is a separate matter.

Is Simeone a bigger Atletico legend than Mourinho is a Porto legend? Obviously.

Are Mourinho's achievements at Porto tougher and more impressive than Simeone? Hell yeah!

 

[serghei]

Porto is operating at a considerably lower financial and sporting level than Atletico. Definitely can't be in the same tier.

Leaving the club is a separate matter.

Is Simeone a bigger Atletico legend than Mourinho is a Porto legend? Obviously.

Are Mourinho's achievements at Porto tougher and more impressive than Simeone? Hell yeah!

Simeone changed the way Atletico is seen completely. He's unique in this sense. Atletico for the casual fan is seen as a big club now. There wasn't any big 3 in Spain prior to Simeone.

Barca - AM wasn't much different than Barca vs Bilbao for example. Or Barca vs Valencia. Or Barca vs Betis.

 

[Temptation]

Simeone changed the way Atletico is seen completely. He's unique in this sense. Atletico for the casual fan is seen as a big club now. There wasn't any big 3 in Spain prior to Simeone.

Barca - AM wasn't much different than Barca vs Bilbao for example. Or Barca vs Valencia. Or Barca vs Betis.

Bilbao and Valencia are pretty big clubs though.

 

[serghei]

Bilbao and Valencia are pretty big clubs though.

My point. They didn't win 2 leagues vs Messi Barca, and made 2 CL finals did they?

Btw, Atletico win both those finals if they are not up against the biggest CL performing club at their modern era peak.

Madrid played like 7-8 CL finals in my days, and the hardest time they had winning one was vs AM under Simeone.

 

[khaled_a_d]

You are putting Porto CL on a pedestal, which is exaggeration.

They finished second in the group stage, then beat Manu, Lyon, Deportivo & Monaco in the competition . And they actually had a great squad that many of them had success elsewhere, a squad that was put by an amazing sporting department.

It is the same like Ranieri winning EPL, or Rehhagel winning 2004 Euros. A massive achievement for sure, but it needed the perfect storm to happen, and it doesn't make the coach an absolute legend over others just because he did it, and it doesn't change the needle that much in those comparisons.

Simeone would have loved a similar route in CL with Atletico. He woukd have had more CL titles than Zidane if he did

 

[GloryHunter 007]

You are putting Porto CL on a pedestal, which is nonsense. He finished second in the group stage, then beat Manu, Lyon, Deportivo & Monaco in the competent. And they actually had a great squad that manu of them had success elsewhere, a squad that was put by an amazing sporting department.

It is the same like Ranieri winning EPL, or Rehhagel winning 2004 Euros. A massive achievement for sure, but it needed the perfect storm to happen, and it doesn't make the coach an absolute legend just because he did it, and it doesn't change the needle that much in those comparisons.

Simeone would have loved a similar route in CL with Atletico. He woukd have had more CL titles than Zidane if he did

Against ManU they won in last attack also, but I get the point.

 

[serghei]

You are putting Porto CL on a pedestal, which is nonsense. He finished second in the group stage, then beat Manu, Lyon, Deportivo & Monaco in the competent. And they actually had a great squad that manu of them had success elsewhere, a squad that was put by an amazing sporting department.

It is the same like Ranieri winning EPL, or Rehhagel winning 2004 Euros. A massive achievement for sure, but it needed the perfect storm to happen, and it doesn't make the coach an absolute legend just because he did it, and it doesn't change the needle that much in those comparisons.

Simeone would have loved a similar route in CL with Atletico. He woukd have had more CL titles than Zidane if he did

I agree. But not really putting them at AM and Dortmund level. Said so even that AM and Dortmund are my preferred examples (of B club glory from a severe underdog position).

I agree Porto is from a previous era, with not nearly as much fierce competition. Somehwat of a transition era from Serie A to EPL and then La Liga as major forces in CL.

That being said not Porto's fault Deportivo trashed the CL holders Milan in 2004 IIRC.

 

[GloryHunter 007]

I agree. But not really putting them at AM and Dortmund level. Said so even that AM and Dortmund are my preferred examples (of B club glory from a severe underdog position).

I agree Porto is from a previous era, with not nearly as much fierce competition. Somehwat of a transition era from Serie A to EPL and then La Liga as major forces in CL.

That being said not Porto's fault Deportivo trashed the CL holders Milan in 2004 IIRC.

Yes, Milan blew a huge lead from the first leg. And they beat ManU in last attack.

But still, a great team and a great memory.

 

[Temptation]

You are putting Porto CL on a pedestal, which is exaggeration.

They finished second in the group stage, then beat Manu, Lyon, Deportivo & Monaco in the competition . And they actually had a great squad that many of them had success elsewhere, a squad that was put by an amazing sporting department.

It is the same like Ranieri winning EPL, or Rehhagel winning 2004 Euros. A massive achievement for sure, but it needed the perfect storm to happen, and it doesn't make the coach an absolute legend over others just because he did it, and it doesn't change the needle that much in those comparisons.

Simeone would have loved a similar route in CL with Atletico. He woukd have had more CL titles than Zidane if he did

They also won the Europa league the year before.

Winning the Champions League will always be put on a pedestal. 🤷🏻‍♂️

 

[serghei]

I would say Porto is close to Tottenham from recent era if Tottenham faced an easier finalist and they weren't Tottenham.

Some luck, but a top side. Mourinho was great when football was more aligned to his approach. Managers like Simeone and Mourinho are having it much tougher in the more modern era of attacking football that followed Pep Barcelona's ways.

There aren't many players out there you can built a top tier defense with. It's just the way things go... some of your qualities can be rendered not as great anymore by how the world spins around.

 

[GloryHunter 007]

I would say Porto is close to Tottenham from recent era if Tottenham faced an easier finalist and they weren't Tottenham.

Porto got a million leagues and UCL in 1987.

Tottenham got 2 leagues, in 51 and 61.

 

[serghei]

Btw, if you let any managers from last 30 years pick any players from the same timeframe, and pair them vs peak Pep Barcelona, the most we would suffer against and lose is Mourinho and Simeone teams filled with badasses in midfield and defense.

Managers like Simeone and Mourinho are very needed in the modern game. Seems like Arteta is trying to occupy that space.

 

[Windhook]

Depends on the timeline you are setting. All time table shows Porto and Tottenham are top 20 teams. But if we speak of the last 30 years, Porto are omnipresent, while Tottenham emerged in the last 10 years.

 

[Temptation]

Btw, if you let any managers from last 30 years pick any players from the same timeframe, and pair them vs peak Pep Barcelona, the most we would suffer against and lose is Mourinho and Simeone teams filled with badasses in midfield and defense.

No. It would be Klopp.

Pep has said that numerous times himself and Klopp has a better head to head record against Pep despite weaker squads and lesser resources.

Pep has always said that no manager has ever challenged him as hard as Klopp has. Pep would disagree with your take. @Birdy

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1500564962057633797

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1193608695780986881

 

[serghei]

No. It would be Klopp.

Pep has said that numerous times himself and Klopp has a better head to head record against Pep despite weaker squads and lesser resources.

Pep has always said that no manager has ever challenged him as hard as Klopp has. Pep would disagree with your take. @Birdy

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1500564962057633797

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1193608695780986881

Klopp is great. But his style has him challenging the best of Pep Barcelona. All of that geggen pressing is a huge weakness. You'd want someone to build a strong defense, go to war, fight tooth and nail, pull out all shenanigans, and hit deadly on the break. Mourinho, Simeone types, with beasts like Drogba up front.