Claudio Bravo

[Observer]

Well to start, ter Stegen was bought to be the future keeper of this team and was given the #1 shirt. Bravo was bought last second because of the question of experience and quality competition/depth at the possible request of the new coach, so the speculation the former was scheduled to be the started of this team before his injury is far more valid than the alternative.

Correct me If I'm wrong:

What other big club in history has signed a young GK to be their undisputed #1?

Even DDG & Curtois cases don't apply

 

[poncirus]

I'm glad he made the jump and worked out for Barça, but he wasn't exactly brilliant for sociedad.

How can you claim that with certainty? You followed Sociedad games that much? Because there is no way you can seriously determine quality of a keeper without a really large sample of full games. Where you also concentrate on watching that particular keeper. I don't think anyone here watched Sociedad that much, let alone one of their players specifically.

 

[Sumlit]

Correct me If I'm wrong:

What other big club in history has signed a young GK to be their undisputed #1?

Even DDG & Curtois cases don't apply

Considering I never said "undisputed #1" but "scheduled to start", I don't know what this has to do with me.

 

[instinct]

How can you claim that with certainty? You followed Sociedad games that much? Because there is no way you can seriously determine quality of a keeper without a really large sample of full games. Where you also concentrate on watching that particular keeper. I don't think anyone here watched Sociedad that much, let alone one of their players specifically.

This argument doesn't make any sense unless you claim that he was brilliant for Sociedad, which wouldn't be the case if you watched many Sociedad games, because he really wasn't that great.

 

[gasgas]

all i know is that the season before we bought him, he was the goalkeeper leading in the number of errors made, he had something like 13 individual errors that led to goal

 

[Observer]

Considering I never said "undisputed #1" but "scheduled to start", I don't know what this has to do with me.

Sorry for the adjective, but....that's the difference in narrative I don't understand from last year and this.

Early last year TS was the #1 present best GK for Barca ("should play all comps" was the most polarized opinion). Since mid-season to now he is the future of Barca.

I'm pretty sure that not only Bravo's "overhyping" has caused a change in perspective.

 

[poncirus]

This argument doesn't make any sense unless you claim that he was brilliant for Sociedad, which wouldn't be the case if you watched many Sociedad games, because he really wasn't that great.

That wasn't my argument at all. I'm sure neither I or anyone here followed Sociedad that much to know how exactly was he doing there.

all i know is that the season before we bought him, he was the goalkeeper leading in the number of errors made, he had something like 13 individual errors that led to goal

And like I said, on the other hand there were stats going in his favour. That's as much as we knew. Barcelona staff made the decision, and it turned out fine. Only problem here were fans who were against the player before he even played a single game. And were still after him when he started to put good performances. Ridiculous.

 

[serghei]

If he was or wasn't great at Sociedad is of little relevance. I haven't watched him that much. I'm pretty sure Unzue (I was told he was the one who made the deal) thought he a very good keeper, and, as it turned out, he was right. Being Chile's captain and the most capped player in the history of Chile NT is also something of note, that hasn't been explained so far.

 

[zanela]

I think that's exactly what happened. Both should have been received in the same way, since neither of them proved anything at a team like Barcelona.

Tbf the hype over stegen was not all unjustified. He was one of the protagonists of U17 Euros, and was proclaimed B'Liga's GK beating heavyweights like Neuer at mere 19/20 y.o. So there was a level of excitement over his potential and projection. And that talent is still very evident even if inconsistent. Whilst Bravo's close to a decade tenure in Europe was low key, and very li'l to talk about on an individual level. Hence understandable for not being received in the same way.

He turned out great, but as I said, there was nothing to indicate he would. At that point, his career with chile wasn't as it's now either. His breakthrough came in the 2014 wc. Prior to that, he also used to make blunders with chile. Like the goal Villa scored on him in the 2010 wc. Unzué has a great eye for gks, it's true. But in 13-14, Bravo was still making blunders like the ball he passed to Bale score a goal.

Since you brought up the Villa goal, I recall it was a long range one. He was 27 at the time, more experienced than a 23y.o keeper. If the keeper's off position and the strike is on target, the keeper's gonna come out looking very bad, regardless of other key factors. Apart from the aforementioned incidents, he had poor moments in CA '11 and WC'10 & '14 qualifiers.

Anyway, I hope he plays against Seville, given our recent defensive frailties his experience and calmness will help, whilst MAtS can take a respite.

 

[serghei]

Tbf the hype over stegen was not all unjustified. He was one of the protagonists of U17 Euros, and was proclaimed B'Liga's GK beating heavyweights like Neuer at mere 19/20 y.o. So there was a level of excitement over his potential and projection. And that talent is still very evident even if inconsistent. Whilst Bravo's close to a decade tenure in Europe was low key, and very li'l to talk about on an individual level. Hence understandable for not being received in the same way.

Potential is a very tricky word. It means a player CAN become great SOMETIME in the future. Not exactly sure when or even if he will make it at all. Stegen probably will. I can understand people saying Stegen is more talented than Bravo, or saying Stegen will have a better career, or that his potential is higher. But not when the discussion is transfered from potential to actual value right now. Stegen was not a stranger when it comes to blunders himself. He's shown that both at Gladbach, at Germany NT, and at Barcelona.

 

[zanela]

Potential is a very tricky word. It means a player CAN become great SOMETIME in the future. Not exactly sure when or even if he will make it at all. Stegen probably will. I can understand people saying Stegen is more talented than Bravo, or saying Stegen will have a better career, or that his potential is higher. But not when the discussion is transfered from potential to actual value right now. Stegen was not a stranger when it comes to blunders himself. He's shown that both at Gladbach, at Germany NT, and at Barcelona.

It's a fact Stegen achieved what he did at a very young age, thats not debatable. Barca fans knew they were getting a very talented keeper (certainly for the ones who've watched him), whilst Bravo for his age and experience didn't have much of a career highlight at the time (apart from WC'14,). The discrepancy in reception is understandable even if disproportionate.
The blunder narrative with Stegen is overstated. Yes, he commits errors, but not any more than his peers. The momentary lapses apart (natural to his age) his enterprising approach just leaves him more exposed. For every error of stegen I could provide one that of the much higher rated Courtois. But ridiculing the former is a more fun topic for many on here.

 

[Observer]

I think its funny how in similar situations (Bravo v/s TS blunders) the narrative changes to fit a "popular" opinion (giving TS is more popular in this forum).

So while for months you (among other members) were so easy to throw shit at Bravo (without reason), you suddenly feel emotional about TS critique. That only tells me that people in general here have invested emotionally on this player enough to make any excuse for their favorite player, while being absolutely not consequent with the same level of critique towards the non so popular keeper.

I'm pretty curious about what was watched by Barca fans about TS before he joined that made him so unquestionable #1 Barca material: A youtube video compilation? What did he achieve btw? I really doubt (except German members) that a lot of people watch Bundesliga week in, week out. So please can you share what did you watch from TS (not in youtube plox) that made him unquestionable better than a seasoned GK with international caps (2 WC & 2 CA), La Liga & CL experience.

 

[God Serena]

I'm pretty curious about what was watched by Barca fans about TS before he joined that made him so unquestionable #1 Barca material: A youtube video compilation? What did he achieve btw? I really doubt (except German members) that a lot of people watch Bundesliga week in, week out. So please can you share what did you watch from TS (not in youtube plox) that made him unquestionable better than a seasoned GK with international caps (2 WC & 2 CA), La Liga & CL experience.

That "Seasoned goalkeeper" was pretty mediocre prior to Lucho becoming manager. You and your buddy can claim I didn't watch Sociedad all you like (Pretty baseless, actually, as that seems to be implying either that the only football matches I watch are Barca's, or that I don't watch other La Liga teams because, herpa derpa, two team league) but the fact is I did, and not a single time when watching Bravo did I see anything from him that indicated he'd be a good Barca goalkeeper. Even when playing against the big 3, where a lot of keepers put on their best showings, Bravo in his final season for La Real costed his team goals against Bale and Neymar while keepers like Diego Alves and Willy Caballero stood like brick walls against us. Keylor Navas in his time with Levante was the kind of goalkeeper who could make you tune in just to see the ridiculous saves he'd pull off- and in my opinion he'd have been a much better signing than anyone we could have made, but Zubi screwed that one up, of course. His time with the international team is absolutely irrelevant to me no matter how good or bad he played for them as there is little relation between club football and international football, and his CL experience consists of consistently getting dominated and eliminated in the group stages.

 

[Kuchi]

If Bravo messes up in Seville, the roof will be on fire up in hereeee

 

[serghei]

It's a fact Stegen achieved what he did at a very young age, thats not debatable. Barca fans knew they were getting a very talented keeper (certainly for the ones who've watched him), whilst Bravo for his age and experience didn't have much of a career highlight at the time (apart from WC'14,). The discrepancy in reception is understandable even if disproportionate.
The blunder narrative with Stegen is overstated. Yes, he commits errors, but not any more than his peers. The momentary lapses apart (natural to his age) his enterprising approach just leaves him more exposed. For every error of stegen I could provide one that of the much higher rated Courtois. But ridiculing the former is a more fun topic for many on here.

Of course Stegen achieved more at a young age and is the better prospect, and the most promising. That's not even up for debate and not even the point. Everyone can threat every player however unethical or immoral they want in the end. The only downside of that treatment is that said player can succeed and make those people look (very) bad in the process. That happened with Bravo. In general is better and more fair (and more logical) to wait for a player to do badly at the club first, before you mock him. Bravo was welcomed almost like Douglas, with a lot of meanness. The difference is that he proved the doubters wrong.