Bernardo Silva

[Raketa10]

They are always better when they are playing for other teams

Denis was tearing teams apart for Villareal
He was MOTM against us

Arda was an experience superstar for Atletico

Rafinha was La Liga's player of the month a few times and at times also IIRC best young player of la liga

I understand your concern and on some points you are right but I must correct you here regarding Arda, Rafinha and Denis.

Denis was never tearing teams appart, that's exaggeration, he was good but he was never great or spectacular while Silva is and he is playing on much higher level than Denis ever did.

Rafinha on the other hand was never a playmaker, he was never abble to control the ball or provide asists like Silva. Most of the time he looks extremly clumsy with the ball while Silva moves almost like Inesta in small spaces.

Out of those three mentioned only Arda was world class in one moment of his career but his problems started in his last year with Atletico. His work rate decreased significantly, he became injury prone and that escalated even more when he arrived here.

So IMHO none of those three are even comparable to Silva at the moment.

 

[serghei]

I understand your concern and on some points you are right but I must correct you here regarding Arda, Rafinha and Denis.

Denis was never tearing teams appart, that's exaggeration, he was good but he was never great or spectacular while Silva is and he is playing on much higher level than Denis ever did.

Rafinha on the other hand was never a playmaker, he was never abble to control the ball or provide asists like Silva. Most of the time he looks extremly clumsy with the ball while Silva moves almost like Inesta in small spaces.

Out of those three mentioned only Arda was world class in one moment of his career but his problems started in his last year with Atletico. His work rate decreased significantly, he became injury prone and that escalated even more when he arrived here.

So IMHO none of those three are even comparable to Silva at the moment.

I agree with all of this.

 

[gasgas]

I understand your concern and on some points you are right but I must correct you here regarding Arda, Rafinha and Denis.

Denis was never tearing teams appart, that's exaggeration, he was good but he was never great or spectacular while Silva is and he is playing on much higher level than Denis ever did.

Rafinha on the other hand was never a playmaker, he was never abble to control the ball or provide asists like Silva. Most of the time he looks extremly clumsy with the ball while Silva moves almost like Inesta in small spaces.

Out of those three mentioned only Arda was world class in one moment of his career but his problems started in his last year with Atletico. His work rate decreased significantly, he became injury prone and that escalated even more when he arrived here.

So IMHO none of those three are even comparable to Silva at the moment.

But the problem here for both Denis and Silva for this case is not the level, it is the position they play on the pitch
Silva has plenty good qualities
But those qualities for Barca are the kind a winger should have not a CM

He lacks plenty of requirements for a Barca CM
While he is excellent as a Barca winger, that's what i have been saying

 

[SeloBarca]

Silva would be Iniestas AM role or RW. He doesnt have the CM qualities we need.

 

[gasgas]

Silva would be Iniestas AM role or RW. He doesnt have the CM qualities we need.

We don't play with an AM

We play with A DM and two CMs

Due to the nature of our forwards we need CMs not AMs

Iniesta plays quite deep

 

[Raketa10]

We don't play with an AM

We play with A DM and two CMs

Due to the nature of our forwards we need CMs not AMs

Iniesta plays quite deep

In Pep's time Iniesta had different role than today, he was much more forward oriented. I agree with you that in our current way of playing Bernardo wouldn't excel but I am 100% sure that even Verratti and Kante would not be able to cover all holes in our midfield due to the fact that all of MSN do not press at all!

We were never great defensively (Xavi and Iniesta were never defensively oriented) and because of that during Pep era we pressed high all of the time. This is something we MUST regain!

We have to start pressing high again and if we do that I am convinced that Bernardo could function in our midfield. Without pressing there is no way anyone could be good enough since our front 3 are not playing defense at all. We also need a proper RB ASAP!!!

 

[clemente]

In Pep's time Iniesta had different role than today, he was much more forward oriented. I agree with you that in our current way of playing Bernardo wouldn't excel but I am 100% sure that even Verratti and Kante would not be able to cover all holes in our midfield due to the fact that all of MSN do not press at all!

We were never great defensively (Xavi and Iniesta were never defensively oriented) and because of that during Pep era we pressed high all of the time. This is something we MUST regain!

We have to start pressing high again and if we do that I am convinced that Bernardo could function in our midfield. Without pressing there is no way anyone could be good enough since our front 3 are not playing defense at all. We also need a proper RB ASAP!!!

Except that Neymar is covering as much ground as Alba, so as Suarez always pressuring.

 

[Raketa10]

Except that Neymar is covering as much ground as Alba, so as Suarez always pressuring.

Try to watch some games from Pep's era so you'll see a noticeable difference between today's pressing and pressing from that time. It's really not even comparable. In that time Pedro was pressing like a lunatic and so was the entire midfield together with both full backs.

Today Messi is walking together with Suarez and Neymar is pressing until he looses first duel and than he keeps on walking. Midfield can't press at all since Iniesta has lost his pace and Rakitic or Gomes are not even made for pressing since they are slow as fuck. Same goes for Rafinha and Arda.

For real pressing you need to have well balanced, synchronized and quick team otherwise it's not pressing. When half of the team is walking in defense and only 3 or 4 players are pressing this becomes "running after the ball and energy wasting sport" with no real effect.

If just ONE player does not defend you are basically unable to press and we have many of them who are unable (or not willing) to press for more than 20-30 minutes. Even if they press for 20-30 minutes it's always in a big important games while against teams like Malaga, Valencia or similar we do not even try to press anymore.

This is the reason why I am 100% there is no player out there (not even Verratti) who could fix our midfield problem on his own. Defending starts from attack and attack starts from defense. This is a team sport so if system works players excel if it doesn't than all players will play bellow their expected level. People really need to realize this.

 

[IamGundogan]

Silva can play on the right hand side of a MF 3. Ball retention and his passing ability would be ideal for Barca.

 

[gasgas]

In Pep's time Iniesta had different role than today, he was much more forward oriented. I agree with you that in our current way of playing Bernardo wouldn't excel but I am 100% sure that even Verratti and Kante would not be able to cover all holes in our midfield due to the fact that all of MSN do not press at all!

We were never great defensively (Xavi and Iniesta were never defensively oriented) and because of that during Pep era we pressed high all of the time. This is something we MUST regain!

We have to start pressing high again and if we do that I am convinced that Bernardo could function in our midfield. Without pressing there is no way anyone could be good enough since our front 3 are not playing defense at all. We also need a proper RB ASAP!!!

We can not base things on Pep's era.

That was special, players were top class, on form, everything was working. It doesn't work that way anymore. Pep's teams still press like mad men but look at how poorly they are doing Bayern, City, all poor at the top level


I want for us Barca to play a practical model of football.
Compact in defence, flowing in attack. Times have changed. Even the busparkers have evolved their methodology. We should do the same

Xavi and Iniesta are gone. We can not dish out 70 M then try to fit Bernardo in our midfield. It's the same issue all over again. We need to buy a player who plays like a Barca CM now, who would need few to no modifications.

Silva plays as a RW for Monaco. He lacks plenty of traits of a Barca CM: Midfield control, Organization, Tempo dictation, he is not a pass and move player, he is more of get the ball, run, then pass or shoot,
He is creative from the wing, it's all a different story being creative from central position, he is not calm and collected, and Modern football requires CM to be able to defend, tackle, intercept which Bernardo is poor in, He can't keep the ball (loses the ball 4 times than current Iniesta).

I will not trade the lack of those features for just a few dribbles and runs, and flashy passes. BTW he will be forced to play RCM, same side as Messi, which will limit him from doing all those anyways.
You don't dribble 8 players when you are playing same side as Messi

 

[TornAndFrayed]

We can not dish out 70 M then try to fit Bernardo in our midfield. It's the same issue all over again

Which "issue" is "happening all over again" ?

We need to buy a player who plays like a Barca CM now, who would need few to no modifications

'cause the system is working so well to begin with right ?

Silva plays as a RW for Monaco. He lacks plenty of traits of a Barca CM: Midfield control, Organization, Tempo dictation, he is not a pass and move player, he is more of get the ball, run, then pass or shoot,
He is creative from the wing, it's all a different story being creative from central position, he is not calm and collected, and Modern football requires CM to be able to defend, tackle, intercept which Bernardo is poor in, He can't keep the ball (loses the ball 4 times than current Iniesta).

All this is based on what ? How many monaco games did you watch ?

 

[SeloBarca]

We don't play with an AM

We play with A DM and two CMs

Due to the nature of our forwards we need CMs not AMs

Iniesta plays quite deep

I dont know what we play but its definatly not 2 CM:s

Iniesta plays as AM, hes not a playmaker CM and balldistibutor. Rakitic plays more as a defensive RW leaving Busquetes as an isolated DM.

 

[gasgas]

Which "issue" is "happening all over again" ?


'cause the system is working so well to begin with right ?



All this is based on what ? How many monaco games did you watch ?

What makes you think I will reply to your questions?

 

[BBZ8800]

Imo, even if we forget all problems mentioned in this topic, with Bernardo, teams like Bayern, Juve and Atletico will knock us out from a Cl again and again.

It will work against 90% of smaller teams.
Physical teams will shut him and our midfield easily.

Msn and 3 physically weaker midfielders may imply that we will just play our classic play (except in a slightly better version): repeat the same action for 100 times in a row and hope for the best.
If it doesn't work, it doesn't matter, keep on trying it again and again.

If Messi drops to the middle, that will be two short Cams in Messi and Silva.
A small Neymar in attack, slow Luis Suarez.
Turtles Busi and Raki behind them, two fullbacks without Iq in Alba and Bellerin infront of them.

In general, imo, Bernardo alone is not the problem.
Our problrms are way deeper and we would need to change 2-3 starters and add a plan b and avoid our one dimensional style of passing and dribbling through the ground.

In the last 4 Cl Ko's we lost to the same type of teams over and over: Bayern, Am, Am, Juve.

Do you guys think that the same style of play and a new midfielder like Bernardo will fix our problems in a Cl?
I don't think so.

Whether we will play better against Bilbao and Espanyol?
Well, that is another story.

But I am not interested in players who will improve us against Espanyol.

We can buy Bernardo, but then we need to sell some of Msn and buy some stronger players. Which won't happen yet.
So we can't have both Msn and even more physically poor players.

 

[gasgas]

Imo, even if we forget all problems mentioned in this topic, with Bernardo, teams like Bayern, Juve and Atletico will knock us out from a Cl again and again.

It will work against 90% of smaller teams.
Physical teams will shut him and our midfield easily.

Msn and 3 physically weaker midfielders may imply that we will just play our classic play (except in a slightly better version): repeat the same action for 100 times in a row and hope for the best.
If it doesn't work, it doesn't matter, keep on trying it again and again.

If Messi drops to the middle, that will be two short Cams in Messi and Silva.
A small Neymar in attack, slow Luis Suarez.
Turtles Busi and Raki behind them, two fullbacks without Iq in Alba and Bellerin infront of them.

In general, imo, Bernardo alone is not the problem.
Our problrms are way deeper and we would need to change 2-3 starters and add a plan b and avoid our one dimensional style of passing and dribbling through the ground.

In the last 4 Cl Ko's we lost to the same type of teams over and over: Bayern, Am, Am, Juve.

Do you guys think that the same style of play and a new midfielder like Bernardo will fix our problems in a Cl?
I don't think so.

Whether we will play better against Bilbao and Espanyol?
Well, that is another story.

But I am not interested in players who will improve us against Espanyol.

We can buy Bernardo, but then we need to sell some of Msn and buy some stronger players. Which won't happen yet.
So we can't have both Msn and even more physically poor players.

I agree
Something else i have been saying is that these players people are suggesting i.e Coutinho, Silva by nature they are players who try a lot of things in their gameplay
They try a lot of dribbles, a lot of risky passes and as a result they lose the ball a lot, i just checked whoscored stats and each of them loses the ball three times as much as Denis Suarez loses it.
So you have Neymar, the turnover machine, Messi who tries a lot, Suarez who struggles to complete passes, and behind them Silva/Coutinho who lose the ball a lot too, what would that be? Plenty of turnovers and since we have no defensive backbone, that means we will be counterattacked time and time again, even worse than we are right now

You talked about physicality. What do you think if we play something like this

.......................................Ter Stegen/Cillessen.....................................
Aurier/Vidal........Pique/Sanchez..................Umtiti/Marlon.............Alba/Digne
..........................Weigl/Rakitic......Busquets..........................................
Silva/Deulo...........................Messi......................................Neymar/Denis
........................................Suarez/Plaque


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