6 - Carles Alena

[serghei]

And I tell you what, a player like Toure surely knew he was put off by what Busi promised to be. Something like, sorry mate, but this guy in a year or two will give me more than you can ever give me. I have to sacrifice you, even if you don't deserve it.

You can't possibly accept that as a professional player. It's not right in a way, but Busi surely repaid the manager's trust.

Also, a manager like Valverde wouldn't even be able to take a decision like that.

Fuck it, I was shocked even. Yaya was so good at DM I thought we've secured that for years. Because I didn't even knew about a guy named Busi who was a brilliant La Masia kid. I remember seeing Yaya in the Gamper vs Inter, 5-0, and I though, my god is this guy a beast or what? Imagine that a year later, Pep took the position off him and gave it to Busi.

 

[Centauri B]

BBZ, when you say EV sucks, that's like saying a movie director sucks and blame the actors for how the movie ended up. When you say the manager sucks, that's it for me. You can't draw any other conclusion other than the only conclusion there is do be drawn: THE MANAGER NEEDS REPLACING ASAP. So we can be sure most of the shit that's happening isn't his doing.

You can't say EV sucks and then build an argument which only makes sense if the manager doesn't suck. Once you have a guy who is in charge of every tactical and every staff decision in the team, and you think he sucks, you can't go behind that.

At a club like Barcelona, who has access to the finest echelon of players, except few isolated cases, you can only draw valid conclusions about players once you have a proper manager. If you don't agree with that, there is no conversation to be had imo.

I will put it clearly right now so you guys will know what my stance is regarding player evaluation. I belive the manager of a team is so central to everything that you can't really be sure a player is shit except in very rare cases.

I mean, I was sure Douglas, or Miranda, or Montoya didn't have what it took, regardless of managers. I can give ore examples of players I was sure they were not good enough, so you guys won't think I stand with the player over the manager any time. Because it's not true.

But the players we talk about, like Semedo, Arthur, Alena. Come on, it's obvious they do things which are inaccessible to avarage players. You CAN NOT be sure these players wouldn't be great under better managers. That's what it is about. We're not talking about the likes of Douglas or Montoya, players you know that they just don't have it. or Gumbaus or Mirandas, dubious talents which aren't worth the investment of time and effort in the first palce. We're talking about players who are up there really close to having a legitimate shot of being great, WITH PROPER MANAGEMENT (can't stress this enough). I think in such close cases, the right manager IS the missing link.

No my dude.

EV can suck to high heavens, and our canteranos can also suck at the same time. The way I see them, they would not be able to make it, whether we had Klopp, Pep, Rinus Michel, Del Bosque, Hellenio Herrera, Arigo Sacchi or whomever. They are simply not good enough.

 

[serghei]

No my dude.

EV can suck to high heavens, and our canteranos can also suck at the same time. The way I see them, they would not be able to make it, whether we had Klopp, Pep, Rinus Michel, Del Bosque, Hellenio Herrera, Arigo Sacchi or whomever. They are simply not good enough.

Sure, man. I even gave examples of players who aren't good enough. Miranda, Gumbau, Montoya, Munir, Sandro. Read it again.

 

[Centauri B]

Sure, man. I even gave examples of players who aren't good enough. Miranda, Gumbau, Montoya, Munir, Sandro. Read it again.

Semedo, Arthur and Alena have been given lots of chances and they have been hot and cold. Maybe you can say Alena deserved more playing time, but the other two cannot complain at all. If Alena is a great player, then he can more than prove it at Real Betis. Great players do not need a manger to make them great. They emphatically produce it on the pitch no matter what. The list is endless.

 

[BBZ8800]

Serghei, no I am not measuring talents by Messi's standards.

Since late 90s, I have seen tons of talents at Barca and in European football.

About Alena and Puig, they are just meh.
In 2004, they would be okish 6th pick like Gabri, Ezquerro and co.

But nothing more than that.
And what is worse, the level of football today is higher and players like them are nothing more than a 6th pick at Barca.

About Busi vs Yaya, what if Pep preferred one type of players?
For example, you know that I like tall and strong No9.
If I were a coach and if I had young Halaand, who fits my profile and let's say Aguero, I would bench Aguero.
Not only because I am a visionary, but because I don't want to play football with Aguero as a No9.
Aguero is better, but I don't need that type of a player in my team.

And even if Pep was a visionary, what it has to do with Alena and Puig?

You act if Pep was a visionary about Busi that it applies to lots of other players.

Remember that not a single NT youth coach of Spain is interested in Riki.

I mean, at least one of those coaches should have better skills than EV.
How come that absolutely no one is interested in Riki?

The answer is quite simple.
It has nothing to do with EV.

 

[serghei]

Puig is far too young. Didn't even mention him. Alena I see him as a great squad player. He's easily good for that and it's not even debatable imo. Just the Sociedad game, he entered the pitch and we started to connect some passes in the middle. Like easily spotted. This is exactly what squad players should do. Start the easy games, and impact the hard games when trusted to do so, or when injuries appear.

I never understand why some are against Alena so much. Squad players are very valuable. Even Rafinha would've been a fine Barca player if he wasn't so injury prone. You act as if the team is 11 players. Roberto, very valuable as squad player.

Squad player doesn't mean crap player. Squad player at Barcelona is starter at another top 10 team like Chelsea or Tottenham. We sold Alexis Sanchez as if he was crap and he was named in the best Premier League team two seasons in a row.

 

[Centauri B]

Puig is far too young. Didn't even mention him. Alena I see him as a great squad player. He's easily good for that and it's not even debatable imo. Just the Sociedad game, he entered the pitch and we started to connect some passes in the middle. Like easily spotted. This is exactly what squad players should do. Start the easy games, and impact the hard games when trusted to do so, or when injuries appear.

I never understand why some are against Alena so much. Squad players are very valuable. Even Rafinha would've been a fine Barca player if he wasn't so injury prone. You act as if the team is 11 players. Roberto, very valuable as squad player.

Squad player doesn't mean crap player. Squad player at Barcelona is starter at another top 10 team like Chelsea or Tottenham. We sold Alexis Sanchez as if he was crap and he was named in the best Premier League team two seasons in a row.

You have to admit that he was a bit crap for us. Was he really EPL player of the season twice? My word EPL was trash back then!

I think he was Arsenal's player of the season twice, but not the EPL's.

 

[CatalinR10]

You have to admit that he was a bit crap for us. Was he really EPL player of the season twice? My word EPL was trash back then!

I think he was Arsenal's player of the season twice, but not the EPL's.

he said he was in the best PL team of the season twice , not that he was the best PL player.


dawg.

 

[mc_lovin]

Puig is far too young. Didn't even mention him. Alena I see him as a great squad player. He's easily good for that and it's not even debatable imo.

Guys like Keita, Roberto etc are great squad players. Alena is not. I wouldnt trust him in a (remotely) bigger match.

 

[Havesaks]

A nice read about the Toure-Sergio-case. Pep is a visionary.

 

[Porque]

Lets see what he can do in half a season at Betis. A run of LaLiga games for 0.5 or 1.5 of a season and bringing him back can only be a good option.

When he has played games in a row Alena has been fine.

 

[kattanib]

A nice read about the Toure-Sergio-case. Pep is a visionary.

That was random

 

[serghei]

Lets see what he can do in half a season at Betis. A run of LaLiga games for 0.5 or 1.5 of a season and bringing him back can only be a good option.

When he has played games in a row Alena has been fine.

Yea, it's still better for him to play more often, and Betis don't have terrible players. They are a top 8 team or should be. The issue is these players who are loaned for 6 months don't get too much trust from the managers because the managers know in 6 months they could be gone. So they prefer to use the players they can count on for longer.

If I am a manager I would also be reticent to fully use a player who in 6 months may be gone. Betis this season is fighting for nothing, so the incentive to use Alena too much is not really there from a business perspective.

 

[Porque]

Yea, it's still better for him to play more often, and Betis don't have terrible players. They are a top 8 team or should be. The issue is these players who are loaned for 6 months don't get too much trust from the managers because the managers know in 6 months they could be gone. So they prefer to use the players they can count on for longer.

If I am a manager I would also be reticent to fully use a player who in 6 months may be gone. Betis this season is fighting for nothing, so the incentive to use Alena too much is not really there from a business perspective.

Agreed. Lets see how his minutes go. Betis have shown these past seasons that they are a good option for incentivised deals. Flipping De Celso after his loan and building up Emerson with our mutual transfer. I would not be surprised if a purchase price with a buyback fee has been discussed for the summer.

 

[gregorrin10]

Young home grown talents, who have gone through all generations of La Masia and fit us like a glove, and who would kill for a proper chance in the first team, leaving or playing for the B team, all that so old crybabies, who go bitch and leak to the media the first time something isn't up to their expectations, that are Rakitic and Vidal, can stay and pull that fat paycheck a bit more longer. This Board in a nutshell.