11 - Neymar Jr. - v4

[Blaugrana Bull]

 

[Leo_Messi]

Silencing the haters, again and again. World class performance today

He has done that practically all season long. 30 goals in 41 games. Try to compare those numbers with the best season's of the most prolific strikers of the past seasons/decade. Players such as Villa, Eto'o, Henry, Rooney, Torres, Suárez, Agüero, Lewandowski, Higuaín, Benzema, Cavani etc.

This alone speaks volume and does not warrant the ridiculous criticism labelled at Neymar at times on this forum and elsewhere.

 

[barcanuck]

Had a lot of work to do still after that magical Iniesta run. First touch was golden and the second rounds the keeper, 3rd finishes it.

 

[BerkeleyBernie]

Bernie, you must be pretty pleased with how good he was at releasing the ball tonight to keep the game flowing.

Three games straight now. Neymar 2.0 is definitely out of beta. I don't mind if he (like Suarez and Rakitic) misplaces some passes, as long as he's working to involve his teammates.

Only thing was that he kept looking for Messi too much. The bromance is strong in Neymar

Not half as much as Alves.

 

[Kohe321]

Not half as much as Alves.

Haha true, whenever Messi initiates give-and-go short passes with Alves it seems that he would continue, if allowed, until the referee blew his whistle to signal the end of the game.

By the way, the linkup between Alves and Neymar in that cross-header-goal was almost a reprise of the winner in the supercup against Atletico at the start of the Martino season...

The Alvney connection?

[vine]https://vine.co/v/eaO0Kp3PiYJ[/vine]

 

[BerkeleyBernie]

Haha true, whenever Messi initiates give-and-go short passes with Alves it seems that he would continue, if allowed, until the referee blew his whistle to signal the end of the game.

Exactly what I was thinking.

By the way, the linkup between Alves and Neymar in that cross-header-goal...

WTF, Alves actually aiming a cross? More than once, too. Watching the game, I had the feeling the same person who told Neymar to stop ball-holding ad nauseum also told Alves to stop with his aimless crosses ad nauseum.

Dunga?

 

[D10S_JC]

Where is the old thread?

 

[StarLord]

Can't be Neymar. Must be Pedro with a Neymar mask on with all DAT quick ball releasing™ going on.

1. Mega-performance in a big game once again.

2. Looking excessively for Messi as others have noted as well. This juvenile thing must stop, it does not matter who scores the fucking goals, only that we win. OK, I know that for forward players goals always matter, but still, Lucho must talk to the players about this. We can't have it compromising our performances. Barca fans are more than knowledgeable enough to know that it is not always about who scores. It's about so much more. Hell, we worship Xavi and Iniesta, and they very rarely scored.

 

[pacp_96]

30 goals this season. Shows how ridiculous all this criticism has been. Prior to Messi and Ronaldo era that would be regarded as a phenomenal goal tally.

 

[Gasgas]

Three games straight now. Neymar 2.0 is definitely out of beta. I don't mind if he (like Suarez and Rakitic) misplaces some passes, as long as he's working to involve his teammates.



Not half as much as Alves.

We won Berkeley back
Now it's time to win Bojan and BBZ over

 

[BerkeleyBernie]

30 goals this season. Shows how ridiculous all this criticism has been. Prior to Messi and Ronaldo era that would be regarded as a phenomenal goal tally.

The criticism is not "ridiculous." When he cuts out the interminable ball-holding crap he has been criticized for, he (and the team) play better- not to mention, it also makes the game far more enjoyable to watch. The criticism has been proven justified. His ball-holding *didn't* yield results, and every time it didn't, it was one attacking opportunity for the team squandered (*similar criticism is applicable to Alves' trademark aimless crosses- a waste of a possession).

I'm not one of those who went postal when he wasn't "in form." I don't care who is or isn't scoring goals (or who is racking up statistics); all I want, as a Barça spectator, is to see the *team* playing well; if the team plays well, *someone* is going to score. He finished well today, but personally, I'm more impressed with his recent efforts to contribute to Barça's build-up play, which gives his teammates more opportunities to shine, as well as provide key passes for him to finish.

 

[Antimadridista1]

I appreciated his defensive work. Really important for the stability of the team.

 

[linetty]

This guy has such a high ceiling. Sky is the limit

 

[BBZ8800]

30 goals this season. Shows how ridiculous all this criticism has been. Prior to Messi and Ronaldo era that would be regarded as a phenomenal goal tally.

Neymar is good, but people will need to find a better argument than 30 Goals scored in a Season in total.
Why?
= because these are different times than 1994, 1998 and 2002, and comparing 30 Goals scored today with 30 Goals scored back then are misleading

1. La Liga wasn different, and Barca and Real weren't as rich as today. In the past, Italian clubs were extremely rich (during 90ies and in early 2000s)
-- so, in those years, Barca and Real didn't have the money to buy expensive players as today, and thus the difference between Barca&Real and the rest of the league was much smaller
-- that means that in the past La Liga was not a 2-horse-race, but a more difficult championship, and it was much harder to win against any weaker opponent than today
-- in number, just an example (and these are NOT the real numbers, but my estimation)
-- imagine that in 90's:
-- Barca and Real had 20 Millions to spend on transfers each Season
-- and an average La liga team had 5 Millions to spend

-- today:
-- Barca and Real have 100 Millions to spend each Season
-- and an average La liga team has 10 Millions to spend

-- so, you see, the difference (just an example again) went from 4:1 to 10:1
-- this is why Barca and Real are today statpading against most of the opponents with silly 6:0 and 8:0 wins
-- and this is why Barca and Real are lately having Seasons with 90, 95 or 100 points
-- and this is why both Barca and Real are scoring an insane number of Goals in La liga (and in Cup) lately, compared to the past times
-- also, this means that current Barca's and Real's attackers will score much more goals than their attackers from 1994, 1998 or 2002, and that was fans may be mislead with that fact and they may thought: "Oh, the current players are a few levels above all those players from 10-15 years ago".
-- well only Messi is better. Even CR7 would struggle in 1998'
2. the 2nd reason is, that until a few years ago, Barca and Real were allowed to have only 3 players from outside the EU
-- even when Rijkaard came, we needed to "count" how many foreigners we have and we had to decide whom we will and whom we won't buy
-- all (or most of the) Brasilians, Argentines, Uruguayans were all foreigners=back then
-- but also, all players from Croatia (like Rakitic and Modric) were outside of European union back then and they were considered as foreigners

Just look at the current team:
1. Bravo, Chile=a foreigner
2. Masch, Argentina=a foreigner
3. Messi, Argentina=a foreigner
4. Neymar, Brasil=a foreigner
5. Rafinha, Brasil=a foreigner
6. Suarez, Uruguay=a foreigner
7. Rakitic, Croatia=a foreigner
8. Alves, Brasil=a foreigner
9. Douglas, Brasil=a foreigner
10. Adriano, Brasil=a foreigner

And now, look at number of foreigners in our team in 1996, for example:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1995–96_FC_Barcelona_season
-- so, you see, we needed to have almost ALL players from Spain
-- so, when you can have only Spanish players, of course that your team will be much weaker compared to average La liga teams than when you can have 10 Brasilians and Argentines

In late 90's and early 2000's, we started to buy some EU players because they were not foreigners and we started to get a dual citizenship to some Brasilians, so we started to have a few EU players and 4-5 Brasil/Argentian guys in our team, like in 2001-2002-2003:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2001–02_FC_Barcelona_season
-- here we have 5 guys from South America, and probably 2 of them had a Spanish citizenship, so they were allowed to play
-- so, as you see, Barca and Real is 90's:
= were both not that rich + we were not allowed to have more than 3 foreigners
-- then in early 2000's:
= we still weren't nowhere as rich as today + we now had more foreigners
-- while today:
= we are filthy rich and we have a 2-horse-La Liga-race + we can have virtually as many foreigners as we want with new dual citizenship and European union rules

That is an answer why current Barca's and Real's players will have much better stats that Fcs from 90's, early 2000's or from 2005.

To show you even more stats, this is the number of victories per Season for Barca's teams in the last 20 years:
1994, 25 wins out of 38 matches (The Dream team from Cruijff)
1995: 18 wins in 38 matches, lol
1996: 22 wins in 42 matches, lol
1997, 28 wins in 42 matches
1998: 23 wins in 38 matches, 74 points
1999: 24 wins in 38 matches, 79 points
2000: 19 wins in 38 matches, 64 points, lol
2001: 17 wins in 38 matches, 63 points, lol
2002: 18 wins in 38 matches, 64 points, lol
2003, 15 wins in 38 matches, 56 points, lol
2004: 21 wins in 38 matches, 72 points
2005: 25 wins in 38 matches, 84 points, Champions again
2006: 25 wins in 38 matches, 82 Points, Champions again, Champions league winners
2007: 22 wins in 38 matches, 76 Points
2008: 19 wins in 38 matches, 76 points
2009: 27 wins in 38 matches, 87 Points, Pep, Champions
2010: 31 wins in 38 matches, 99 Points, lol
2011: 30 wins in 38 matches, 98 Points, lol
2012: 28 wins in 38 matches, 91 Points
2013: 32 wins in 38 matches, 100 Points, Tito
2014: 27 wins in 38 matches, 87 Points, Tata

Goals for Barca:
1994: 91 goals in 38 matches (Romario 30 Goals)
1995: 60 goals in 38 matches, lol (Jordi Cruijff 9, Koeman 9, Stiochkov 9)
1996: 72 goals in 42 matches (Oscar Garcia 10, Kodro 9)
1997: 102 goals in 42 matches (Ronaldo 34 Goals)
1998: 78 Goals in 38 matches (Rivaldo 19, Luis Enrique 18)
1999: 87 Goals in 38 matches (Rivaldo 24, Kluivert 15)
2000: 70 Goals in 38 matches (Kluivert 15)
2001: 80 Goals in 38 matches (Rivaldo 23, Kluivert 18)
2002: 65 Goals in 38 matches (Kluivert 18, Saviola 17)
2003: 63 Goals in 38 matches (Kluivert 16)
2004: 63 Goals in 38 matches (Ronaldinho 14, Saviola 14), LOL
2005: 73 Goals in 38 matches (Etoo 25, Guily 11, Ronaldinho 9), LOL, Champions
2006: 80 Goals in 38 matches (Etoo 26, Ronaldinho 17, Larsson 10), Champions league winners, LOL
2007: 78 Goals in 38 matches (Ronaldinho 21, Messi 14, Etoo 11)
2008: 76 Goals in 38 matches (Etoo 16, Henry 12, Messi 10, Krkic 10, Ronaldinho 8)
2009: 105 Goals in 38 matches (Etoo 30, Messi 23, Henry 19)
2010: 98 Goals in 38 matches (Messi 34, Ibra 16, Pedro 12)
2011: 95 Goals in 38 matches (Messi 31, Villa 18, Pedro 13)
2012: 114 Goals in 38 matches (Real 121 Goals, lol) (Messi 50, Alexis 11, Xavi 10, Fab 9
2013: 115 Goals in 38 matches (LOLOLOLOLOLOLO) (Messi 46, Fab 11, Villa 10, Sanchez 8, Pedro 7, Tello 7)
2014: 100 Goals in 38 matches (Messi 28, Alexis 19, Pedro 15, Neymar 9, Fab 8)

-- so, it is insane to compare the current Goals and stats with stats from 1994, 1998 or 2002.
-- La liga has became a statpading contest for Barca and Real
-- the same is with opponents in cup
-- CL again, smaller teams can't make surprises like 10 or 20 years ago
= in all competitions the influx of money has caused much larger differences between top sides and average sides, and thus, goals and stats from players from Barca and Real have inflated too much

I mean, Barca's best league scorers in Seasons 95 and 96 scored 9 and 10 Goals.
Brasilian Ronaldo scored 34 Goals in 1997. If he played in the current era (where Cristiano manages to score 40-50 La liga Goals), then Brasilian Ronaldo would score 50-60 Goals per Season, lol.
Also, Ronaldinho scored 14 and 9 Goals in 2004 and 2005 in first 2 Seasons where we finished 2nd and the 1st.
So, according to those numbers, Neymar currently looks as twice as good player as Ronaldinho from his first 2 Seasons, lol.

So, saying that Ney is awesome is one thing.
But saying that he is better than (phenomenal) players from prior eras is just waaaaay off.

Again guys, if CR7 scores that many goals today, and Romario, Stoichkov, Brasilian Ronaldo and Rivaldo never came even close.
Don't you think that something is wrong with the current stats?
Rivaldo never scored more than 24 Goals.
And seriously, Rivaldo was a few levels better player than CR7 in all aspects of the game.

 

[dakt]

For me, yesterday he was everything I want from him in Barca. Smart play, releasing the ball right on time, some really nice passes and using his dribbling skills on the final run towards the goal.
Also defensive wise he was really good. Outplayed both Messi and Suarez. Just keep that tempo and all will be fine.