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  1. L

    10 - Lionel Messi - v4

    I didn't say his first touch wasn't really good. I said I don't think he had amongst the best first touches in history. That's not at all an insult. I totally agree with you that he often displays really great first touch. He does what you described on the wing with Alves really often. As I...
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    10 - Lionel Messi - v4

    Yeah, it's hard to really say anything with certainty about someone's first touch. One can always point to examples of great first touches, but then you also see these guys take bad touches. I will say that I actually don't think Messi's first touch is historically great. I've seen his touch...
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    10 - Lionel Messi - v4

    I think what you are saying is mostly about what you'd most like to watch. Iniesta has a certain elegance to him that Messi does not have. Probably because everything Iniesta does seems to be going so much slower. I like watching it too. But he is undoubtedly not as good of a player...
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    10 - Lionel Messi - v4

    The thing is that I just really don't think Messi fans need to cling to things that are only semi-logical when comparing Messi to Ronaldo. We see that all the time in the arguments people make for why Ronaldo is better. But we don't need to do that. Ronaldo is a better penalty taker than...
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    10 - Lionel Messi - v4

    Oh I agree about Holland. I almost went on a rant about that same thing myself. That was the biggest penalty of Messi's career, and he nailed it. I give him tons of credit for that. But if you classify the penalties I listed as pointless, then it's hard to really say that Cristiano has...
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    10 - Lionel Messi - v4

    Those numbers included penalties in penalty shootouts. Perhaps Ronaldo chokes a little on penalties in big moments, since a disproportionate number of his misses seem to have been in important moments. Meanwhile, tons of Messi's missed penalties are in CdR matches. But it's not like Ronaldo...
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    10 - Lionel Messi - v4

    Hahahaha I love it! He's such a clown
  8. L

    10 - Lionel Messi - v4

    I agree to an extent. First of all, people unfairly discount Messi's group stage performance simply because the group looked easy on paper. But the fact is that they would not gotten out of the group without his goals. He really was immense for them. Definitely the best player of the group...
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    10 - Lionel Messi - v4

    Hahaha that celebration is hilarious. I didn't watch last year's CL final (couldn't bear it, since I was pretty sure Real Madrid would win), so I didn't know he did that. Ugh, I do wonder if Ronaldo would've won the Ballon D'or last year if they lost the CL final (which, obviously, they very...
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    10 - Lionel Messi - v4

    To be fair, your math is slightly off, probably because you were accidentally looking at the wrong number in my post. 79% of 90 attempts is 71, but Messi has scored 56 total penalty goals, not 46. So the difference would be about 15, not 25. But it's also important to recognize that Ronaldo...
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    10 - Lionel Messi - v4

    Haha, look at my post history, particularly past posts in Messi threads. I'm very clearly a Messi fan. But being a Messi fan does not require me to believe something that is directly contradicted by the facts. I don't need to wrongly believe Messi's PK conversion rate is as high as Ronaldo's...
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    10 - Lionel Messi - v4

    Fair enough. But the point remains that both players have had big misses. And that is to be expected, given that they take tons of important penalties, and will never make 100% of them.
  13. L

    10 - Lionel Messi - v4

    Huh? Ronaldo DEFINITELY has a better conversion rate. It sounds like you are saying you don't think that's the case, but it unambiguously is. It's not enough of an advantage to fully account for how many more penalty goals Ronaldo has, but it does account for a bit of the difference. I was...
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    10 - Lionel Messi - v4

    I was responding to a question of whether the difference in PK goals comes down to conversion rate. The fact is that, to some degree, it does. Ronaldo makes a higher percent of his penalties than Messi does. You might think Ronaldo has choked more on penalties in big moments, so perhaps Messi...
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    10 - Lionel Messi - v4

    It's not about attacking more. We obviously attack just as much or more than they do. It's about the nature of those attacks. We do not attack as directly as Madrid. Because of this, our attacks are typically against defenses who have filled the box with tons of defenders. When the box is...
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    10 - Lionel Messi - v4

    I'm a huge Messi fan, but it would be delusional to act like Ronaldo is not a better penalty taker. In February of this year, I believe Messi had taken 59 penalties for Barcelona and missed 13 of them. That's only a 78% conversion rate. Back then, I believe Ronaldo had made 87% of his penalties...
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    10 - Lionel Messi - v4

    I agree that Messi is clearly better than Ronaldo. The fact that he scores just as much, while also doing a lot of other stuff Ronaldo does not do makes that quite obvious to me. But it's hard to be MILES ahead of someone who scores 50-60 goals a season. Ronaldo is one of the greatest players...
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    10 - Lionel Messi - v4

    To be fair, Savage actually seemed to be saying he thought Messi was better; he just said he didn't think they were miles apart. And Neville sort of seemed to imply the same thing. He said he thought they were very close, which, given the context of the conversation, I think implies he thinks...
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    11 - Neymar Jr. - v4

    I'm not Brazilian, but my understanding is that most Brazilians rate Romario ahead of Ronaldo.
  20. L

    Barca - Real Sociedad 2-0

    Real down 2-0 and Ronaldo missed a penalty

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