Josep Maria Bartomeu

[Luftstalag14]

They lost Ronaldo and bought Hazard this season.

They will still have to replace Ramos, Marcelo, Kroos, Modric and Benzema before long if they want to get back to being a top top team.

To be fair they also earned a bit of credit as to not having to win due to their CL success. Whle Barca are shit scared of trying to rebuild and piss off Messi when only got a few years left.

Hazard has either been subpar for them or injured, he hasn't been a factor for them this season at all.

Yes they will need to replace those old guards but as I said above, they already have the replacements lined up, many of whom have been tested and proven in first tier leagues such as La Liga and Bundesliga. And again, of course there is no guarantee those replacements will work out well for them but at least they have something. We? An AM in Pedri and a winger in Trincao, what else? So many holes to be filled and we are not even talking about replacing the likes of Messi, Suarez and Pique etc.

 

[JamDav1982]

Hazard has either been subpar for them or injured, he hasn't been a factor for them this season at all.

Yes they will need to replace those old guards but as I said above, they already have the replacements lined up, many of whom have been tested and proven in first tier leagues such as La Liga and Bundesliga. And again, of course there is no guarantee those replacements will work out well for them but at least they have something. We? An AM in Pedri and a winger in Trincao, what else?

They dont have replacements lined up at all. Certainly not currently at the club bar Valverde.

Every young player Real buy folk make out is the second coming and most have then failed.

 

[mc_lovin]

Just because those failed it doesn't mean others will fail (even though some will fail, definitely). If you think their squad depth is mediocre I don't know what ours is. Mediocre times 5?

I just dont get why you already resigned to the fact that Madrid will be on top of us for years to come. Things in football move fast. Buying 5 worldclass talents and loaning them (or keeping them as squad players) rarely works out. It looks good on paper, but we will see how many of them actually materialise as key players.

 

[te amo barca]

Just because those failed it doesn't mean others will fail (even though some will fail, definitely). If you think their squad depth is mediocre I don't know what ours is. Mediocre times 5?

No, we have the same problems, which is exactly what I was saying. I could argue that we have the ?replacements? ready as well (which is not true as it is with Madrid). We did bring in Firpo, Dembele, Arthur, FdJ, Todibo, Araujo, Trincao, promoted Ansu and Puig, had the likes of Malcom and Gomes, Coutinho, and so on.

 

[JamDav1982]

I just dont get why you already resigned to the fact that Madrid will be on top of us for years to come. Things in football move fast. Buying 5 worldclass talents and loaning them (or keeping them as squad players) rarely works out. It looks good on paper, but we will see how many of them actually materialise as key players.

Folk said exact same thing three years ago.

That Barca were done and Real had young team to replace stars... almost all of those young players did not live up to the hype.

Things can change very quickly in football and Real are not as set as some make out.

 

[Luftstalag14]

They dont have replacements lined up at all. Certainly not currently at the club bar Valverde.

Every young player Real buy folk make out is the second coming and most have then failed.

I am taking that you are dismissing all of the following players? Reguilon, Mendy, Odgaard, Vinicius, Rodrygo, Hakimi and Odriozola? All of them won't make it? Why?

 

[Luftstalag14]

I just dont get why you already resigned to the fact that Madrid will be on top of us for years to come. Things in football move fast. Buying 5 worldclass talents and loaning them (or keeping them as squad players) rarely works out. It looks good on paper, but we will see how many of them actually materialise as key players.

Of course I was speculating as everyone is. And of course having something look good on paper doesn't translate into direct success automatically but there is a strong correlation between having a well-planned, talented squad that has depth and success. At least they have got something that looks good. We on the other hand? Already looks in shambles with Messi here, imagine when he is not here and seriously we might run out of money. The last part worries me greatly.

 

[te amo barca]

I am taking that you are dismissing all of the following players? Reguilon, Mendy, Odgaard, Vinicius, Rodrygo, Hakimi and Odriozola? All of them won't make it? Why?

6 of those play at the same position as another one, so half of them automatically won?t make it as starters. Mendy is the only more-or-less certain starter from that batch. Odegaard has to come back and prove he is ready for Madrid. Both Vinicius and Rodrygo have been lacklustre so far and have Hazard playing in their preferred position as well. Odriozola is a nothing player. Hakimi looks quality but he plays as a wingback with 3 CBS behind him or even as a winger as he is mediocre defensively. Not certain he will cut it instead of Carvajal at all.

 

[JamDav1982]

I am taking that you are dismissing all of the following players? Reguilon, Mendy, Odgaard, Vinicius, Rodrygo, Hakimi and Odriozola? All of them won't make it? Why?

Not dismissing but saying long way to go to be replacments in Reals first team.

Bar Hakimi who I doubt Real dump Carvajal for anyway and more chance they sell him than that.

 

[Luftstalag14]

Folk said exact same thing three years ago.

That Barca were done and Real had young team to replace stars... almost all of those young players did not live up to the hype.

Things can change very quickly in football and Real are not as set as some make out.

Because we still had Messi bailing us regularly in the past three years. It is not going to be the same in the next three years or a lot sooner.

 

[JamDav1982]

Because we still had Messi bailing us regularly in the past three years. It is not going to be the same in the next three years or a lot sooner.

No Messi doesnt do it all on his own and was the same player three years ago anyway so folk were making those predictions with Messi in the team.

The point is Real did not dominate and the young players were not as good as was made out.

 

[Luftstalag14]

6 of those play at the same position as another one, so half of them automatically won?t make it as starters. Mendy is the only more-or-less certain starter from that batch. Odegaard has to come back and prove he is ready for Madrid. Both Vinicius and Rodrygo have been lacklustre so far and have Hazard playing in their preferred position as well. Odriozola is a nothing player. Hakimi looks quality but he plays as a wingback with 3 CBS behind him or even as a winger as he is mediocre defensively. Not certain he will cut it instead of Carvajal at all.

6 of them playing in the same position? What do you mean? There are two LBs, two RBs and three FW/AMs in that group.

I think we are a bit disingenuous if we hold such a high bar to judge Real Madrid's players. Hakimi is arguably one of the best RBs in Bundesliga (I didn't watch that many Dortmund games this seasons but the few times I watched he was the standard RB playing along two CBs being Hummels and Akanji. He is definitely better offensively than defensively but the same can be said about most full backs, I'd argue), Odegaard has been one of the best and most influential players for Sociedad this season and Reguilon has been the starting LB in most games for Sevilla. If these guys are not good enough, who is to say the likes of Pedri (Segunda), Trincao (Portugese league) and Araujo etc. would be good?

 

[JamDav1982]

6 of them playing in the same position? What do you mean? There are two LBs, two RBs and three FW/AMs in that group.

I think we are a bit disingenuous if we hold such a high bar to judge Real Madrid's players. Hakimi is arbubaly of the best RBs in Bundesliga (I didn't watch that many Dortmund games this seasons but the few times I watched he was the standard RB playing along two CBs being Hummels and Akanji. He is definitely better offensively than defensively but the same can be said about most full backs, I'd argue), Odegaard has been one of the best and influential players for Sociedad this season and Reguilon has been the starting LB in most games for Sevilla. If these guys are not good enough, who is to say the likes of Pedri (Segunda), Trincao (Portugese league) and Araujo etc. would be good?

Hakimi has been playing right midfield for majority of season. He is good player but unlikely to oust Carvajal any time soon.

Massive difference for Odegaard between top player in Sociedad team built to him and on all set pieces etc to becoming a key player for Real.

Regulion is decent and pacey but will never be starter at Real.

Ordiozola is shite and will most likely be sold at a loss.

 

[El Gato]

Dont get me wrong, I hate our strategy, but Reals has yet to bear fruits as well. Hakimi and Odegaard are not sure bets. Neither are Fati or Trincao and the likes. We will see how things turn out, and financially I agree with you, but betting on talent is a dangerous game.

What fruits would you expect at this stage if you were an RM fan? Or last season?

Last season we found at least one replacement at LB, this season we found another. We continued to wind down contracts of players who are past it, but can't be kicked out because they still have something to give provided they don't play in exactly the same setup all the time (i.e. slot in Mendy, Valverde, Hazard and Asensio at different times). These vets stop being seen as a problem if a manager and the board treat them with merit, meaning they don't get played when they're a reason for us losing (Marcelo) and they don't get unwarranted extensions (Modric). You think they're a problem because we're not winning? Fair enough. How do you explain most literate fans being happy with how we're being run and the opposite being the case at Barca?

Talent is always a gamble, but it's better than barely anything like Barca are. And when you're doing it responsibly, you can't help but be optimistic. It's understanding of a strategic gamble. If it's just Messi's titles that reassure of a being level with us, then I don't understand how you can be more certain things will be OK going forward when you take that away.

Ronaldo does not have same ties to Real as Messi does to Barca. It is not even close.

He also wanted to leave and add to his CV another league win in another country.

Why do these ties matter so much? Raul, a club legend, got binned when it got ridiculous. Iker did as well, as he should have. SAF binned Keane. Inter fell on their own sword by keeping the people who delivered their CL after Mou left. These are difficult decisions, but it's in everyone else's interest to make them. Messi is 33 and people really want to believe he is worth sacrificing another 3 years of recruitment by buying players who must at least be able to be shoehorned into positions around him as he gets older and older? While also staying behind the status of other vets?

They had ?replacements? like Hernandez, Vallejo, Llorente, Kovacic and Ceballos who all failed. The Brazilian wonder kids may flop easily. Their squad and depth are mediocre.

Forgot to add Isco to the old core. That guy is also dead.

Theo is doing great at Milan, Llorente is currently immense at Atleti, Kovacic great at Chelsea, Ceballos is up in the air in a shit Arsenal side. Vallejo is still 23 and already experienced quite a bit, while also playing well vs the likes of Juve, his problem is being a glass boy so it's as stupid to call him a failure as it is to say Hazard is a flop. None are failures, only never been better than their seniors at Real. Easy to jump to these words.

Isco isn't dead as he showed vs City. He's just a squad guy who never reached the level he was slated to get to.

 

[JamDav1982]

What fruits would you expect at this stage if you were an RM fan? Or last season?

Last season we found at least one replacement at LB, this season we found another. We continued to wind down contracts of players who are past it, but can't be kicked out because they still have something to give provided they don't play in exactly the same setup all the time (i.e. slot in Mendy, Valverde, Hazard and Asensio at different times). These vets stop being seen as a problem if a manager and the board treat them with merit, meaning they don't get played when they're a reason for us losing (Marcelo) and they don't get unwarranted extensions (Modric). You think they're a problem because we're not winning? Fair enough. How do you explain most literate fans being happy with how we're being run and the opposite being the case at Barca?

Talent is always a gamble, but it's better than barely anything like Barca are. And when you're doing it responsibly, you can't help but be optimistic. It's understanding of a strategic gamble. If it's just Messi's titles that reassure of a being level with us, then I don't understand how you can be more certain things will be OK going forward when you take that away.



Why do these ties matter so much? Raul, a club legend, got binned when it got ridiculous. Iker did as well, as he should have. SAF binned Keane. Inter fell on their own sword by keeping the people who delivered their CL after Mou left. These are difficult decisions, but it's in everyone else's interest to make them. Messi is 33 and people really want to believe he is worth sacrificing another 3 years of recruitment by buying players who must at least be able to be shoehorned into positions around him as he gets older and older? While also staying behind the status of other vets?

Raul was on the decline and Ronaldo was better player also drastic actions taken as Barca team emerged at such a high level from nowhere.

Getting rid of Raul was seen as ruthless but not a massive deal as Real had moved on to a new team.

Cant compare Ronaldo/Raul leaving to Messi. Not the same at all.