Copa America 2019

[Messigician]

Feel free to kill me but Argentina problem is Messi
Messi needs to be part of the whole not the player to build the team on , he is the ace , the trump card , hell even the super-sub who can win the match with a freekick
he is no Maradonna , he lacks the personality that motivate others he ain't not captain
Current Argentina needs to play their collective game , speedy one too with all the youth they have
I'll repeat what i said on twitter it's easy for Messi to be normal , it's impossible to ask 10 players to be on Messi wave length
giving the ball to Messi don't work on INT level , works for Barca in la liga and not in Europe too


that's what i believe.. you may not agree but it gets pretty frustrating watching them

Yikes spot the Madrid fan. Messi is literally carrying this rubbish team to 4 finals. If his teammates weren't crap thats 4 finals potentially won.

I habe no idea how you think Messi is the biggest problem when the defence is completely shambolic, the modified can't string passes together and Aguero and pals go missing on the regular. Messi is the least of their problems

 

[eaman]

Feel free to kill me but Argentina problem is Messi
Messi needs to be part of the whole not the player to build the team on , he is the ace , the trump card , hell even the super-sub who can win the match with a freekick
he is no Maradonna , he lacks the personality that motivate others he ain't not captain
Current Argentina needs to play their collective game , speedy one too with all the youth they have
I'll repeat what i said on twitter it's easy for Messi to be normal , it's impossible to ask 10 players to be on Messi wave length
giving the ball to Messi don't work on INT level , works for Barca in la liga and not in Europe too


that's what i believe.. you may not agree but it gets pretty frustrating watching them

Part of the problem is they don't get the ball to Messi enough like Barca do. I'm not talking about when he is being marked by 3 but a few times in the last couple of games I saw them not passing to him at the right times like the Barca players mostly do. The more he is on the ball the more chance they have of creating chances

 

[soul24rage]

One of the main issues I have is that Scaloni makes the wrong subs at the wrong time during Argentina's best moments.

-The beg. of the 2nd half vs Colombia, Argentina looked better and Scaloni killed it off with his substitution of Suarez for Aguero. Why not Martinez for Aguero when Suarez usually plays as a LF for River.
-The beg. of the 2nd half vs Paraguay with Martinez and Aguero up front with Messi slightly behind, Argentina looked better, but the sub of Di Maria for Martinez again killed the momentum.

I give big credit to Scaloni for the subs he made right at half time with Di Maria off for De Paul vs Colombia and Pereyra off for Aguero vs Paraguay.
Hopefully he learns from this and not make subs during Argentina's best moments unless it is absolutely necessary vs Qatar.

 

[Hardy]

at the end of the day Tata Martino was gold for them, and he's doing great with Mexico as well

 

[Beast]

Yikes spot the Madrid fan. Messi is literally carrying this rubbish team to 4 finals. If his teammates weren't crap thats 4 finals potentially won.

I habe no idea how you think Messi is the biggest problem when the defence is completely shambolic, the modified can't string passes together and Aguero and pals go missing on the regular. Messi is the least of their problems

4 finals , different teams , same results , No Higuain to blame yet same results
this one is completely different
maybe just maybe it's time to use Messi is a weapon not someone to build the team on ...been there done that and the results says it all

I'm one of the people who value tactics over players so yes i think Messi is a problem , they think he can do it all he can't
in fact it makes beating Argentina one of the easiest jobs in the world , block the pass to Messi , block his way ..because they always give him the ball always

They should have built the teams as if he isn't who he is and he play as part of the machine not the entire machine

 

[Beast]

Part of the problem is they don't get the ball to Messi enough like Barca do. I'm not talking about when he is being marked by 3 but a few times in the last couple of games I saw them not passing to him at the right times like the Barca players mostly do. The more he is on the ball the more chance they have of creating chances

And the more it's easy and predictable to stop them

look at it from the other team perspective

Do you know where the Argies will pass the ball ?
Do you know who they will rely on for a goal ?

 

[serghei]

Feel free to kill me but Argentina problem is Messi
Messi needs to be part of the whole not the player to build the team on , he is the ace , the trump card , hell even the super-sub who can win the match with a freekick
he is no Maradonna , he lacks the personality that motivate others he ain't not captain
Current Argentina needs to play their collective game , speedy one too with all the youth they have
I'll repeat what i said on twitter it's easy for Messi to be normal , it's impossible to ask 10 players to be on Messi wave length
giving the ball to Messi don't work on INT level , works for Barca in la liga and not in Europe too


that's what i believe.. you may not agree but it gets pretty frustrating watching them

Argentina would probably be crap anyway no matter what route they take. Give it to Messi or not, they are just poorly managed and have a very uneven team. I wouldn't say Messi is their problem, but he surely ain't their savior either. If anything, Argies problem is that they kind of expect Messi to save them instead of starting to bring the pieces back together on a collective level.

I would say team wise they are certainly behind Brazil, Uruguay and Colombia, and are probably around Chile level.

Btw, they were totally crap without Messi when he wasn't there. Would've probably failed to even make it to Russia 2018 World Cup.

 

[CatalinR10]

Feel free to kill me but Argentina problem is Messi
Messi needs to be part of the whole not the player to build the team on , he is the ace , the trump card , hell even the super-sub who can win the match with a freekick
he is no Maradonna , he lacks the personality that motivate others he ain't not captain
Current Argentina needs to play their collective game , speedy one too with all the youth they have
I'll repeat what i said on twitter it's easy for Messi to be normal , it's impossible to ask 10 players to be on Messi wave length
giving the ball to Messi don't work on INT level , works for Barca in la liga and not in Europe too


that's what i believe.. you may not agree but it gets pretty frustrating watching them

have you watched the last 2 games ?

Your asking something Argentina can't do. They can't even make 4 passes in a row without losing the ball. I have never seen 2 games in a row of such a low low level. It was like watching a 2nd league game from my country. Utterly disgusting. Their only chance of winning is giving the ball to Messi and pray he pulls something out of hiss ass. Without him they wouldn't even be at the last World Cup.

 

[wisconsincule]

Suarez with a wide open header straight at the keeper. Nothing to see here.

 

[Blaugrana Bull]

Beast is right. I was mentioning that last season too after a Barca game.
Messi is a blessing and a curse. If everything is build around him, it is rather easy for the opposing team to stop the whole attack.
But it is obviously not his fault some managers give him the burden to carry the whole team by himself.

There is no question Messi should be the main man in every team. But there is a difference between that and asking him to be a one man show.

 

[JerseyAddict]

Suarez with a wide open header straight at the keeper. Nothing to see here.

And now total panic mode. 2 injuries. Japan took a lead. Some strange move by Godin. Possible penalty.

Urugvaj is in panic mode.

VAR to the rescue.

 

[abbbs97]

Feel free to kill me but Argentina problem is Messi
Messi needs to be part of the whole not the player to build the team on , he is the ace , the trump card , hell even the super-sub who can win the match with a freekick
he is no Maradonna , he lacks the personality that motivate others he ain't not captain
Current Argentina needs to play their collective game , speedy one too with all the youth they have
I'll repeat what i said on twitter it's easy for Messi to be normal , it's impossible to ask 10 players to be on Messi wave length
giving the ball to Messi don't work on INT level , works for Barca in la liga and not in Europe too


that's what i believe.. you may not agree but it gets pretty frustrating watching them

You have to look at how truly bad Argentina's team is to see that Messi is not the problem here. If they had even a semi decent coach, they wouldnt be as bad as they are now. The system in which they play in is horrible. Their coach set his team up in a very wrong way.

I mean, look at this video and then tell me how Messi is the weak link.
https://twitter.com/SweeperWriter/status/1141784347076259840

And this isnt even the worst of it. The Argentina team could barely string two passes together. They are truly awful and Messi isn't the problem.

 

[eaman]

And the more it's easy and predictable to stop them

look at it from the other team perspective

Do you know where the Argies will pass the ball ?
Do you know who they will rely on for a goal ?

Yes but they are not creating very much when he doesn't get the ball. Nearly all their dangerous moments in the first two games came through him. He should not be blamed for their lack of goals anyway. He is taking players out of the game for his teammates and they still do very little

 

[MagIX]

Feel free to kill me but Argentina problem is Messi
Messi needs to be part of the whole not the player to build the team on , he is the ace , the trump card , hell even the super-sub who can win the match with a freekick
he is no Maradonna , he lacks the personality that motivate others he ain't not captain
Current Argentina needs to play their collective game , speedy one too with all the youth they have
I'll repeat what i said on twitter it's easy for Messi to be normal , it's impossible to ask 10 players to be on Messi wave length
giving the ball to Messi don't work on INT level , works for Barca in la liga and not in Europe too


that's what i believe.. you may not agree but it gets pretty frustrating watching them

I agree, but Messi is not the problem per se.
The problem is who do not understand that, those who continue to build a team around Messi (not only in NT, but also with Barcelona)
Messi should be a part of a working system, a "simply" added value, he would perform much better.
Without a team, without a working system, no one wins. If you want to win, the team is more important than the names. There is no such thing as a player who alone makes a team win.
Error is only human, but to persist in it, is diabolical. How it's possible to keep making the same mistake again and again ?

 

[MagIX]

4 finals , different teams , same results , No Higuain to blame yet same results
this one is completely different
maybe just maybe it's time to use Messi is a weapon not someone to build the team on ...been there done that and the results says it all

I'm one of the people who value tactics over players so yes i think Messi is a problem , they think he can do it all he can't
in fact it makes beating Argentina one of the easiest jobs in the world , block the pass to Messi , block his way ..because they always give him the ball always

They should have built the teams as if he isn't who he is and he play as part of the machine not the entire machine

Anyway great result if a team reached 4 finals by playing a system based on 1 man (Messi)... that means this player is out of this world, an alien (and btw with a little bit more luck Arg could have won a final). But i do not think so, 2007 Messi was 20 y.o, 2014 Arg reached the final more with luck than merit.

But i agree "They should have built the teams as if he isn't who he is and he play as part of the machine not the entire machine": this is the summary (and solution) of all the problems of Argentina (and of Barcelona).