Quique Setien

[serghei]

Eduardo Camavinga.

Don't know him, but if he fits the profile of a Mascherano - Kante - Casemiro type, he is the right profile.

 

[FC433]

^
I agree against top teams. But we should be fine with 90% of our games. I absolutely love Guendouzi and I think he would be a great addition.

 

[El Gato]

There is Aubameyang as another option or L. Martínez and play AG as RF while Dembele as LW.
Either Ruiz or Guendouzi (could include either Umtiti or Alba in the deal)

Auba is old. While Semedo is clearly a blockhead.

 

[serghei]

We should be looking at the Ligue 1 market. That's where the players with very good physical game are, after EPL which is basically good but very pricey stuff.

Even Bundesliga is a good market.

 

[FC433]

Auba is old. While Semedo is clearly a blockhead.

I agree. I actually prefer an actual LW since I believe that Griezmann is good enough as a CF. There is Son, but I cannot see him leaving Spurs. There are other young talents, but we already got Fati.

Semedo is decent. We should not replace him unless we receive a good offer (at least 50m), and we have already got three talented RBs. I do not believe that there is any available better option in the market.

Can you suggest some names, please?

 

[henias]

If you really want that 4231 or 4213, you have to play with proper wingers and strikers, and no bullshit double SS. Your attacking trio has to be extremely lethal with every pass from Messi or the midfield which makes it effective because then theres no point playing 4 attackers. Alba will be more in a defensive phase, because we could be vulnerable at the back. Griezmann is slow, and must leave as well. I dont think it's a good idea trying to force him in positions he cant thrive in if we wanna properly rebuild and assemble a proper team. Has to be fast paced and direct, that includes counter attacking.

I don't think we will ever go wrong with 433. It's more of Messi not being able to translate his efforts into goalscoring threats; rather than him being a positional problem when playing without a striker and winger, or both wingers. The pace and goal threat is a must. It's the same when it comes to Argentina without proper wingers; him leading the attack so deep but was useless in the end.

It doesnt matter if he plays false 9 or AM. He needs the right players and ingredients.

My lineup:

CF/Martinez - Messi - Dembele/RW
Arthur- Dejong
CDM/Destroyer type
Alba - CB - CB - Semedo

 

[Tackle]

Why is Dembele being pencilled in as a starter in all these lineups? You lot think the winger market is that bare or what?

 

[DonAK]

Why is Dembele being pencilled in as a starter in all these lineups? You lot think the winger market is that bare or what?

Trying to minimize the cost of signing all these players if you're also signing Neymar. Can be another RW though, put forward some names.

 

[serghei]

I think we need a platform that can help us to forge and develop these players, so we will cut the middle man (teams who sell these players at super-high prices) who makes the big money out of these deals. Or if not cut them completely, since it's impossible, at least become less dependent on these clubs as the main supplier of talent. The clubs who make the big money from players ins and outs are the tier B clubs, like Dortmund, Ajax, Porto, Monaco etc, who are good enough to play at a high level consistently, but not great enough to be demanded to win the big titles year after year.

The challenge is getting a good enough management team (board + manager + technical staff) to get the most out of the majority of the players we have in the squad, while also winning titles (which goes without saying it's a major objective of every elite club).

 

[serghei]

It's time to realize that the less you have exclusive access to the finest talents, the more important management becomes. More money, means more buyers for the B level clubs, means higher chances to pay a lot of money for talent. Not certainty, but simply potential. The apparition of oil teams, have cut off the influence elite and rich clubs like Barcelona and Madrid had over the B level sides. This means it is almost impossible to build galactico sides anymore, so this business model is going out of fashion fast. Especially for clubs who have to keep a real balance between income and expenditure.

I'm telling you that if this Camavinga player is a solid talent, Rennes will slap us with a 70m. figure at the first inquiry. Before we know it we're tied to another 70m. gamble, on top of all the gambles we've taken.

And also, we make fun of Wolfe, and he makes fun of us, and it's banter, but the main thing I really like about Madrid is that they very rarely completely give up on talented young players. They have much more patience with young players, and much less patience with managers they feel are not right for them. They are ahead of the curve, in this sense. They know that a 25m. talent in the hands of a top manager has more chances to make it than a 80m. talent in the hands of an average manager.

I bet there is not a talent they've signed in the last 3-4 years or a player they've developed that is not in some way or with some clause still tied to them. You never know when that player might get it together.

 

[Xaviniesta]

3 games...with a depleted attack...

Im gonna wait a bit more before I make any conclusions

 

[serghei]

Which is why, when you get a chance at a talent some really big teams are after, like Todibo, and you get him for fucking free almost, and he shows qualities, just play him and develop him. Don't loan him before you even give him a fair shot.

 

[Tackle]

Trying to minimize the cost of signing all these players if you're also signing Neymar. Can be another RW though, put forward some names.

Going after Neymar means binning both Dembele and Coutinho by default. It's the only way to make the transfer fee and wages work. A proper ST signing would eat up the rest of the transfer budget. Ideally you'd ship of Griezmann as well to finance it, but that won't be happening.

In this scenario we could see an attack next season of:

Neymar-New ST/Suarez-Griezmann
---------Messi-------------------------

I don't see an other realistic outcome considering our circumstances. We don't have much room to maneveur and rebuilding is not an overnight process. Pique, Alba and Busi will also be here next season still and most likely starting as well.

We would still desperately need a true attacking CM after all this of course. Honestly if PSG or United are willing to offer upwards of 100m for Arthur I'd take that money and run. Use it to bring in that attacking mid.

 

[khaled_a_d]

With Messi's positioning I think the best system for Barca would be ten Hag's 4-2-1-3 where Messi can have a free role and make his runs forward to the box like Donny van de Beek without screwing Barca over by playing with one less winger.

You also get to play Frenkie in his best position. In a flexible double pivot where he got the freedom to roam.

You get two wingers who can create width and win 1v1 and create from the flanks. You get one CF to occupy the CBs.

What it means is less control, but if you want more control you simply sub out the RW and put Messi there and bring in a midfielder like Arthur.

Something like this:

ter Stegen

Emerson - Athletic CB - CB - Alba

Camavinga - de Jong

Messi

Dembele/Griezmann - CF - Neymar

Suddenly a way faster, way more athletic team that's able to press better, physical double pivot with Fdj and Camavinga and a team that doesn't need Messi to save the way for it to work since it's more balanced by actually playing two players on the flank and a proper CF.

Won't happen IRL, but at least I can do this in FM 20

Pretty much most of our away games, heck even some home guys.

This team also need a 2008 Pep style rebuild of the squad.

This team need at least:

2 CBs - I like Upamecano and Koulibaly if he can be had for 60-70m
1 RB - I guess Emerson, no clue here
1 CDM - I like Camavinga, but PSG/RM will prob sign him lol
1 Attacking CM - Dunno
1 CF - Lautaro/Werner/I don't know, but we need someone that doesn't have chronic knee issues like Suarez
1 Winger, preferably a LW - They're 100% going to re-sign Neymar

Too bad we don't have the money for it, and even if we do they're going to spend it all on some Valencia and Sevilla players

You are making some good points in your last couple of posts here. But this is a Rijkaard type of rebuild. Pep retooled an elite team but never really had to rebuild it. He added only 2 starters in market in 2008 (Pique and Alves)
Rijkaard rebuilt in 2 summers, and through the work in first one he was able to achieve relative success in his 1st year.
I think the first thing is to decide where we want to play Messi, Messi should comfortably be starter here for 2 or 3 years. this is where it all starts IMO

Honestly, I think Messi best position is 2nd striker. So 442 or 532 is the way to go with him. This is the only position where he neither interfer so much with our flow of the game (he slows us badly when he is a play maker, there is a reason there is no number 10 in modern football) and can play his best.
But if we are willing to pay 4 2 3 1 or any 433 derivative it will be different and he will need to accept he should play out of his comfort game.

We have 4 good starters IMO:
MATS, FDJ,Messi & Griezmann. We have acceptable/borderline starters in Alba/Pique/Lenglet/(Roberto/Semedo) & Arthur and we have fine rotation players in Suarez/Vidal/Busquets. Then we have the hopefuls in Fati/Pedri/Emerson and may be Todibo /Araujo.
The key here is to balance, we don't need to bring 2 starting CBs right away, but we can't keep them as our starters. We can't keep all borderline starters in starting XI, but it would be acceptable to keep few of them.
I would honestly prioritize rebuilding defense above anything in summer. Söyüncü is still my top choice for a guy to walk into our starting CB position, bring a RB (may be Atal?). For DM I would look for Ndidi or Camavinga. Fabian Ruiz should be a priority too.
I would try to live with the pain of watching Suarez as number 9 tbh rather than buying a true striker who takes all transfer budget. I am starting to warm up to the idea of Werner tbh but I would prefer a winger if we are playing with 3 attackers.
So 2 starting defenders, at least one starting midfielders or 2 and may be 1 starting attackers. So overall 4 starters could elevate this team if they are right choice
But with this board, it will be another big signing in attack to bribe the fans and make them happy.

 

[serghei]

Pep rebuilt it as well over the course of 2 seasons.

In his 2011 side we had Mascherano, Villa, Pedro, Alves, Busquets, Pique as new players compared with Rijkaard era. That's 6/10 outfield players.

Fabian Ruiz is a great example of 'not like this'. Why didn't we sign him from Betis and allowed him to go to a team that didn't sell Koulibaly for 100m? Imagine the humongous price tag they will set for Ruiz. Ruiz will be a luxury signing now, not an affordable one.