La Liga 2019/20

Who will win La Liga?


  • Total voters
    68

KingLeo10

Senior Member
Hazard for all this hype has accomplished very little, primarily because he lacks end product and is not an assist machine either. He's the much less effective KDB. I don't even think he's had any remarkable CL performances or national team performances in all these years.

Griezmann by comparison has showing his worth v Barcelona, Bayern Munich, Germany etc. to name a few. Yes, he's not a good fit for Barca's current setup but still I know which of the two I'd bet on to come good in money time.
 

messi2140

6racies Xavi
Wolfe reaction when Real won La Liga but then realizes that Big Benz was the MVP

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Morten

Senior Member
Hazard for all this hype has accomplished very little, primarily because he lacks end product and is not an assist machine either. He's the much less effective KDB. I don't even think he's had any remarkable CL performances or national team performances in all these years.

Griezmann by comparison has showing his worth v Barcelona, Bayern Munich, Germany etc. to name a few. Yes, he's not a good fit for Barca's current setup but still I know which of the two I'd bet on to come good in money time.


He hasnt accomplished what his potential suggests, perhaps, but to say he hasnt accomplished much is dumb.
His league play for Chelsea was good, they would not have won the recent PL-titles without him, and he has been PL player of the season, or runner-up on several occasions.
His end product isnt exactly terrible, if you combine goals and assists, nevermind chance creation.

Okay, so he has been underwhelming in the CL, but he has operated at a high level in the PL for years, thats undeniable.
 

El Gato

Villarato!
Like others mentioned if he manages 20 gaols next season thats decent.

Decent? That'd be his career high and top production number for his type of a winger. He'd outdo peak Di Maria, Robben, Ribery and most other world-class wingers not geared towards scoring, but creating offensive plays.

Ridiculous ask that. People need to pipe down with number demands. Yes, 2 goals is clearly poor, even for his type of player, but 15 is the standard number to aim for which would be great. And as a result Real need the rest of the goals to come from striker(s) - ~30-40 between two and the inside forward from the RW - ~20-30. That'd add up to about 70-80 goals from the strikeforce, so add 15-20 from the rest of midfield and defenders on set pieces. Math don't lie. We need a scoring right winger.

This season we got away with splitting the number between all squad members. It won't work twice. Therefore Asensio, Jović, Rodrygo and Vinicius will be looked at. Because they need to be these players. And not Hazard.
Or more correctly, they should be these players in 20/21, but if it doesn't work, shit happens. We wait for Mbappe.

I know which of the two I'd bet on to come good in money time.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but he's not really ever done much in crunch time other than missing penos against Navas has he?
 
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KingLeo10

Senior Member
Decent? That'd be his career high and top production number for his type of a winger. He'd outdo peak Di Maria, Robben, Ribery and most other world-class wingers not geared towards scoring, but creating offensive plays.

Ridiculous ask that. People need to pipe down with number demands. Yes, 2 goals is clearly poor, even for his type of player, but 15 is the standard number to aim for which would be great. And as a result Real need the rest of the goals to come from striker(s) - ~30-40 between two and the inside forward from the RW - ~20-30. That'd add up to about 60-70 goals from the strikeforce, so add 15-20 from the rest of midfield and defenders on set pieces. Math don't lie.

This season we got away with splitting the number between all squad members. It won't work twice. Therefore Asensio, Jović, Rodrygo and Vinicius will be looked at. Because they need to be these players. And not Hazard.



Correct me if I'm wrong, but he's not really ever done much in crunch time other than missing penos against Navas has he?

Scored CL KO goals to eliminate Barcelona and Bayern Munich (at the Allianz when they were the strongest team in the world no less). Eliminated Germany.

His big game penalty record is above average too. He's scored them at Euro and WC KO level (Argentina, WC final etc.). He's missed in the CL final and Euro final. CR7 has missed a penalty in a CL final and 2 CL semi-finals and we consider him one of the best at spot kicks. Not suggesting he's CR7 level at spot kicks but you're allowed a miss or two.

Hazard is a nothing player in big time by comparison.
 
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El Gato

Villarato!
Fair enough.
Though Hazard did play #1 in a team with no #1 for 6 years when clearly being #2 guy at best, so not sure how much of a 'nothing' that really makes him. Especially since Chelsea never have 2 strong seasons in a row as a team.

He's got a knock-off Marcelo-on-the-wing type of influence - he's best when you don't really ever expect it to be him that kills the other team. Even in that Belgium WC 2018 run I thought he'd never work if he didn't have De Bruyne in the side.
 

KingLeo10

Senior Member
Fair enough.
Though Hazard did play #1 in a team with no #1 for 6 years when clearly being #2 guy at best, so not sure how much of a 'nothing' that really makes him. Especially since Chelsea never have 2 strong seasons in a row as a team.

He's got a knock-off Marcelo-on-the-wing type of influence - he's best when you don't really ever expect it to be him that kills the other team. Even in that Belgium WC 2018 run I thought he'd never work if he didn't have De Bruyne in the side.

I agree with a lot of your points there.

I was actually a fan of Hazard when he was not at RM because his playing style is similar to Messi and Neymar (all 3 had monstrous dribbling numbers at their best). The problem is those big games lend towards players with a varied arsenal. This is where Griezmann has the advantage.

This has also been Messi's shortcomings in the CL in the last 2-3 years after his physical decline where he can't just terrorize defences as he used to when man marked/ shadowed all game. CR7 has excelled by contrast because he has way more tools to score from, including being better at spot kicks.

Btw, Mbappe is that type of player with the varied arsenal I fear. Much more than you guys buying Neymar when you were linked to him. Neymar is basically another version of Hazard outside of his 14/15 left-forward, behind the defense stint.
 

Morten

Senior Member
Now, i dont love Neymar, but he is clearly a better player than Hazard, even if you take 14/15 out of it.
That said, happy we didnt get him, simply not worth it.
 

Tackle

Senior Member
I agree with a lot of your points there.

I was actually a fan of Hazard when he was not at RM because his playing style is similar to Messi and Neymar (all 3 had monstrous dribbling numbers at their best). The problem is those big games lend towards players with a varied arsenal. This is where Griezmann has the advantage.

This has also been Messi's shortcomings in the CL in the last 2-3 years after his physical decline where he can't just terrorize defences as he used to when man marked/ shadowed all game. CR7 has excelled by contrast because he has way more tools to score from, including being better at spot kicks.

Btw, Mbappe is that type of player with the varied arsenal I fear. Much more than you guys buying Neymar when you were linked to him. Neymar is basically another version of Hazard outside of his 14/15 left-forward, behind the defense stint.

Mbappe's pace is certainly a big advantage, but other than that what sort of variation in attack does he offer? He is not the main PK taker for either club or NT, he does not take free-kicks, he hardly has an aerial presence either.

He will obviously develop some more skills as he progresses, but as of now Neymar is the much more dangerous attacking threat. Just watch a few PSG matches or ask their fans. They know who their number 1 man is.
 

El Gato

Villarato!
@KingLeo10
Yes, so Griezmann is possibly better at producing tangibles and being a more reliable player to ultimately directly influence the score. Which might make people feel like he's a better signing, but IMO it really isn't when you're always going to be working double time trying to find him a place in the side with other stubborn dudes, who will not give way even if it's with net benefit to the team. While Hazard at least is playing in his intended spot since he came in and is only missing the right counterpart on the other side.

Neither are actually terrible deals, but both are deemed so due to unfavorable circumstances with which players themselves have little to do with.

Barca need a board who will make a sporting project, on the assumption of either razed ground and all amigos binned, or diplomacy, which will free up the RF position for Griez.
Real need to stop pretending Benzema and a big name LW will produce enough, cut playing PR games pretending Bale is worth anything only to fend off Marca bitching and whining how he's leeching off the club's coffers (highlighting their extension decision that was terrible in hindsight in 2017 made only as a reward rather than with future or actual sporting assessment in mind) thereby keeping better RWs out of the side, and open up about the need for RW scorer, which will allow Hazard to be a net benefit.

Both players are good signings on the assumption changes are made to accommodate them. Barca fail about 5x more at doing that bit though, because you could have Coutinho and Dembele both serve their intended purpose if appropriate sacrifices were made, and there's zero sign this will happen. Real at least are keeping up the pretense of waiting for 2021 where many players will be out of contract and Mbappe will have 1 year left. There's planning to it. No planning by Barto and his cronies on the other hand to drive their own transfer operations.
 
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Horatio

You're welcome
Still weird for me to think Hazard plays for Real. Barely hear people talk about him as if the transfer never happened. And some of the times I watched Real by coincidence he wasnt playing. I dont see him used in football promotions either and my friends that are madridista never bring up his name over whatsapp. Sometimes I feel I am living an episode of the twilight zone.

His injury prolly has a lot to do with this.
 
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serghei

Senior Member
At least we gave the goal of the season. Something to take away from this season.

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Probably one of the best 10 goals I've seen live in my life.
 

Vilarrubi

New member
Javi Gracia named as Valencia manager for next 2 seasons. One less team for Valverde to go to, guess he’s waiting for Bayern, City or similar to come calling.
 

Vilarrubi

New member
At least we gave the goal of the season. Something to take away from this season.

7ac6375cb3c190378ca8918a3df8a95d.gif


Probably one of the best 10 goals I've seen live in my life.

Kluivert had a similar one for us against Mallorca too but the build up play before the goal on Suarez’s was unreal. Both class.

 

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