11 - Ousmane Dembélé - V1

[Laplacian]

Lmao Martial swap. Dembele can play on either wings, is a playmaker, and a dribbler (the type that can break through several men during a single run). And you want to replace him with martial? I mean Martial's awesome but he's nowhere near Dembele.

Martial is so one footed and a subpar passer, meanwhile can split defenses with either feet. Come on bro, at least suggest a better swap.

 

[xXKonan]

When you compare him to the other French talents like Mbappe, Dembele and Coman I consider him to have a bit more talent than Coman but the problem is out of the four he has the worst attitude and it's not even a contest.

Coman is talented as well but what makes him a better player right now isn't down to individual skill but the attitude to succeed. Marital is very talented but his attitude is awful. Sure Mou is a giant hardass who isn't all that great with young talent but Martial should be working hard and not sulking when things aren't going his way.

 

[Ken_rosseneri]

Pep would get the best in Dembele not this coach.. damn i want EV gone with every bit of bone in me..

 

[Laplacian]

TBF on Martial, i think people just characterize him as a "sulker" because of his facial expressions and body language. His previous coaches from Lyon and Monaco have always said about him "looks nonchalant but will always try his best." His form dipped sure but I don't think it's fair to say he doesnt work hard. in almost all of the games I've watched of him, he's always driving against defenders and making runs behind the defense (but teammates rarely catch those runs). Tracks back quite a decent amount. He's not Lingard type workhorse but its just not fair to say he lacks drive.

The problem with Martial is that he lacks the talent to create plays like a playmaker (Dembele, messi, hazard), or the tactical nuance to observe the game - and honestly those are the type of forwards that strive under Mourinho due to his "improv" approach. In a more rigorous system like Man City or Tuchel's Dortmund, he'd be fantastic.

 

[Maxim4]

the trident attack of France.

 

[FCBfan22]

the trident attack of France.

Hopefully two of those will also be 2/3 of Barca's attack, whith Messi being the 1/3.

 

[Laplacian]

i pray griez will replac suarez instead of dembouz

 

[Givenchy]

TBF on Martial, i think people just characterize him as a "sulker" because of his facial expressions and body language. His previous coaches from Lyon and Monaco have always said about him "looks nonchalant but will always try his best." His form dipped sure but I don't think it's fair to say he doesnt work hard. in almost all of the games I've watched of him, he's always driving against defenders and making runs behind the defense (but teammates rarely catch those runs). Tracks back quite a decent amount. He's not Lingard type workhorse but its just not fair to say he lacks drive.

The problem with Martial is that he lacks the talent to create plays like a playmaker (Dembele, messi, hazard), or the tactical nuance to observe the game - and honestly those are the type of forwards that strive under Mourinho due to his "improv" approach. In a more rigorous system like Man City or Tuchel's Dortmund, he'd be fantastic.

Martial is Salah 2.0 once he gets away from Moureen he'll explode onto the scene as a potential top 3 future player, just like Mbappe and Dembele. i hope we don't make the same mistake as United by letting EV have a say on this matter. in most cases it should rest with the manager but after that Rome debacle i don't trust the fucker.

 

[Barcilliant]

Valverde is such a pussy, how the hell did we hire this guy? If a naked Stormy Daniels came in front of him he would probably fall asleep. As uninspiring as they come.

Potential wise Dembele has the highest ceiling of all the youth

 

[Jägermeister]

[MENTION=16942]BBZ8800[/MENTION] ok, I get what you mean, although I don't see the marking thing not as big of a problem as you do.
But if what you say is true, then what would you suggest we should play? Messi on the wing doesn't work imo, because he lost lots of his acceleration and pace (as well as some of his ability to beat players 1on1 or 1on2) and on top of that doesn't contribute defensively, which would give the opponents Lb a huge advantage going forward.
If he plays false 9 or in cf position, according to your analysis he will be taken out of the game. So if that is the case we should play him AM with a new no.9 in front?! Again i believe his lack of movement would really hurt us there.
The best solution (imo of course) would be playing him in the middle, Dembele on the right and implement Coutinho and Griezmann behind him and on the left. Then of course those three should be free to change positions with each other to create space for each other and make us more unpredictable. Crossing would again not be an option, but I just don't see how we could implement this aspect.

 

[FCBfan22]

[MENTION=16942]BBZ8800[/MENTION] ok, I get what you mean, although I don't see the marking thing not as big of a problem as you do.
But if what you say is true, then what would you suggest we should play? Messi on the wing doesn't work imo, because he lost lots of his acceleration and pace (as well as some of his ability to beat players 1on1 or 1on2) and on top of that doesn't contribute defensively, which would give the opponents Lb a huge advantage going forward.
If he plays false 9 or in cf position, according to your analysis he will be taken out of the game. So if that is the case we should play him AM with a new no.9 in front?! Again i believe his lack of movement would really hurt us there.
The best solution (imo of course) would be playing him in the middle, Dembele on the right and implement Coutinho and Griezmann behind him and on the left. Then of course those three should be free to change positions with each other to create space for each other and make us more unpredictable. Crossing would again not be an option, but I just don't see how we could implement this aspect.

Well, if you want to cross, you put Paulinho in RCM and order Messi to drop a bit deeper, when Paulinho comes hunting in the box.

 

[BBZ8800]

[MENTION=16942]BBZ8800[/MENTION] ok, I get what you mean, although I don't see the marking thing not as big of a problem as you do.
But if what you say is true, then what would you suggest we should play? Messi on the wing doesn't work imo, because he lost lots of his acceleration and pace (as well as some of his ability to beat players 1on1 or 1on2) and on top of that doesn't contribute defensively, which would give the opponents Lb a huge advantage going forward.
If he plays false 9 or in cf position, according to your analysis he will be taken out of the game. So if that is the case we should play him AM with a new no.9 in front?! Again i believe his lack of movement would really hurt us there.
The best solution (imo of course) would be playing him in the middle, Dembele on the right and implement Coutinho and Griezmann behind him and on the left. Then of course those three should be free to change positions with each other to create space for each other and make us more unpredictable. Crossing would again not be an option, but I just don't see how we could implement this aspect.

I have said a few days ago that to some extent both Messi and Busi are burdens and people jumped on that post.
We are shit without Messi, true.
But on the other hand, with a current Messi you don't have too much tactical options since he wants to play as CAM who drops deep.
So, he is a gift, but tactically, we have only 1-2-3 options.

So, you can't play 433 with him centrally because we will often have no one in attack on the central position.
You can't play 433 with him as a RW, since he doesn't want to play on wings.
So, you can only play some hybrid 433 where he is a Cam, Suarez or someone is a central forward and we have one winger.
Something like Iniesta-Rakitic-Busi plus Suarez-Messi-Dembele from this season.

But since Messi is dropping deep, currently we are forced to have some classic central forward in the box.
The same as how Atletico is way better with Diego Costa drawing players away from Griezmann who plays deeper.

So, Luis can be benched ONLY if Griezmann will play in the box and MOSTLY in the box.
If both Messi and Griezmann will drop deep and if we'll drop Suarez, be prepared for a tons of possession and passing around the box and zero men in the box.

All in all, when you sum it all, EV will probably play:
Suarez
Messi
Coutinho-Rakitic-Busquets-Griezmann (Dembele)

Or, Griezmann in attack sometimes when Suarez/Messi is resting.
Or, a hybrid 433:
Suarez-CAM Messi-Griezmann
Coutinho-Raki-Busi

This one will be possible only on Camp Nou matches.

Since this is Dembele's thread: our team needs a classic CF since Messi is dropping deep and we can't play with Messi far from the box and only 2 wingers (where one of them, Dembele, can't score).
This is why I am telling to people: be prepared for 442 with Suarez-Messi attack or for 433 with Suarez-Messi and "someone". That someone will be Coutinho or Griezmann and not Dembele.

When you sum it all, Dembele won't be a starter in the next season and won't be a key man surely.
About posts how we should drop Suarez in the future: again, then we'll need a young CLASSIC Cf to play in the box.
This Pep's "shit" without classic forwards died and was figured out around 2012, thank God for that.

So, as long as Messi plays for Barca, we'll need a classic CF like Suarez.
After Suarez, we'll need another classic CF.
Only when Messi will be gone, you can try to play a classic 433 with 2 true wingers and with some new classic CF (hopefully a taller technical guy).

Until then, we are "locked" with EV's 442 with Messi-Suarez or with 433 with Messi-Suarez-Griezmann/Coutinho/Dembele.

A sad fact for Barcaforum's fans: Suarez will NOT Be benched anytime soon

 

[kollegah]

please dont embarass yourself again and go play your computer games.

 

[serghei]

I have said a few days ago that to some extent both Messi and Busi are burdens and people jumped on that post.
We are shit without Messi, true.
But on the other hand, with a current Messi you don't have too much tactical options since he wants to play as CAM who drops deep.
So, he is a gift, but tactically, we have only 1-2-3 options.

So, you can't play 433 with him centrally because we will often have no one in attack on the central position.
You can't play 433 with him as a RW, since he doesn't want to play on wings.
So, you can only play some hybrid 433 where he is a Cam, Suarez or someone is a central forward and we have one winger.
Something like Iniesta-Rakitic-Busi plus Suarez-Messi-Dembele from this season.

But since Messi is dropping deep, currently we are forced to have some classic central forward in the box.
The same as how Atletico is way better with Diego Costa drawing players away from Griezmann who plays deeper.

So, Luis can be benched ONLY if Griezmann will play in the box and MOSTLY in the box.
If both Messi and Griezmann will drop deep and if we'll drop Suarez, be prepared for a tons of possession and passing around the box and zero men in the box.

All in all, when you sum it all, EV will probably play:
Suarez
Messi
Coutinho-Rakitic-Busquets-Griezmann (Dembele)

Or, Griezmann in attack sometimes when Suarez/Messi is resting.
Or, a hybrid 433:
Suarez-CAM Messi-Griezmann
Coutinho-Raki-Busi

This one will be possible only on Camp Nou matches.

Since this is Dembele's thread: our team needs a classic CF since Messi is dropping deep and we can't play with Messi far from the box and only 2 wingers (where one of them, Dembele, can't score).
This is why I am telling to people: be prepared for 442 with Suarez-Messi attack or for 433 with Suarez-Messi and "someone". That someone will be Coutinho or Griezmann and not Dembele.

When you sum it all, Dembele won't be a starter in the next season and won't be a key man surely.
About posts how we should drop Suarez in the future: again, then we'll need a young CLASSIC Cf to play in the box.
This Pep's "shit" without classic forwards died and was figured out around 2012, thank God for that.

So, as long as Messi plays for Barca, we'll need a classic CF like Suarez.
After Suarez, we'll need another classic CF.
Only when Messi will be gone, you can try to play a classic 433 with 2 true wingers and with some new classic CF (hopefully a taller technical guy).

Until then, we are "locked" with EV's 442 with Messi-Suarez or with 433 with Messi-Suarez-Griezmann/Coutinho/Dembele.

A sad fact for Barcaforum's fans: Suarez will NOT Be benched anytime soon

I see. So in your opinion Messi is kind of some rogue agent who does what he feels like and the whole club should take notice and change the whole attacking setups and tactics, so that he is happy. Well, that's very much part of what's wrong in the club. Players execute the tactics. They don't play how they want or do what they feel like, but what the are being instructed to do.

Some players have too much power at Barcelona. They need a manager who would take no shit and have them playing what they should be playing. Or else, they can be benched.

 

[ebieymjunior]

I have said a few days ago that to some extent both Messi and Busi are burdens and people jumped on that post.
We are shit without Messi, true.
But on the other hand, with a current Messi you don't have too much tactical options since he wants to play as CAM who drops deep.
So, he is a gift, but tactically, we have only 1-2-3 options.

So, you can't play 433 with him centrally because we will often have no one in attack on the central position.
You can't play 433 with him as a RW, since he doesn't want to play on wings.
So, you can only play some hybrid 433 where he is a Cam, Suarez or someone is a central forward and we have one winger.
Something like Iniesta-Rakitic-Busi plus Suarez-Messi-Dembele from this season.

But since Messi is dropping deep, currently we are forced to have some classic central forward in the box.
The same as how Atletico is way better with Diego Costa drawing players away from Griezmann who plays deeper.

So, Luis can be benched ONLY if Griezmann will play in the box and MOSTLY in the box.
If both Messi and Griezmann will drop deep and if we'll drop Suarez, be prepared for a tons of possession and passing around the box and zero men in the box.

All in all, when you sum it all, EV will probably play:
Suarez
Messi
Coutinho-Rakitic-Busquets-Griezmann (Dembele)

Or, Griezmann in attack sometimes when Suarez/Messi is resting.
Or, a hybrid 433:
Suarez-CAM Messi-Griezmann
Coutinho-Raki-Busi

This one will be possible only on Camp Nou matches.

Since this is Dembele's thread: our team needs a classic CF since Messi is dropping deep and we can't play with Messi far from the box and only 2 wingers (where one of them, Dembele, can't score).
This is why I am telling to people: be prepared for 442 with Suarez-Messi attack or for 433 with Suarez-Messi and "someone". That someone will be Coutinho or Griezmann and not Dembele.

When you sum it all, Dembele won't be a starter in the next season and won't be a key man surely.
About posts how we should drop Suarez in the future: again, then we'll need a young CLASSIC Cf to play in the box.
This Pep's "shit" without classic forwards died and was figured out around 2012, thank God for that.

So, as long as Messi plays for Barca, we'll need a classic CF like Suarez.
After Suarez, we'll need another classic CF.
Only when Messi will be gone, you can try to play a classic 433 with 2 true wingers and with some new classic CF (hopefully a taller technical guy).

Until then, we are "locked" with EV's 442 with Messi-Suarez or with 433 with Messi-Suarez-Griezmann/Coutinho/Dembele.

A sad fact for Barcaforum's fans: Suarez will NOT Be benched anytime soon

TL;DR, JK

Simple, get someone like Griezmann to play LW who can also move centrally when needed and play Dembele in RW.
When Messi isn't playing, have Suarez play upfront as a pure striker with 2 pure LW/RW.
Coutinho in AM (Iniesta's position), it doesn't mean that because he can score he HAS to play in attack.
And get Arthur (who can control the tempo and is dynamic) in the summer (pay more for it if we have to).

I see. So in your opinion Messi is kind of some rogue agent who does what he feels like and the whole club should take notice and change the whole attacking setups and tactics, so that he is happy. Well, that's very much part of what's wrong in the club. Players execute the tactics. They don't play how they want or do what they feel like, but what the are being instructed to do.

Some players have too much power at Barcelona. They need a manager who would take no shit and have them playing what they should be playing. Or else, they can be benched.

Problem is when they know how Barcelona are supposed to play more than the coach (i.e. Valverde). If they defer too much and even Pique has to be telling him that the tactics are all wrong in the match against Roma, and he's too stubborn to even listen, then there's a problem.

If Valverde was really willing to learn and implement the Barcelona way, when wouldn't have had any problem. But the board keeps getting coaches who prefer physicality over technicality, so Messi feels he has to do it all like in Argentina.