John Terry

Carefree said:

No he hasn't.

Rio Ferdinand was banned for missing a drugs test between 2003 and 2004, he was largely slated for his lack of concentration in matches in the following years, and this is the same defender who was made to look a right plonker by Joe 'Lionel Messi' Cole in 2006 in the match at Stamford Bridge.

In 2007 he was very good along with the rest of the Man Utd team that managed to wrestle away the title from us, but don't think for one second he's been any better than Terry. Going by your (ridiculous) opinion on JT, would it be fair to say Rio has only looked good cause of Vidic? After all, it's only during Vidic's emergence as a top quality defender that Rio has shown his best form. Right?

Look, I don't mind if people don't like Terry as a person, I don't even mind if people prefere other defenders to him, but what I do mind is outrageous statements like the one bolded from you. Only made to look good by Riccy and Gallas? Is Alex now going to be the one to make him look good?

It's twattish fans/posts like that I can't stand, and I was hoping this forum would be a refreshing change when I joined, but evidently not. Call him what you like, but an average defender only made to look good by his peers is pure bitterness, and you damn well know it.

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in his peak he was genuinley good, but never the best in the world or even in contention. recently his form has droped as he gets older and gets increasingly shitter defenders next to him. thats a fair opinion.

Hamzah said:

in his peak he was genuinley good, but never the best in the world or even in contention. recently his form has droped as he gets older and gets increasingly shitter defenders next to him. thats a fair opinion.

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In 2004 and 2005 he was comfortably the best in the world without argument. Since then there have been defenders emerging as top class centre-backs like Pique and Chiellini, but one things for sure is Terry is world class and has been for a while now. If he was that bad I doubt Man City would have tried a £60m bid last season and would have gone for one of these so called other better defenders instead.

He's 29 years old, just hitting his prime, and he was brilliant last season up until Jan time, Just touch wood he doesn't go dipping his wick in places he shouldn't again, and he will redeem himself as one of Europe's best by the end of this season.

I stand by everything that I originally said. John Terry is an decent defender made to look better by the players he plays with. Last season he was showed up for the average player he is. He's mistake prone and lacks pace. He puts his body in the way of things a lot but are you trying to tell me that Gallas and Caravahlo didn't make him look better than he is? That's why he's always rubbish for England. Pre-Abromavich, Terry was a decent player and a good premiership player but not an international player.

Ferdinand is a superior player and was before Vidic came hence why his was signed by Leeds for £18m and United for £30m. Terry is not world class and never has been. The english media exaggerate his ability.

Alex Song said:

I stand by everything that I originally said. John Terry is an decent defender made to look better by the players he plays with. Last season he was showed up for the average player he is. He's mistake prone and lacks pace. He puts his body in the way of things a lot but are you trying to tell me that Gallas and Caravahlo didn't make him look better than he is? That's why he's always rubbish for England. Pre-Abromavich, Terry was a decent player and a good premiership player but not an international player.

Ferdinand is a superior player and was before Vidic came hence why his was signed by Leeds for £18m and United for £30m. Terry is not world class and never has been. The english media exaggerate his ability.

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hang on. surely if ferdinand was the best in the world, terry would have been made to look like on of the best ever defenders, while playing for england?

Hamzah said:

hang on. surely if ferdinand was the best in the world, terry would have been made to look like on of the best ever defenders, while playing for england?

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Difference between international football and domestic football. They also don't play a lot together because of injuries so have never formed a partnership. If Woodgate and King hadn't had injury problems then Terry wouldn't be an England regular.

Carefree said:

In 2004 and 2005 he was comfortably the best in the world without argument. Since then there have been defenders emerging as top class centre-backs like Pique and Chiellini, but one things for sure is Terry is world class and has been for a while now. If he was that bad I doubt Man City would have tried a £60m bid last season and would have gone for one of these so called other better defenders instead.

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The same Man City who have signed Adebayor for £25m, Lescott for £20m and Milner for £26m?

Carefree I did say Terry won the award in his peak years... When he was at his top. He did very well that season no doubts, but I'm just saying you can't use the players voting as a good way to say if somebody is deserving of an award, cause they voted Giggs player of the season when he'd played a handful of top drawer games. I never said Terry shouldn't have gotten the award that year, I just mentioned things that went in his favour.

I also never claimed Gallas was world class, I've always maintained that Terry is good, but in my eyes Gallas was a little bit better(during the Mourinho era is what I'm specifically talking about). He kicked up a fuss but he was still great at what he did. I also never said Terry would be average at Arsenal, I said he'd look worse but as a whole Arsenal's defence would have better organization.

You really underrate Maldini, he did a great job as a CB for Milan and even before he retired, was a top defender. Arsenal made Milan look like a bunch of muppets and Maldini is the only player to escape that game with any credit(to use as a good example). Speaks volumes for a guy who was 39/40 at the time. Maybe he's not in the top 5 but he's at least pushing for top 5, there's a reason he was permanently in the team. Nesta played plenty of games up until 2008, and then last season came back and did really well for them. He's the best CB of the decade hands down, I don't think an unbias fan of ANY club can deny that he's at least top 3(of the decade), and is definitely better than Terry.

Anyway, just because I'm a Chelsea fan doesn't mean I have to think the same shit as the rest. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, and I personally don't see Terry as world class, not now anyway(I did during Mourinho's first 2 years for sure). I don't care if other Chelsea fans want to slaughter me for my opinion, but I'm not going to ignore to the numerous fuck ups he's made the last few years which every other Blues fan seem to turn a blind eye to. As the years go by his mistakes are increasing, and like I said before, I'd be surprised if he's still a automatic first choice at 33/34 like other great defenders usually are at their clubs. Terry is a good defender, I have never denied that, but I think he's currently overrated by many people(the ones who don't hate him, not the ones who hate him and let their hate cloud their judgement, that is). I like that he's our captain, I wouldn't change that at all because nobody is more fitting, but I don't see him as the defender he once was and I just can't say he's world class right now.

Antonn's spot on.

Alex Song said:

I stand by everything that I originally said. John Terry is an decent defender made to look better by the players he plays with. Last season he was showed up for the average player he is. He's mistake prone and lacks pace. He puts his body in the way of things a lot but are you trying to tell me that Gallas and Caravahlo didn't make him look better than he is? That's why he's always rubbish for England. Pre-Abromavich, Terry was a decent player and a good premiership player but not an international player.

Ferdinand is a superior player and was before Vidic came hence why his was signed by Leeds for £18m and United for £30m. Terry is not world class and never has been. The english media exaggerate his ability.

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Few things:

1 - He was the best defender in the league up until January time before the hacks wrote about his affair, along with Ashley Cole.

2 - He's England's highest ever goal scoring defender and is our most successful captain after Bobby Moore. He has also been our most consistent performer after Cole too. Gerrard's the one who gets away with murder in the team.

3 - Before Roman arrived Terry was a 22 year old kid gaining experience alongside french world cup winning defenders Desailly and Leboeuf. Arsenal wanted him to replace the retiring Adams, but they didn't get him cause of Roman.

4 - He's still world class and far superior to Ferdinand. Rio only went to Manure cause Leeds were going into financial meltdown and Man Utd needed someone to replace Jaap Stam.

5 - I'm done. Think what you like about the bloke, but he's a superb defender who would get into most teams in the world. No body would turn the chance down to sign him if we ever let him go.

denying maldini ability is criminal. he is easily one of the greatest ever, along with beckenbauer. he was probably top 3 defender this decade along with nesta and cannavaro. his 2 CL titles and one other final prove that.

Hamzah said:

denying maldini ability is criminal. he is easily one of the greatest ever, along with beckenbauer. he was probably top 3 defender this decade along with nesta and cannavaro. his 2 CL titles and one other final prove that.

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Not as a centre-back he aint. He's easily the best left back of all time, but there are plenty ahead of him at CB. He moved to the CB position when his pace went, and since then the newer generation of fans have been bought up believing he played that position his entire life, quite sad actually.

Carefree said:

Few things:

1 - He was the best defender in the league up until January time before the hacks wrote about his affair, along with Ashley Cole.

2 - He's England's highest ever goal scoring defender and is our most successful captain after Bobby Moore. He has also been our most consistent performer after Cole too. Gerrard's the one who gets away with murder in the team.

3 - Before Roman arrived Terry was a 22 year old kid gaining experience alongside french world cup winning defenders Desailly and Leboeuf. Arsenal wanted him to replace the retiring Adams, but they didn't get him cause of Roman.

4 - He's still world class and far superior to Ferdinand. Rio only went to Manure cause Leeds were going into financial meltdown and Man Utd needed someone to replace Jaap Stam.

5 - I'm done. Think what you like about the bloke, but he's a superb defender who would get into most teams in the world. No body would turn the chance down to sign him if we ever let him go.

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1. Was probably Roger Johnson or Scott Dann.

2. Scoring goals for a set piece team like England = good defending?

3. Terry was a good defender pre Roman, I'm not denying that. My argument is that he is not top quality.

4. World class players don't make the mistakes he made last season. They also don't get shown up at international level as 'JT' is.

5. Nice debating with you :thumbsup2:

Alex Song said:

1. Was probably Roger Johnson or Scott Dann.

2. Scoring goals for a set piece team like England = good defending?

3. Terry was a good defender pre Roman, I'm not denying that. My argument is that he is not top quality.

4. World class players don't make the mistakes he made last season. They also don't get shown up at international level as 'JT' is.

5. Nice debating with you :thumbsup2:

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Whoa whoa, you're contradiciting yourself. According to you, Rio is world class, yet he was absolutely woeful for Man Utd and England last season. The mistakes he made led for calls for him to be axed from the England set up altogether. Injuries eventually hit and the JT thing came out and all of a sudden he was made captain! So which is it?

Carefree said:

Whoa whoa, you're contradiciting yourself. According to you, Rio is world class, yet he was absolutely woeful for Man Utd and England last season. The mistakes he made led for calls for him to be axed from the England set up altogether. Injuries eventually hit and the JT thing came out and all of a sudden he was made captain! So which is it?

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I'm not contradicting myself. Ferdinand has previously proved what a wonderful player he is, last season he had injury problems. I still think he's a world class player. Form is temporary, class is permanent springs to mind. But I don't think Terry's ever been world class.

I'd also like to chime in on this whole 'players making other players look better' topic. When you get a world class CB partnership, you're going to have 2 players who's strengths compliment that of the guy they are partnered with, who have a great understanding, ones where a player is able to cover for the other's deficiencies. That is the makings of the best CB partnerships, you'll never find otherwise(in terms of world class pairings, not EVERY single defence). A guy is never going to look as good if he's partnered with an average player or a guy who is exactly like him.