Xavi Hernández

FlaFCB said:

Lol. You weren't watching any games, if you think that about Xavi. There's even video proof showing that at 23 he was playing like he did when he was 28, but you keep the nonsense. And it's not only me, there are other members here, like @Bojan and @BBZ8800 who also watched Xavi back then. You have no idea what you're talking about, and resorting to the "I can't argue with a guy checking the wiki for game appearances" shows that even more. Nice trolling after getting found out so hard. It's amusing to see you changing your argument, too. First Xavi was "a squad player". After that being debunked, now he wasn't "influentional"...

His injury, that bad last season under Rijkaard, and the criticism that followed, made him give those statements. It's nice to take things out of context, though. You didn't even know he was injured in 2006, and that's why he missed the UCL final. As I also said before, I'm not talking about general clueless perception from people. Xavi was my favorite player, and I could see his qualities back then. He didn't come out of nowhere, nor Pep taught him how to play football. He was playing like that since ever.

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Yes I would expect you, Bojan and BBZ to know about Xavi more than Xavi himself. lol Don't argue with me, serghei and others, go argue with Xavi himself.

His email is Xavi@al-saddclub.com

Ask him if he thought of himself as a world class under Rijkaard. He already answered this many times but go ask him again and report back.

serghei said:

He was a top midfielder, just not world class for me for said reasons. Lack of games at the highest level, in CL and in Euro.

I don't remember saying Alexis was world class at Barca. If I did I was wrong.



He was a top player, just not world class. Deco was better at the time, in 2004.

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There was no lack of games at the highest level. rm was the top team back then, and Xavi always played well against them. You can't blame him for spain having a shit coach. Same thing happened with Messi in the 2006 wc, when he wasn't played by Pekerman. Messi was also already world class. How do you differentiate top and wc? It's the same to me. If you reach the top, there's not much further to go. Just to legendary. And Xavi surely wasn't just a good player.

Luis Aragones took charge of Spain in 2004. And that's when he decided Xavi would be the central point of his nt. You think Aragones didn't know Xavi was wc, and just gambled with him?

George_Costanza said:

Yes I would expect you, Bojan and BBZ to know about Xavi more than Xavi himself. lol Don't argue with me, serghei and others, go argue with Xavi himself.

His email is Xavi@al-saddclub.com

Ask him if he thought of himself as a world class under Rijkaard. He already answered this many times but go ask him again and report back.

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I see, you have no arguments to backup your nonsense. Nice escape.
"Squad player, not influentional", now it's "talk to Xavi"

Messi wouldn't say that about himself either, in the present day. You're confusing Xavi being humble here. He was never the kind to boast about himself, as the likes of cr do. Xavi had serious self esteem problems after his injury as well. As he has mentioned in many of his interviews, and aragones helped him get past those. But none of this changes the fact he was already world class at 23, something Gomes is far from being.

Trying to undermine Xavi to make Gomes look good is appalling, anyway.

Xavi was just named the best young LL player, voted as the VC of the team, voted as the best Spanish player in the Liga and Barca's head of the midfield, playmaker before he turned 25.

If you don't regard him as World Class back then just because Gaspart almost destroyed the club and fucked up the team and other institutions then I disagree.


@George_Costanza

The onus is on you to argue that Xavi wasn't World Class so bring up all those posts you talked about and email Xavi yourself. If you got nothing to back up your argument with then move on instead of bitching about what others believe.

Xavi has stated multiple times that he always played the same way from the start. Pep's system just made him the absolute heart of the team.

FlaFCB said:

There was no lack of games at the highest level. rm was the top team back then, and Xavi always played well against them.

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Yes it was. A world class player makes the difference in Champions League or in Euro/World Cup/Copa America. Xavi did not make the difference in these high profile tournaments until 2008 under Aragones.

FlaFCB said:

You can't blame him for spain having a shit coach.

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I don't blame him. But even under a good manager, you can't know for sure that Xavi was good enough to be at the level he was in 2008 4 years earlier, or even close to that.

FlaFCB said:

How do you differentiate top and wc? It's the same to me. If you reach the top, there's not much further to go. Just to legendary. And Xavi surely wasn't just a good player.

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Young Xavi is actually one of the best examples of a top player that was not yet world class at 23-24. For said reason. Lack of games and key performances at the highest level. I don't care much who was to blame or who wasn't. This is extremely subjective. The fact that he lacked some things that define world class players, things that he got later in his career (and then some) remains for me.

FlaFCB said:

Luis Aragones took charge of Spain in 2004. And that's when he decided Xavi would be the central point of his nt. You think Aragones didn't know Xavi was wc, and just gambled with him?

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When you say "world class", you're only refering to ability it seems. I refer to ability + performances. You give me performances in La Liga mostly, and I'm saying you the term world class goes beyond just your domestic league. Xavi until 26-27 was didn't have the european performances required to be called a world class player, at least not in the definition I practice, which is more strict than yours. Even if his ability was great since he was young.

DonAK said:

Xavi was just named the best young LL player, voted as the VC of the team, voted as the best Spanish player in the Liga and Barca's head of the midfield, playmaker before he turned 25.

If you don't regard him as World Class back then just because Gaspart almost destroyed the club and fucked up the team and other institutions then I disagree.


@George_Costanza

The onus is on you to argue that Xavi wasn't World Class so bring up all those posts you talked about and email Xavi yourself. If you got nothing to back up your argument with then move on instead of bitching about what others believe.

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LFP award was established in 2008 and breakthrough award won by players like Pedro, so not sure what votes you are talking about!

And why should I email Xavi. You are the ones who think L'Equipe made up that interview I posted for Xavi saying he was useless and terrible. Actually, the word he used was more extreme, he described himself as cancer.

Can anyone of you here prove that they were posting between 2003-2007 in any respectable Barcelona board? I don't think so!

below is an invitation from Bojan who was actually new to that very popular Barcelona forum back in 2009. In internet age, everything is documented and can prove who is been following this club for decades and who just joined with recent succuss.

Not gonna post more on this subject as it's getting personal and emotional for some of the newbie cules.

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George_Costanza said:

LFP award was established in 2008 and breakthrough award won by players like Pedro, so not sure what votes you are talking about!

And why should I email Xavi. You are the ones who think L'Equipe made up that interview I posted for Xavi saying he was useless and terrible. Actually, the word he used was more extreme, he described himself as cancer.

Can anyone of you here prove that they were posting between 2003-2007 in any respectable Barcelona board? I don't think so!

below is an invitation from Bojan who was actually new to that very popular Barcelona forum back in 2009. In internet age, everything is documented and can prove who is been following this club for decades and who just joined with recent succuss.

Not gonna post more on this subject as it's getting personal and emotional for some of the newbie cules.

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Not talking about the LFP Award, but the Don Balon Award which the Don Balon Magazine used to award. Was the biggest footballing magazine in Spain akin to France Football until they shut the shop some years ago. I thought a lifelong fan who didn't start gloryhunting like all of us would know that!

And I'd suggest you go back to that L'Equipe interview where Xavi was taking about Rijkaard's last couple of years. Xavi's point was that Rijkaard deemed him useless since he wanted to implement a very physical style of play after Xavi came back from his knee ligament injury. He said he was the team's "cancer" figuratively because he was a 1.70m player whose talent was deemed below physicality.

He never said he wasn't good enough or not World Class. He spoke in response to the various reports at that time that he grew unhappy at the club and wanted to leave, and why he wanted to leave having lost the trust of the coach who wanted bigger, stronger midfielders who he thought was worth more than talented, small ones.

Here you have the Spanish version of that interview: http://www.sport.es/es/noticias/barca/xavi-rijkaard-creia-1688441

English version: http://www.espnfc.com/story/1051576/xavi-frank-rijkaard-made-me-barcas-cancer

Unfortunately I am struggling to find the original source, but perhaps you can provide that to us as you provided us all those links you talked about? Or....did you?

Old man, you seem to be losing your mind lately amidst all the young blood around here. I requested for more, but the only thing you brought forward is a post by Bojan. Why cannot you bring those countless posts where Xavi was being slated, which you talked about?

Behind every word, every interview, there is a context to be sought too. Unfortunately that's where your entire argument collapses.

George_Costanza said:

LFP award was established in 2008 and breakthrough award won by players like Pedro, so not sure what votes you are talking about!

And why should I email Xavi. You are the ones who think L'Equipe made up that interview I posted for Xavi saying he was useless and terrible. Actually, the word he used was more extreme, he described himself as cancer.

Can anyone of you here prove that they were posting between 2003-2007 in any respectable Barcelona board? I don't think so!

below is an invitation from Bojan who was actually new to that very popular Barcelona forum back in 2009. In internet age, everything is documented and can prove who is been following this club for decades and who just joined with recent succuss.

Not gonna post more on this subject as it's getting personal and emotional for some of the newbie cules.

View attachment 7058

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You lost the plot, sir.

I only registered there to invite few people join this forum when we were new.

Was that your "evidence" of me being new to Barca then?

Shame, I should burn my 1998/1999 shirt.

"At Gomes' age Xavi was considered useless too" sorry, I just have no words for such bullshit.

The notion that you need to have posted on internet forums for 14 years to prove and document that you're a Barca fan is ridiculous too

Talk about being a pretentious douchebag whose 50% of his posts here account for posting lame George Costanza gifs.

serghei said:

Yes it was. A world class player makes the difference in Champions League or in Euro/World Cup/Copa America. Xavi did not make the difference in these high profile tournaments until 2008 under Aragones.



I don't blame him. But even under a good manager, you can't know for sure that Xavi was good enough to be at the level he was in 2008 4 years earlier, or even close to that.



Young Xavi is actually one of the best examples of a top player that was not yet world class at 23-24. For said reason. Lack of games and key performances at the highest level. I don't care much who was to blame or who wasn't. This is extremely subjective. The fact that he lacked some things that define world class players, things that he got later in his career (and then some) remains for me.



When you say "world class", you're only refering to ability it seems. I refer to ability + performances. You give me performances in La Liga mostly, and I'm saying you the term world class goes beyond just your domestic league. Xavi until 26-27 was didn't have the european performances required to be called a world class player, at least not in the definition I practice, which is more strict than yours. Even if his ability was great since he was young.

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Xavi started having a huge role in the Spanish nt at 24, serghei. That's when Aragones made him the center of spain. Thats also when Spain started to shine, and they made the wc 2006 qualifiers without losing a single one. Your claim that he wasn't world class is completely void of substance. And before you say something about the actual 2006 wc, remember his knee injury.

You're wrong about it. A shame you can't admit it. Don't embarrass yourself further, as George is doing too.

FlaFCB said:

You're wrong about it. A shame you can't admit it. Don't embarrass yourself further, as George is doing too.

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Embarass for what? I already said he was a top player. Just not world class according to my definition of the term. You act as if I said he was shit or something like that. Which I never did.

serghei said:

Embarass for what? I already said he was a top player. Just not world class according to my definition of the term. You act as if I said he was shit or something like that. Which I never did.

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Yes, you did. The first time we had this discussion, you went as far as saying that like Gomes now, Xavi wasn't a top player at 23. And top or wc is the same, no point in arguing semantics. And why are you ignoring his performances with the spanish nt at 24, for some reason? That's when he started shining in the international level. Not at 26/27.

FlaFCB said:

Yes, you did. The first time we had this discussion, you went as far as saying that like Gomes now, Xavi wasn't a top player at 23. And top or wc is the same, no point in arguing semantics. And why are you ignoring his performances with the spanish nt at 24, for some reason? That's when he started shining in the international level. Not at 26/27.

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No. I've said Xavi himself had some problems at 23. That 'himself' means I aknowledged Xavi as the clearly superior player. So if he wasn't the finished product then, it's foolish to expect Gomes to be. That was the sense of that, that every player at 23 years old is still in his development phase. Even Xavi. Maybe Messi is one of the few exceptions.

Top player and world class player probably means the same to you. To me, it doesn't. And I explained why.

serghei said:

No. I've said Xavi himself had some problems at 23. That 'himself' means I aknowledged Xavi as the clearly superior player. So if he wasn't the finished product then, it's foolish to expect Gomes to be. That was the sense of that, that every player at 23 years old is still in his development phase. Even Xavi. Maybe Messi is one of the few exceptions.

Top player and world class player probably means the same to you. To me, it doesn't. And I explained why.

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What problems did he have? I don't remember any apart from Gaspart. He was already consistent and a pass machine. And you didn't answer my question. Why are you ignoring his performances with the spanish nt at 24?