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Thread: Ronald Koeman is new Barca manager

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    Quote Originally Posted by mc_lovin View Post
    There is no 4231 with Messi as #10.
    ----------------MATS----------------
    Semedo-----Araujo---Lenglet-----Alba

    ----------Pjanic-----DeJong----------

    Dembele--------Messi----------Fati

    ------------------9------------------
    Last edited by Kubala; 20th August 2020 at 10:54 AM.

    'Barcelona represents my philosophy, not just in their style of play, but how they form footballers. I love their football, it seduces me.'

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    Attack:
    ___________Mats
    Semedo__CB___Lenglet___LB
    _______Frenkie____Pjanic
    __Dembele___Messi______Fati__
    ___________Lautaro__________

    Defense:
    ___________Mats
    Semedo__CB___Lenglet___LB
    _______Frenkie____Pjanic
    __Dembele___Lautaro_____Fati__
    _____________Messi__________

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    You can certainly write him down on that #10 position. Doesnt reflect reality though.

    And when you switch Lautaro/Messi in defense/offense, who exactly is the #10? You know, the actual midfielder, who moves the ball forward to our attack when we win the ball, ideally to our #9? The setup you described is textbook 442 with the exception of the 2nd striker staying upfront

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    Quote Originally Posted by mc_lovin View Post
    You can certainly write him down on that #10 position. Doesnt reflect reality though.

    And when you switch Lautaro/Messi in defense/offense, who exactly is the #10? You know, the actual midfielder, who moves the ball forward to our attack when we win the ball, ideally to our #9? The setup you described is textbook 442 with the exception of the 2nd striker staying upfront
    You seriously don't know the difference between 4-4-2 and 4-2-3-1?

    'Barcelona represents my philosophy, not just in their style of play, but how they form footballers. I love their football, it seduces me.'

    Michel Platini, Uefa president

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    Quote Originally Posted by Siempre Barca View Post
    Attack:
    ___________Mats
    Semedo__CB___Lenglet___LB
    _______Frenkie____Pjanic
    __Dembele___Messi______Fati__
    ___________Lautaro__________

    Defense:
    ___________Mats
    Semedo__CB___Lenglet___LB
    _______Frenkie____Pjanic
    __Dembele___Lautaro_____Fati__
    _____________Messi__________
    don't know what players we'll have but this is exactly how I would mask Messi lack of movement in defence.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mc_lovin View Post
    You can certainly write him down on that #10 position. Doesnt reflect reality though.

    And when you switch Lautaro/Messi in defense/offense, who exactly is the #10? You know, the actual midfielder, who moves the ball forward to our attack when we win the ball, ideally to our #9? The setup you described is textbook 442 with the exception of the 2nd striker staying upfront
    This is 442:
    ___________Mats
    Semedo__CB___Lenglet___LB
    _______Frenkie____Pjanic
    __Dembele_____________Fati__
    ________Messi___Lautaro______

    So, one more time, when we have a ball, Messi is #10, when we not, Lautaro. If we have a quick counter and Messi is ahead, he can't run it and solve it, or do you think there must always be someone in front of him? Also, Frenkie and Pjanic in that case could not move the ball to him?

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    I give up.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kubala View Post
    You seriously don't know the difference between 4-4-2 and 4-2-3-1?
    Mc_lovin is 100 percent right. You can position Messi on paper wherever you want but at the end of the day He will drop in the middle of the pitch when Barca has possession and will be the deepest player upfront when we don't have the ball .
    Last edited by messi2140; 20th August 2020 at 12:08 PM.
    Maybe you guys dont believe me but even with 72 years I have a body from a 39 years old man, in my mind I am 22. When people try to guess my age they say 35 , 40 or something. Last week a girl said 29!!!.

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    I've written this plenty of times, but seeing as there are some new posters here I'm gonna repeat it.

    4-2-3-1 with Messi doesn't work. It doesn't exist. He won't play as a traditional CAM but will instead drop from a more attacking position, like he does today. Conclusion is either we play 4-2-4 or the wingers drop down a notch and we play 4-4-2.
    For that to work out the RM and LM needs to be disciplined, especially if we have two natural RW/LW playing RM/LM.

    We always need at least 3 players behind Messi, if he plays at RW in a 4-3-3 or CF in 4-3-3/4-4-2, that comes naturally.
    CAM only works if we play without wingers, 4-3-1-2 but even then Messi tends to end up as the RF.

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    Basically, Messi is the problem. He can not play RW, CAM, F9.
    He comes in the middle from every position, so it would be stupid to put him anywhere else. Of course he has to change some of his habits and wait for the ball from the midfielder between the two lines and then create chances for fast wingers or play with the striker.

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    “I would love to have played at this club. I am envious of how well Guardiola's men can play. They are like a group of kids who play football in the street without rules. That is the best football, the most authentic, unfettered by tactics or schemes. Guardiola’s philosophy is helping to change the mindset of many tacticians and that is priceless.” Marco Van Basten

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    Quote Originally Posted by messi2140 View Post
    Mc_lovin is 100 percent right. You can position Messi on paper wherever you want but at the end of the day He will drop in the middle of the pitch when Barca has possession and will be the deepest player upfront when we don't have the ball .
    That's exactly right, he would be. But we would still have a RW when we don't have the ball to help RB defensively where we are getting killed.

    'Barcelona represents my philosophy, not just in their style of play, but how they form footballers. I love their football, it seduces me.'

    Michel Platini, Uefa president

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    Quote Originally Posted by Andresito View Post
    I've written this plenty of times, but seeing as there are some new posters here I'm gonna repeat it.

    4-2-3-1 with Messi doesn't work. It doesn't exist. He won't play as a traditional CAM but will instead drop from a more attacking position, like he does today. Conclusion is either we play 4-2-4 or the wingers drop down a notch and we play 4-4-2.
    For that to work out the RM and LM needs to be disciplined, especially if we have two natural RW/LW playing RM/LM.

    We always need at least 3 players behind Messi, if he plays at RW in a 4-3-3 or CF in 4-3-3/4-4-2, that comes naturally.
    CAM only works if we play without wingers, 4-3-1-2 but even then Messi tends to end up as the RF.
    I think Messi is an intelligent enough player to adapt to this position, especially with movement in front of him and a double pivot behind. When he plays RW now we need superman at RB to cover the whole right side which Semedo definately is NOT. When he drops into MF he will have three players ahead of him to play through, or run at the defence himself. The only other alternative I see for balance is maybe a 3-4-3 so a right sided CB can cover gaps behind a WB pushed forward. Other than that, bring back Dani Alves from 10 years ago
    Last edited by Kubala; 20th August 2020 at 12:38 PM.

    'Barcelona represents my philosophy, not just in their style of play, but how they form footballers. I love their football, it seduces me.'

    Michel Platini, Uefa president

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kubala View Post
    That's exactly right, he would be. But we would still have a RW when we don't have the ball to help RB defensively where we are getting killed.
    But as Mc_lovin says that would just be your standard 442 when we don't have the ball.
    And when we do have the ball he will transition from being a CM to an SS.
    Last edited by messi2140; 20th August 2020 at 12:28 PM.
    Maybe you guys dont believe me but even with 72 years I have a body from a 39 years old man, in my mind I am 22. When people try to guess my age they say 35 , 40 or something. Last week a girl said 29!!!.

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    Quote Originally Posted by messi2140 View Post
    But as Mc_lovin says that would just be your standard 442 when we don't have the ball.
    And when we do have the ball he will transition from being a CM to an SS.
    Not a 4 4 2 no, the wide players would still be attacking forwards pressing high, NOT wide midfield players, just Messi would drop to make a three in MF. If anything it would transition to a 4-3-3, not a 4-4-2

    'Barcelona represents my philosophy, not just in their style of play, but how they form footballers. I love their football, it seduces me.'

    Michel Platini, Uefa president