Philippe Coutinho

Messigician

Messigician

Senior Member
Koeman is convinced that Coutinho can recover the level with which he triumphed in Liverpool this season. The Brazilian will return to train with his teammates after the stay in Germany. [md]

Suffering dawgs
 
Birdy

Birdy

Senior Member
With Messi, Memphis, Coutinho, and Griezman all on board next season, it's clear Koeman and Schreuder must steer away from 4-3-3 for the good of the team,
despite all of Laporta's requests.

We have many AMs and no wingers. The only winger, Dembele, out injured, and the other winger, Fati, will be used as a 9 per reports.
Hence, the 3-4-3/3-5-2 shall be used with 2 AMs behind a 9,
and 2 of the 4 starting every time (Messi when not injured and 1 of the other 3)
 
Fati_Future_BallonDor

Fati_Future_BallonDor

Well-known member
Birdy said:
With Messi, Memphis, Coutinho, and Griezman all on board next season, it's clear Koeman and Schreuder must steer away from 4-3-3 for the good of the team,
despite all of Laporta's requests.

We have many AMs and no wingers. The only winger, Dembele, out injured, and the other winger, Fati, will be used as a 9 per reports.
Hence, the 3-4-3/3-5-2 shall be used with 2 AMs behind a 9,
and 2 of the 4 starting every time (Messi when not injured and 1 of the other 3)
Click to expand...

3 defenders while having lenglet ,pique, Umtiti ? :nervous:
 
khaled_a_d

khaled_a_d

Senior Member
Birdy said:
With Messi, Memphis, Coutinho, and Griezman all on board next season, it's clear Koeman and Schreuder must steer away from 4-3-3 for the good of the team,
despite all of Laporta's requests.

We have many AMs and no wingers. The only winger, Dembele, out injured, and the other winger, Fati, will be used as a 9 per reports.
Hence, the 3-4-3/3-5-2 shall be used with 2 AMs behind a 9,
and 2 of the 4 starting every time (Messi when not injured and 1 of the other 3)
Click to expand...

I agree with that, but for different reasons.
I am huge fan of 433, probably bigger fan of it than Laporta himself, but I agree that we should consider either 352 or 343 as the team is more stable with it but there is a catch.
Truth is, we have only one player who make it work in defense in that formation, and and as you mentioned that guy is FDJ.
The problem is, we actually have bigger depth in both attack and defense (the later is more of quantity than quality) than in midfield.
Griezmann, Messi, Memphis are second strikers and not AM. if we use 343 it will be more or less of 3421 with 2 ss behind a 9 or false 9.
The same situation will happen in 433, at the end the front 3 will be 2 of Memphis/Griezmann/Messi and Fati in front of them (or Messi as false 9 in the middle)
That leaves our midfield with Pedri and Busquets, the former is a kid and the later is ancient. Both need to be rotated heavily. You can add Coutinho in that mix and play 352, but you will be benching most of our attackers.
Who is their rotation though? Puig? not suited for such formation, maybe as Coutinho back up in 352, Gavi? too young, same with Nico. Basically it leaves us with only Roberto as only over 22 bench player for midfield.

It could work if Eric could fill the Libro role as some suggested, which leaves room for FDJ to rotate between midfield and defense.
Thing is, I am not sure Eric is the right profile for that role.
 
P

PhilS

Active member
What the club needs are some midfielders that Koeman would want to use to back up De Jong, Busquets and Pedri. Last year, he overplayed all three of them, because he hated all his other options.

I don't think Pjanic is ever going to cut it here, send him on to another club. Koeman is not willing to play Puig. So, yes, I would like to have Coutinho available this season. And I think Sergi Roberto will play midfield quite a bit, mainly for Busquets but also to give some rest to De Jong.
 
Birdy

Birdy

Senior Member
khaled_a_d said:
I agree with that, but for different reasons.
I am huge fan of 433, probably bigger fan of it than Laporta himself, but I agree that we should consider either 352 or 343 as the team is more stable with it but there is a catch.
Truth is, we have only one player who make it work in defense in that formation, and and as you mentioned that guy is FDJ.
The problem is, we actually have bigger depth in both attack and defense (the later is more of quantity than quality) than in midfield.
Griezmann, Messi, Memphis are second strikers and not AM. if we use 343 it will be more or less of 3421 with 2 ss behind a 9 or false 9.
The same situation will happen in 433, at the end the front 3 will be 2 of Memphis/Griezmann/Messi and Fati in front of them (or Messi as false 9 in the middle)
That leaves our midfield with Pedri and Busquets, the former is a kid and the later is ancient. Both need to be rotated heavily. You can add Coutinho in that mix and play 352, but you will be benching most of our attackers.
Who is their rotation though? Puig? not suited for such formation, maybe as Coutinho back up in 352, Gavi? too young, same with Nico. Basically it leaves us with only Roberto as only over 22 bench player for midfield.

It could work if Eric could fill the Libro role as some suggested, which leaves room for FDJ to rotate between midfield and defense.
Thing is, I am not sure Eric is the right profile for that role.
Click to expand...

yes, I meant 3-4-3 morphing into a 3-4-2-1 with 2 creators coming from left and right.

I agree with your analysis. There's a clear lack in the midfield, hence why Koeman thinks a midfielder is a priority and wants a physical one.
If Illaix renews, then we will see him play much more this season because of that lack in the md.

I share the same fear that Garcia will not be able to play the libero as FDJ
 
P

Porque

Senior Member
PhilS said:
What the club needs are some midfielders that Koeman would want to use to back up De Jong, Busquets and Pedri. Last year, he overplayed all three of them, because he hated all his other options.

I don't think Pjanic is ever going to cut it here, send him on to another club. Koeman is not willing to play Puig. So, yes, I would like to have Coutinho available this season. And I think Sergi Roberto will play midfield quite a bit, mainly for Busquets but also to give some rest to De Jong.
Click to expand...

Ideally would be Nico and Ilaix. Even if it is a bit Arsenal-ish.

With Ilaix frozen out, and Pedri needing rest, will we start LaLiga with Gavi?
 
serghei

serghei

Senior Member
I would stick with 4-3-3 / 3-4-3, depending on De Jong's position. There's no one system that fits the current squad easily. We have a good talented squad imo, but many players of similar profiles.

Last season we looked the best with De Jong libero and 3-4-3. Sociedad away was probably the best game we've played.
 
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M

mc_lovin

Senior Member
Unfortunately Coutinho has no place in either system. Was a massive mistake keeping him last season (assuming we could have gotten rid of him) and will be a massive mistake keeping him this season.
 
Messi983

Messi983

Senior Member
DonAK said:
Imagine if Koeman starts Coutinho over Pedri.

I'd love to see the reactions :lol:
Click to expand...

Pedri has establish himself enough this won't happen but it would be mad to play Cou over Gavi which eventually could happen if he stays.

Porque said:
Ideally would be Nico and Ilaix. Even if it is a bit Arsenal-ish.

With Ilaix frozen out, and Pedri needing rest, will we start LaLiga with Gavi?
Click to expand...

FDJ/Ilaix*/Roberto - Busi/Nico - Pedri/Gavi/Puig

That's how I see it right now. Would clearly prefer to have another more proven midfielder (that's why I've supported signing Gini on a 2-3 year contract) instead of having three kids (or two kids and Roberto) as backups but that's unlikely in our current financial situation and at the same time I prefer giving minutes to Gavi and Ilaix (if he'll smarten up and renew) than ever play Cou again.
 
M

mc_lovin

Senior Member
Messi983 said:
Pedri has establish himself enough this won't happen but it would be mad to play Cou over Gavi which eventually could happen if he stays.
Click to expand...

Given that Coutinho can't play CM the chances for that are rather small unless Koeman goes for a 4231 again, which is rather unlikely. Not after we botched our beginning of last season with that. I am pretty sure we will see Gavi (or Puig) in the first few games. That's one of the things I really rate Koeman for, he see's the need for smaller, technical CM's in a 433. Valverde would have just went with Pjanic-Busquets-Frenkie.

Other than that, midfield depth next season is an army of kids. At least it's exciting. Just waiting for offical confirmation (promotions).
 
Messi983

Messi983

Senior Member
If we'll stick with 4-3-3 and Cou will stay then I think he will be used in a CM rotation (where as said we have only youngsters to back up starters whose minutes should be managed better this year if we don't want to run Busi, FDJ and mostly Pedri into the ground again). He can't play LW either and we have Memphis there who will clearly be Koeman's prefered choice until Fati returns.
 
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