Ibrahima Konate
- Thread starter Leo_Messi
- Start date
Who are you to have an authority over the french?
You are Brazilian, Right? So why do you lust over French? Are Brazilian players not good enough?
Do PSG supporters have a free pass to oppose/lambast anyone who is interested in French players?
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Jair Ventura
New member
Do I spend my time here bashing French football while lusting after their players? No. You’re the hypocrites here, not me.
French talent pool is good, Ligue 1 is shit. Is that so hard to fathom?
Jair Ventura
New member
Yes, because the logic makes no sense.
Yes it does. A league cannot thrive solely on talents. Ligue 1's export of players, especially the so called talents, is too big.
So what's being left in the league? New upcoming talents who potentially can become world class in 3-5 years and farmers that no other league wants.
Ligue 1, apart from PSG, can't attract any players, with a few rare exceptions of course. That's why it's so far below the other leagues.
Extended his contract two days ago.
[tw]https://twitter.com/RBLeipzig_EN/status/1085879352670093312[/tw]
[tw]https://twitter.com/RBLeipzig_EN/status/1085879352670093312[/tw]
Afaik, Most people bash the league, not the French FA. and he doesn't even play in the French league ffs. You're delusional here, not me.
And even if someone do plays in it,it doesn't guarantee anything about the league. If that was the case Brazilian league would be on par with top leagues.
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Jair Ventura
New member
Who says Ligue 1 exports too many players? You? Let’s see how long it takes for this argument to fall apart.
Three seasons ago Lyon’s best players were Lacazette, Umtiti, and Tolisso. They sold all three. Lacazette was replaced by Memphis Depay & Moussa Dembele, Tolisso by Ndombele and Aouar, and Umtiti by Marcelo and Jason Denayer. OL not only competently replaced their losses, they became better. As evidenced in their taking 4 points from City and qualifying for the round of 16 for the first time in nearly a decade.
When you reliably build players at the rate France is, losing a few doesn’t cripple you. Their academies are building more players than English clubs can buy, while only a handful of clubs in Spain, Italy, or Germany can afford their best talents.
To greater emphasize what I mean: last season no one knew who Nicolas Pepe or Tanguy Ndombele were. Their current teams found them on bottom table sides and built them into top players in no time. Now they’re both worth at least €50m, and that’s a low estimate.
Lyon is a stronger club than every club in Italy outside of Juventus right now. I.e. They have a better academy, play in a new 60k stadium that they own, stronger resources & infrastructure, more talent, etc.
So when Lyon is far and away better positioned for success than Napoli, Inter, or Roma— your statement that Ligue 1 is “far below” other leagues doesn’t make sense because the logic doesn’t add up
Leo_Messi
New member
This is getting more and more ridiculous Jair Ventura.
Have you seen the UEFA coefficient list of French clubs this season? It is beyond pathetic and reflects the incredibly poor results.
https://kassiesa.home.xs4all.nl/bert/uefa/data/method5/crank2019.html
Ligue 1 is the fifth best league in Europe. No mental gymnastics is going to change this fact.
Now let us return to the topic of this thread which is Ibrahima Konaté and not Ligue 1. The same Ibrahima Konaté that does not play in Ligue 1 and who actually has NEVER played in Ligue 1.
Have you seen the UEFA coefficient list of French clubs this season? It is beyond pathetic and reflects the incredibly poor results.
https://kassiesa.home.xs4all.nl/bert/uefa/data/method5/crank2019.html
Ligue 1 is the fifth best league in Europe. No mental gymnastics is going to change this fact.
Now let us return to the topic of this thread which is Ibrahima Konaté and not Ligue 1. The same Ibrahima Konaté that does not play in Ligue 1 and who actually has NEVER played in Ligue 1.
Thing is Jair, those two great Lyon games in the group stage are not proof of anything other than two great group stage games. Case in point, last year Tottenham took 4 points off of Real Madrid in the group stage who went on and won the competition. Besiktas also took 4 points off of the previous seasons Champions League Semi-Finalists Monaco. Is that then proof of Ligue1s regress from 2016/2017 to 2017/2018 being behind the Turkish SuperLiga?
Other point is we don't really know if Lyon have progressed at all. They are still maintaining 3/4th position as 2017/2018 and 2016/2017. In 2015/2016 (the season they had Umtiti, they actually finished 2nd so you could have they have got worse since losing him and have not adequately replaced him.
So yeah, let's reserve judgement on this Lyon progressing and being better than every club outside of Juve as the evidence is just not there yet. Because Roma have progressed in the CL too meanwhile Napoli and Inter had incredibly hard groups compared to Lyons which outside of Man City was nothing special. Meanwhile if you compare 2018/2019 spending power of Napoli, Inter, Roma, AC Milan then it leaves a lot to be desired.
Your right that the academies in France give great opportunity to replace talent though, and also that Lyon have the conditions to become a competitive club again (at the level Roma have been recently) but it remains to be seen if it will come to fruition.
One last point is that the British academies have been incredible recently since the re-structuring on the FA coaching syllabus. They have dominated the youth categories and won the last U20 World Cup. So English clubs won't need to look abroad for talent in the coming years as much as they have needed to in the past decade. They will just have to give them opportunities before they get offers abroad like Sancho and Odoi.
Yes, me. If you compare the amount of top talent leaving France compared to staying there, the export is huge.
Better? I wouldn't say better. They impressed a lot against City I'll give you that. But they won 1 out of 6 games in their group.
Plus, where are the 'City-performances' in the league? Lyon doesn't have an optimal squad. They have a bunch of youngsters which also equals inconsistent performances.
Their squad is typical of a seller's club with talents who'll be gone in a few years. They can't keep their players because the players have higher ambitions than dominating in Ligue 1.
Ligue 1 is a good league to develop in, there is plenty of proof of that. But Pepe and Ndombele won't spend the prime of their careers in France.
You could take all players in Europe who developed in France and throw them back to Ligue 1 and it would make the league one of the best. But now, it's rather the opposite.
Maybe. But it doesn't make Lyon a better team than those you mentioned.
The downside of a French team playing well in Champions League is that the next year they'll be without their star players and will have to rebuild. A neverending circle.
Jair Ventura
New member
- I'm referring to their European form. They're better built for success today than they were when they were being carried by Lacazette.
- Their qualifying is proof that Lyon has progressed from where they were a few seasons ago. At least in Europe.
Lyon has stronger finances than these clubs(they own their stadium, aren't in trouble with FFP, and don't have huge debts), on top of having a more talented team(imo). They also qualified for the round of 16 of the UCL, which only Roma was able to accomplish.
Youth competitions don't define the strength of a generation though, but growing into first team footballers. In that respect British academies have a long way to go.
Jair Ventura
New member
They aren't selling more players than they're able to replace.
They qualified for the round of 16 for the first time since the 11/12 season. That is progression.
- Huh? Lyon is lead by Anthony Lopes(28), Nabil Fekir(25), Memphis Depay(24), and Marcelo(31). They have a lot of young players as well but I don't consider 22-23 year old players to be youngsters.
- They're as much a selling club as Dortmund, Napoli, or Tottenham(or most clubs in the world outside of Spain's big two, EPL's top four, or PSG and Bayern). They sell to the very best clubs in the world, but never to such an extent that they hurt their own ambitions, and they always demand a respectable fee.
- I wouldn't speak so soon. One or both could land in Pairs.
- Despite the leagues selling positionality there's still more talent in France than in Italy or Germany.
As I mentioned above, all but a handful of clubs are selling clubs. That includes top clubs like Atletico and Dortmund.
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