Mavericky Puig
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Birdy
Senior Member
A game where he showed very clearly WHY he is behind every other md we have in the pecking order.
The fact that so many are praising him for his performance shows what's wrong with their understanding of his game.
Oh, and if that's his GOOD GAME, then thank God he will not play again when Gavi, Pedri, FDJ and Nico are all fit
Overall remarks on his flaws:
In general, he plays like an automaton with little or no intelligence. He doesn't think what to do, just repeats the same thing again and again, no matter where his teammates are, or what is the situation of the play around him.
More specifically:
His best trait is probably his desire to press high. He runs like a headless chicken, but that can be useful in a team that wants to press as high as possible.
And pressing is probably the thing that requires less intelligence than anything else.
Therefore, he won a couple of balls, and was the only aspect of his game that proved decent.
He also had a couple of good turns when on the ball to avoid pressure from on-coming Mallorca runners.
But that's nothing spectacular that all other Barca mds do not have.
Remember Arthur was a king at this, but it didn't make him the md Barca needed, right?
Then the flaws start, stemming from his 'automaton-like', unintelligent behavior, which has many manifestations. let's go:
BRAINLESS AUTOMATON EXHIBIT 1:
He is attracted to the ball like a magnet. No matter where he is, he drives himself close to the ball.
AS CLOSE AS POSSIBLE, without realizing not only that this is not always the best option
(like for instance: where are his teammates? Is dropping deep to collect the responsibility of another player, like the no6? Is that move needed by the play? etc)
but even worse, by getting so close he OBSTRUCTS the pass to any other teammate.
BRAINLESS AUTOMATON EXHIBIT 2:
Variation of the same inability to realize his relative position in space, manifests itself when he has the ball,
and decides to pass to a teammate that is SO CLOSE to him that the pass is not only NOT WARRANTED, but it can be dangerous (possibility for an opponent to steal), or it just SLOWS DOWN PLAY (a recurrent theme with him as we will see)
He behaves as if he is doing aimless rondos: if he could make 0.1m passes all the time to a player next to him, he would do it.
BRAINLESS AUTOMATON EXHIBIT 3:
Whenever he receives at his left interior position, or anywhere in the left half-space,
he has his body always half-turned to the right, and he 9 OUT OF 10 TIMES picks an easy pass to his RIGHT: a teammate free on that direction.
Sometimes that can be useful. But ONLY SOMETIMES.
The problem is he does this ALMOST ALL THE TIMES, WITHOUT any consideration WHETHER that's the right pass to progress play.
Like a brainless automaton, he will always pick the free man on his right, who in many cases can be behind him, or even next to him.
The result is killing plays that had progressed well until him.
(I amazed that Bobo your bias in his favor makes you think that the 'Iniesta-like' (sic) pass at 2.28' was a good pass
.Ilias is already driving, he passed the ball to him with the hope to play an one two, and Mavericky kills the idea and the play by passing it backwards to a free teammate)
BRAINLESS AUTOMATON EXHIBIT 4:
Second variation of the same problem.
He can't orient himself in space like Xavi once did, or like Busi still does (Having scanned the space beforehand) in order to play an one-touch pass between the lines.
On the contrary, he very often takes 2 or 3 touches to do his thing (pick the free man on his right), and that means that he takes AWEFUL LOT time on the ball, and HENCE he SLOWS DOWN PLAY through another way
It's astonishing that some are tricked by his 'electric' kind of stepping or running to believe that he does things in 'electric' speed as well.
No, it's stylistics, and the actual time he takes on the ball is awful lot.
Xavi or Busi never had an 'electric' style, but they were passing the damn ball fast without redundant touches!
BRAINLESS AUTOMATON EXHIBIT 5:
When he is close to his own box, he is LIKE A HEADLESS CHICKEN again applying the same pressure as to when he is pressuring close to the opposition box.
He doesn't have the intelligence and nuance to understand that you need to be more cautious when you are close or inside your own box in defending (you don't go full force against the opponent), OR OTHERWISE you are gonna give in cheap and painful fouls to the opposition.
PS: BRAINLESS AUTOMATON Highlight:
People talking about Dembele's IQ, and didn't see this?
Look at an exemplar brainless automaton move at 0.24' by Mavericky that shows his football IQ:
Jutgla drives with the ball into dangerous position just outside the box, with Araujo and Luuk close to him.
A shot from there would be a decent option, or a good pass can put either of them into 1 v 1 with the keeper.
But NO! Jutgla is not allowed to any of the options above, as Mavericky pops up in front of him, and sweetly steals the ball from his teammate's feet to kick it back into a pass that kills the play entirely.
LOL
WHAT A FUCKING MOVE!
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Messigician
Senior Member
Birdy is the guy who popped into match chat and first thing he said is substitute Puig
Don't pay the attention server any mind
Don't pay the attention server any mind
BerkeleyBernie
Senior Member
Yeah, what's up with all the short passes to the player nearest to him? As if that's any way to play football, sheesh. More long forward passes!!
Messi983
Senior Member
1. No, Messi would see 5 Mallorca defenders moving to the right and Mingueza not being high enough on the pitch, turn it around and play a through ball to Jutgla who was in a good position.
2. Nope again, a prime Busi would never play that slowly pass on the ground behind his teammate with two opponent players close and risk to intercept in a dangerous position.
3. Again too slow/wobbly passes that barely get to his team mates.
4. Xavi would play a sharp through ball to overlaping Mingueza.
Look at an exemplar brainless automaton move at 0.24' by Mavericky that shows his football IQ:
Jutgla drives with the ball into dangerous position just outside the box, with Araujo and Luuk close to him.
A shot from there would be a decent option, or a good pass can put either of them into 1 v 1 with the keeper.
But NO! Jutgla is not allowed to any of the options above, as Mavericky pops up in front of him, and sweetly steals the ball from his teammate's feet to kick it back into a pass that kills the play entirely.
LOL
Lol yeah, was already wondering during the game WTF he was doing there.
I like how 9 ball recoveries is casually changed to a couple of ball recoveries.
Puig is polarizing, but I think if Gavi gave the Mallorca performance (witj half the team missing through covid no doubt mentioned) that his thread would be filled with superlatives.
Is it a size thing, an age thing? Or Puig has a punchable face. Whatever it is it seems Puig cant just be praised for a good game.
Puig is polarizing, but I think if Gavi gave the Mallorca performance (witj half the team missing through covid no doubt mentioned) that his thread would be filled with superlatives.
Is it a size thing, an age thing? Or Puig has a punchable face. Whatever it is it seems Puig cant just be praised for a good game.
Messi983
Senior Member
I mainly have three problems with him.
1. his fan boys like Bobo overrating his every move and comparing his actions to GOATs like Messi and Xaviesta when I see nothing like that. He had an ok game but nothing more imo. For me he's probably the most overrated kid coming through La Masia who has shown less than likes of Bojan and Deulofeu (I won't mention someone like Samper who has played one game for the first team IIRC) despite playing in 50 games already for the first team. And then you also have people thinking he could be a bench player for teams like Bayern or Liverpool.
He has a solid potential (but with each season him being happy to be a bench warmer here instead of getting more playing time elsewhere it's less likely he'll ever reach that potential) but just don't see him ever making it. After leaving Barca I think he'll have problems to establish himself as a starter for a midtable team like Denis Suarez (for example, at Riqui's current age Denis was actually a starter for a good Villarreal team before we've brought him back) or Alena because his playing style only fits teams playing similar to Barca and there aren't many lower table teams like that out there.
2. his resistance going on loan (especially when he was clearly told by Koeman last year he won't play if he stays) and prove himself outside of Barca before potentially coming back when not one or two but Xavi (who was supposed to be his savioiur) now being a 4th coach who doesn't rate him too much.
It's not like we are still playing oldies like Raki and Vidal in front of him but we have 3 younger players already over taking him on the pecking order and if he'll stick around for another season or two there will probably be likes of Txus Alba, Casado or Garrido also getting a chance and play more minutes than him. So also don't see point keeping faith in him because he's "our future" when we already have younger, better and more proven players than him.
3. related to second point he just strikes me as an unambitious kid who prefers to enjoy a fame of being a Barca player and having some fans still adore him instead of going outside of his comfort zone, prove he's really as good as his fans believe he is and come back as a better player ready to compete with likes of Pedri, Gavi and Nico for his minutes. Because as of now he's nowhere near their level imo despite being a few years older and I doubt he'll ever be.
1. his fan boys like Bobo overrating his every move and comparing his actions to GOATs like Messi and Xaviesta when I see nothing like that. He had an ok game but nothing more imo. For me he's probably the most overrated kid coming through La Masia who has shown less than likes of Bojan and Deulofeu (I won't mention someone like Samper who has played one game for the first team IIRC) despite playing in 50 games already for the first team. And then you also have people thinking he could be a bench player for teams like Bayern or Liverpool.
He has a solid potential (but with each season him being happy to be a bench warmer here instead of getting more playing time elsewhere it's less likely he'll ever reach that potential) but just don't see him ever making it. After leaving Barca I think he'll have problems to establish himself as a starter for a midtable team like Denis Suarez (for example, at Riqui's current age Denis was actually a starter for a good Villarreal team before we've brought him back) or Alena because his playing style only fits teams playing similar to Barca and there aren't many lower table teams like that out there.
2. his resistance going on loan (especially when he was clearly told by Koeman last year he won't play if he stays) and prove himself outside of Barca before potentially coming back when not one or two but Xavi (who was supposed to be his savioiur) now being a 4th coach who doesn't rate him too much.
It's not like we are still playing oldies like Raki and Vidal in front of him but we have 3 younger players already over taking him on the pecking order and if he'll stick around for another season or two there will probably be likes of Txus Alba, Casado or Garrido also getting a chance and play more minutes than him. So also don't see point keeping faith in him because he's "our future" when we already have younger, better and more proven players than him.
3. related to second point he just strikes me as an unambitious kid who prefers to enjoy a fame of being a Barca player and having some fans still adore him instead of going outside of his comfort zone, prove he's really as good as his fans believe he is and come back as a better player ready to compete with likes of Pedri, Gavi and Nico for his minutes. Because as of now he's nowhere near their level imo despite being a few years older and I doubt he'll ever be.
ajnotkeith
Senior Member
There is a honeymoon for youth players in their first seasons in the A team. Once they have spent enough time in the first team people judge them by their real standards. Puig has been in and around the first team for a while now so he lost that hubris being 22. Also consider Puig was touted from a very young age to become a great talent. Currently we don't know if he is even Getafe level yet (mainly because of how much he rides the bench)
When Gavi and Nico and Abde and whoever have played a season in the first team they will be treated a similar way where people don't write 'Amazing' after every performance even if it was average.
Puig played good but for example Bobo putting comparisons to Messi and Busquets for taking a couple nice touches is equally or more delusional than some of the people you describe.
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Xavi: “I am very happy with Riqui, he gives us fluidity and plays our game, we insist that he looks before receiving the ball, we insist on game situations that he must understand. Riqui must be important for the team, he is in an area of great competition.”
Pretty much what most here - minus Bobo - were saying.
Pretty much what most here - minus Bobo - were saying.
ajnotkeith
Senior Member
Judging by what we saw he defo has usefulness from the bench and occasionally starting. It's very hard for him to overtake any midfield prospects, but if he plays solid games like that, he'll get his share of minutes.
BusiTheKing
Senior Member
A game where he showed very clearly WHY he is behind every other md we have in the pecking order.
The fact that so many are praising him for his performance shows what's wrong with their understanding of his game.
Oh, and if that's his GOOD GAME, then thank God he will not play again when Gavi, Pedri, FDJ and Nico are all fit
Overall remarks on his flaws:
In general, he plays like an automaton with little or no intelligence. He doesn't think what to do, just repeats the same thing again and again, no matter where his teammates are, or what is the situation of the play around him.
More specifically:
His best trait is probably his desire to press high. He runs like a headless chicken, but that can be useful in a team that wants to press as high as possible.
And pressing is probably the thing that requires less intelligence than anything else.
Therefore, he won a couple of balls, and was the only aspect of his game that proved decent.
He also had a couple of good turns when on the ball to avoid pressure from on-coming Mallorca runners.
But that's nothing spectacular that all other Barca mds do not have.
Remember Arthur was a king at this, but it didn't make him the md Barca needed, right?
Then the flaws start, stemming from his 'automaton-like', unintelligent behavior, which has many manifestations. let's go:
BRAINLESS AUTOMATON EXHIBIT 1:
He is attracted to the ball like a magnet. No matter where he is, he drives himself close to the ball.
AS CLOSE AS POSSIBLE, without realizing not only that this is not always the best option
(like for instance: where are his teammates? Is dropping deep to collect the responsibility of another player, like the no6? Is that move needed by the play? etc)
but even worse, by getting so close he OBSTRUCTS the pass to any other teammate.
BRAINLESS AUTOMATON EXHIBIT 2:
Variation of the same inability to realize his relative position in space, manifests itself when he has the ball,
and decides to pass to a teammate that is SO CLOSE to him that the pass is not only NOT WARRANTED, but it can be dangerous (possibility for an opponent to steal), or it just SLOWS DOWN PLAY (a recurrent theme with him as we will see)
He behaves as if he is doing aimless rondos: if he could make 0.1m passes all the time to a player next to him, he would do it.
BRAINLESS AUTOMATON EXHIBIT 3:
Whenever he receives at his left interior position, or anywhere in the left half-space,
he has his body always half-turned to the right, and he 9 OUT OF 10 TIMES picks an easy pass to his RIGHT: a teammate free on that direction.
Sometimes that can be useful. But ONLY SOMETIMES.
The problem is he does this ALMOST ALL THE TIMES, WITHOUT any consideration WHETHER that's the right pass to progress play.
Like a brainless automaton, he will always pick the free man on his right, who in many cases can be behind him, or even next to him.
The result is killing plays that had progressed well until him.
(I amazed that Bobo your bias in his favor makes you think that the 'Iniesta-like' (sic) pass at 2.28' was a good pass
Ilias is already driving, he passed the ball to him with the hope to play an one two, and Mavericky kills the idea and the play by passing it backwards to a free teammate)
BRAINLESS AUTOMATON EXHIBIT 4:
Second variation of the same problem.
He can't orient himself in space like Xavi once did, or like Busi still does (Having scanned the space beforehand) in order to play an one-touch pass between the lines.
On the contrary, he very often takes 2 or 3 touches to do his thing (pick the free man on his right), and that means that he takes AWEFUL LOT time on the ball, and HENCE he SLOWS DOWN PLAY through another way
It's astonishing that some are tricked by his 'electric' kind of stepping or running to believe that he does things in 'electric' speed as well.
No, it's stylistics, and the actual time he takes on the ball is awful lot.
Xavi or Busi never had an 'electric' style, but they were passing the damn ball fast without redundant touches!
BRAINLESS AUTOMATON EXHIBIT 5:
When he is close to his own box, he is LIKE A HEADLESS CHICKEN again applying the same pressure as to when he is pressuring close to the opposition box.
He doesn't have the intelligence and nuance to understand that you need to be more cautious when you are close or inside your own box in defending (you don't go full force against the opponent), OR OTHERWISE you are gonna give in cheap and painful fouls to the opposition.
PS: BRAINLESS AUTOMATON Highlight:
People talking about Dembele's IQ, and didn't see this?
Look at an exemplar brainless automaton move at 0.24' by Mavericky that shows his football IQ:
Jutgla drives with the ball into dangerous position just outside the box, with Araujo and Luuk close to him.
A shot from there would be a decent option, or a good pass can put either of them into 1 v 1 with the keeper.
But NO! Jutgla is not allowed to any of the options above, as Mavericky pops up in front of him, and sweetly steals the ball from his teammate's feet to kick it back into a pass that kills the play entirely.
LOL
I don't recognize these points at all. If your example at 0:24 is supposed to be some scintillating cystalization of his awfulness, I'm pretty sure it's evidence enough that you're very biased.
JamDav1982
Senior Member
He wasnt great and wasnt bad v Mallorca he was just his usual and showed his game.
Moves ball quickly in small areas, runs a lot but limited on ball at much else with no real awareness of what is around him on pitch bar within 10yds, limited range of passing and little threat in final third.
At this point the debate is how much think a player gives that can move ball quickly in middle of park with the limitations he has.
There is no real debate left on what he is good/bad at now just how effective think he is within that.
Barca would sell him given half a chance but cant see any offers for him or decent team that can spend in a top league looking at him and thinking what he has can improve them.
Have to add he is thoroughly unlikeable and entitled and more than once was bitching at players on pitch v Mallorca..not really relevant to him as a player but he is proper wee bellend.
Moves ball quickly in small areas, runs a lot but limited on ball at much else with no real awareness of what is around him on pitch bar within 10yds, limited range of passing and little threat in final third.
At this point the debate is how much think a player gives that can move ball quickly in middle of park with the limitations he has.
There is no real debate left on what he is good/bad at now just how effective think he is within that.
Barca would sell him given half a chance but cant see any offers for him or decent team that can spend in a top league looking at him and thinking what he has can improve them.
Have to add he is thoroughly unlikeable and entitled and more than once was bitching at players on pitch v Mallorca..not really relevant to him as a player but he is proper wee bellend.
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Bobo32
Senior Member
Obviously a bit tongue in cheek there, but yes these are reminiscent moves to me.
1. Only talking about the shot feint and awareness, copy of Messi, didn't see it very often by any other player. Betis had one player 20 years ago who did a similar waiting move but with an elastico, but I forgot his name...
2. It's a brilliant little pass, one step ahead, and a surprising angle, like Busi. Frenkie turns the wrong way, but he had a lot of time and space there.
3. It's about the cool calmness with which he uses the short passing to drag opponents in while in full control, like Iniesta or a bullfighter.
4. Nah I don't think so, him choosing the winger instead to create a 2v1 is exactly why I said Xavi. Most midfielders would see the run and attempt the sharper ball, but not Xavi most of the time.
Agreed.
He does have 2 tendencies that he and Xavi will have to work on when on the ball. An over reliance to move the ball to the right side, even if there are better options behind or on the left. And second, lack of a decisive pass (I think the last one I can recall off the top of my head was a lobbed through ball vs Atletico around his breakthrough).
Love his intricate play, speed of pass and that he quickens the tempo though. For RU fans, he plays football like a fly-half. Hovers around the ball, creates possession overloads and quickly offloads it.
He should be the guy you add to the midfield when you need to suffocate your opponent in second halves. Also for that period when our tempo and focus tends to drop and we start to play lethargic. IMO.
Bobo32
Senior Member
He played a great through ball to Sergi Roberto this pre season, also his long pass to Dani Alves was brilliant. Also did you see his flick to Luuk de Jong on sunday that I mentioned in another post? He has these very nice line breaking passes close to the box that really could be a weapon, too. Otherwise he tried these lobbed passes a lot, but he seems to lack an ounce of technique to make them work. There was another longer pass vs Boca that was heroically captured but would otherwise set one player free.
He has a bit of work to do in his risk assesment and decision making. He sometimes played too patiently and sometimes too forced, I always thought it would be better with more playing time.
I hope he gets to play some games more from the start in the coming games now (tomorrow for example?) and maybe even begin to feel he doesn't need to prove a lot every single minute.
I agree that he otherwise could bring a lot from the bench in these cases you mention especially. Gavi is a good starting option at left interior.
Wrt him moving the ball to the right side, I think you can compare it a bit to Robben cutting inside... The pass to the left winger or overlapping left back is always there and he sees the options, but he mostly prefers to look for other options first. He switches play over to the right a lot, but when the opponent leaves space he finds the sharper passes immediately I think, and he spots it when the LB/LW is the best option, too. Mostly, it won't be obviously.
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