6 - Gavi

serghei said:
Yeah, but I read a medicine report a while back that ties meniscus damage to a previous ACL surgery.
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The meniscus injury was impact injury in training was it not?

But even then it doesnt mean his ACL is weak 2 and a half years after injuring it.

Woudlnt be surprised if he has been advised to get leaner for mobility and lessen impact of joints on his squat style.

Not that a physio but as said a heap of times on here remember Arsenal fearing Wilshere injuries due to his squat/heavy frame.
 
If you don't rate Gavi as a footballing talent you don't know football.

He played above expectations yesterday, but let's not expect it every game, he will still have ups & downs.

Next season he should be good.

He was looking great in the pre season before his most recent injury.

If he looks like that again this pre season I will be encouraged.
 
JamDav1982 said:
The meniscus injury was impact injury in training was it not?

But even then it doesnt mean his ACL is weak 2 and a half years after injuring it.
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It was, but it was same knee, no? Basically I read that when you have an ACL surgery, it takes some time for the knee to become fully stable again, and in that time, meniscus can take more abuse, and sometimes it gets torn also. Many times, meniscus is heavily damaged at the same time as the ACL, sometimes after surgery.

Gavi's Rambo stille after coming back from ACL surgery didn't help his cause. Maybe the club and the player learned how to deal with it.
 
Pre season only means so much.

Some players come back flying with full fitness and play it like real games and point to prove while others have had to rest up and getting fit again.

See it near on every summer at every club.

He was ok yesterday. Stuck in and looked ok mobility wise.

Needs to do a lot more on ball though.

Needs to carry ball more into space and show more range on passing.

Yesterday was a Puig type game on ball.. passing it backwards and sideways 20 yds to first man open while opposition sit off.

It was ok as they barely pressed but needs more than that.
 
JamDav1982 said:
Mentioned it many times he looks leaner.

He didnt injure his ligaments again though.

His ACL is long past and as many players have shown and likes of Bernal at Barca latest one it doesnt take 2 years.
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Looks more like he did when he came through initially. He was much smaller.

He added some mass after his first seasons which didn't seem to help him much, except make him less agile.

He was great in tight spaces and had a decent change of pace in his first senior season, he used to try much more with the ball then. His development went backwards under Xavi when he tried to mold himself into some destroyer type player and just negated everything he is actually good at.

Hopefully he will realise that he needs a fresh start and has to understand what his style is as a player.
 
Yes, this is the path for him forward. Control his impulses, apply pressure and intensity in a non-chaotic way, and get more daring on the ball, not just one time safe passes mostly.
 
Think we all noticed the safe passs, I think he's just working his way back & doesn't want to over complicate things.

That definitely needs to improve has he regains confidence
 
Barca wouldnt do it most likely but wouldnt even mind him being given a man marking job if against likes of PSG.

Ask him to go and piss off Vitinha and let Frenkie/Pedri try to do more on ball.

Dont agree with this AML left role again.

Needs to be deeper and learn game.
 
Same. His place is to add the workrate, and intensity in midfield. Be a hard player to dribble, annoy opponents, but he has to add something extra on the ball also. Be it goals from time to time (and not just vs weaker sides), better passing, or preferrably both. He will never have to be main playmaker or close, but he can still make a difference in certain circumstances.

I don't see him at all as a wide player except in a more defensive and pragmatic system.
 
Best 'midfielder' on the park yesterday was Greizmann.

He was brilliant and constantly picked the correct pass to open game up and never stopped pressing.

If Gavi could have some of that on the ball would go a long way.
 
Makes you think a bit doesn't it? Griezmann and Dembele weren't bad players, and just because they didn't fit with Messi and Suarez, doesn't mean they couldn't have done something in a new side.
 
I still remember in his first season his game vs Elche..


The goal and assist here is like watching a different player, taking on 2 or 3 players, quick feet in tight spaces, bursts of accel whilst carrying the ball into traffic...

Granted weak opposition, but its like since his second senior season we are watching a different person, he doesn't play with anywhere near the flair he did initially. He moved away from what could make him special, to pursue a role he is not really good at.

His technique and close control is what he should be focusing on to help him make the difference, and the workrate should be an added plus. He isn't that good at defending (in terms of skill, tackling, marking, positioning etc) despite being very tenacious, and he's not a physical destroyer type. But he can definitely be a great CM if he focuses on his quality on the ball.

Hope that Flick is aware of his confused development and will guide him back into his correct style.
 
serghei said:
Makes you think a bit doesn't it? Griezmann and Dembele weren't bad players, and just because they didn't fit with Messi and Suarez, doesn't mean they couldn't have done something in a new side.
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We already knew that, but especially for Dembele.

He left because we messed him around, and he was coming into his own here, many of us said it was a big mistake if we tried to force him out, it was clear even in his bad form that he is a very rare talent.

A fully both footed, incredible athlete, with amazing takeon quality, a great final ball, great dribbling, good vision etc. Those players rarely come around and his 'failure' here was simply that he spent more time injured than playing.

And once he finally started to gain rhythm here we failed the negotiation, that is one of the things I hold against the current board, him leaving like that was a huge failure.
 
ajnotkeith said:
We already knew that, but especially for Dembele.

He left because we messed him around, and he was coming into his own here, many of us said it was a big mistake if we tried to force him out, it was clear even in his bad form that he is a very rare talent.

A fully both footed, incredible athlete, with amazing takeon quality, a great final ball, great dribbling, good vision etc. Those players rarely come around and his 'failure' here was simply that he spent more time injured than playing.

And once he finally started to gain rhythm here we failed the negotiation, that is one of the things I hold against the current board, him leaving like that was a huge failure.
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His problem was he couldn't out of the hospital
 
Patrick Vieira "putting you head where players put feet, shows great leadership,that's a man you want to would follow".

He wasn't talking specifically about gavi, but just saying.
 
There are players that are top and will go full blooded as part of their make up.

There are players like Phil Jones who becomes a meme as all known for.

The top leaders are those who have the bravery and skill to do it with ball at feet above all else.

Folk clap far too hard for things that dont matter nearly as much as they think.
 
I realize he is still in a recovery mode from his last injury but I don't see a progressive ball carrier yet like prior to the injury. Time will tell
 
He has never been a ball carrier in way Pedri and Frenkie carry it.

Never been a progressive midfielder either.. he is far far behind Frenkie and Pedri on that also. He to this point in his career has been closer to Casado/Puig La Masia midfielder that passes ball to first man sees open and too often backwards/sideways that goes nowhere.

Gavi has been a limited midfielder on ball that works his cock off and is aggressive. Closer to Casado on ball.

His best times at opening game up are when can take it on half turn and spin opponent. But loses it, gets fouled a fair bit doing that also.

Possibly La Masia coaching on moving ball quickly but as go up levels and teams are more structured now it needs more pause and vision than first pass see.

Time yet to develop but a lot of these La Masia midfielders come through and hit a wall as 'over coached' and on them to get past it.

Bernal is not particularly progressive at this point either and it is why Pedri has to play so deep when beside him and Flick lets Bernal get in box more.

When you watch Fermin.. for his faults and strengths you can see why probably wasnt rated all that highly in latter years of La Masia.. his height at time but also he most likely didnt fit this idea of positional ball mover to first man open.

The most progressive midfielders Barca have.. Pedri, Frenkie, Fermin, Olmo.. None of them came through La Masia to first team.
 
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JamDav1982 said:
There are players that are top and will go full blooded as part of their make up.

There are players like Phil Jones who becomes a meme as all known for.

The top leaders are those who have the bravery and skill to do it with ball at feet above all else.

Folk clap far too hard for things that dont matter nearly as much as they think.
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Flick always stresses the work without ball. Both of our goals yesterday were scored after turnovers.
 
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