11 - Raphinha

ajnotkeith said:
Replacing him will open a big question tactically.

Because Raphinha is more of an off the ball winger. So will they replace him with someone similar, who is more movement based and runs in behind, or a ball to feet winger who can 1v1 the fullback and stretch the game as a ball handler, similar to Yamal and Dembele of the past.


Having the imbalance on both wings where on one we have a ball carrier and dribbling threat in Yamal and on the other we have a winger attacking the space in behind has actually worked really well, especially in Flick's first season. The matchups Yamal can create with his threat allowed Raphinha to attack in behind and finish off chances.

But in PSG's model, they have ball carriers on both wings and up front in Dembele, Kvara and Doue which allows them to consistently create numerical superiority in attacking situations, since their forwards are so good at drawing players out of position with their dribbling. However they don't have a forward who is as strong off the ball so they often score very individual goals, cutting and shooting etc, they don't attack off the ball as much.

Nico and Barcola would be an example of wingers who are more ball to feet. Nico is mixed type but he generally does his best work when he can take on players. Similar for Barcola. So we would have two takeon threats wide and ideally we would have a player that can attack the centre of the pitch and take advantage of the space they create. More similar to Raphinha are players like Lookman and Rashford (but Rashford's intensity is nowhere close which makes him a bad fulltime replacement). Its hard to find a like for like so we might have to opt for someone with a different style although names are limited. A good idea could be, if he leaves, to sign one proven forward and one young/developmental player who might pay off like Godts (need to look closer at him as haven't watched him before). Yildiz would be a good option but Juventus will probably not sell below 90 million or so.

It also occurs to me that the news that the club is looking for a new winger would also make sense in light of this news, although the names proposed like Abde, Rashford and Virgili don't rise to the level of replacing him.
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Diomande?
 
thestig said:
They were also strong rumors about him going to Saudi in the past, I think in Xavi's last season? I think he later said he was willing to leave so that tells a lot about him and his ambition, he was never the smartest player and he didn't earn in his career as much as many worse players did so I think he would accept the offer if they offered him a huge wage.

It makes some sense for the club also if the fee is 100+ but firsty I doubt that it will be so high and secondly I'm afraid we won't replace him with a proper player. There is no indication we'll be in 1:1 this transfer window so how much of the fee would we even be capable to spend?
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Its a case of selling at the right time because given the context it really wouldn't be surprising if his performance starts to decline in future.

He is a great player, but his game relies so much on his drive and physicality. So if he is 29 and trying to earn a big contract elsewhere, it might simply be a matter of business in that his value has peaked and could go down later.

If it was a guarantee that he remains in this physical condition for the next 3 or 4 years then great, should keep him, but we can't know that. In 2025 he discussed that he rejected the offer from Saudi Arabia after talking with Flick but that he was heavily tempted by it because of how it can enrich his family. I don't think it is long regardless of what the club does before he decides to cash out.

I think that the fee will be at least 100m. If it's lower don't sell. There's no way a 29 year old Barca winger coming off a 35 goal season and currently on G+A every 77 mins this season will cost less than 100m from Saudi Arabia, especially considering the league is about to lose some important players due to the geopolitical situation.

I am fairly sure it will depend on what he wants. The club won't want to put him on the market, but if he wants to leave, they will also be happy to sell him. They will want to make sure that if he wants out, to collect the maximum fee possible before his motivation drops and his value drops in the next couple years.
 
Raphinha said he was willing to leave, in the context of saving his career and dissatisfaction with Xavi as a coach. I am not sure how we can interpret that as him willing to accept a move to Saudi.

ZenI said:
Diomande?
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He ulis the first name that will be mentioned. And tbf for good reasons, he fits the "best of two worlds" on paper. Top dribbler, good scorer and play on both sides.

However, he barely impressed enough last year in Spain, and watching him in African Cup of Nations, he looked below average. He was easily contained by mediocre fullbacks of Egypt's team, and trust me, fullbacks are our worst positions, we don't have a proper coach either to claim we killed them tactically.

NT football is very dependent on experience, and whenever a teenage do great it is because he had experienced elite team around him (Think of Lamine with Spain or 2018 Mbappe with France) and Ivory Coast didn't have that.

However, Bundesliga has long history of producing the most overrated attackers. It is more likely to get a Havartez or Woltemade, Kai or Sancho, than Lewa or Halaand.
 
I would say this, if you sell Raphinha, you absolutely need to nail 3 attacking signings, including two World Class starter and one solid rotation.

I would say for example, get Alvarez, Barcola and maybe a new rotation winger. Rashford or someone who is absolutely better.

Without Raphinha, there is no room for half measures. No Oyarzabal/Muriqi type of attacker signing for CF.
 
It's hard to tell but it's very possible that Raphinha's decline already started with this season that was full of injuries and inconsistency. It's obvious a player like him will age badly, he needs to be at 100% or he's almost useless because of his style of play. Messi/Yamal types of players can be great even when physicality goes, Raphinha can't and it's possible it already started to happen and transfer this summer would save us long term but it's very hard to justify wanting to sell him knowing how bad the market for wingers is and the state of our sporting departement.
 
As Wenger always says, Athletic players like Raphinha lasts longer unless they get injured badly. When they lose a step, they are still fairly quick and athletic, when they lose two, they are just similar.

Messi is closer to Raphinha in that regard. He was a physical demon and remained fairly athletic for his age.

Injuries is the key word, though
 
If he himself wants to leave, than ok I guess. But maybe chill with talk about decline just yet, dude was just 5th on Ballon. Ideally I would try to keep him another 2 seasons and than sell him for 30ish. I honestly don't think we would get anywhere near 100M like some of you speculate...
 
Khaled_a_d said:
Raphinha said he was willing to leave, in the context of saving his career and dissatisfaction with Xavi as a coach. I am not sure how we can interpret that as him willing to accept a move to Saudi.



He ulis the first name that will be mentioned. And tbf for good reasons, he fits the "best of two worlds" on paper. Top dribbler, good scorer and play on both sides.

However, he barely impressed enough last year in Spain, and watching him in African Cup of Nations, he looked below average. He was easily contained by mediocre fullbacks of Egypt's team, and trust me, fullbacks are our worst positions, we don't have a proper coach either to claim we killed them tactically.

NT football is very dependent on experience, and whenever a teenage do great it is because he had experienced elite team around him (Think of Lamine with Spain or 2018 Mbappe with France) and Ivory Coast didn't have that.

However, Bundesliga has long history of producing the most overrated attackers. It is more likely to get a Havartez or Woltemade, Kai or Sancho, than Lewa or Halaand.
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He said this at the time :

“I’ve been playing football since I was 15, I’ve been through good times and bad times everywhere, so there came a point when I thought it was time to take care of myself and my family,” he told ESPN.

“The offer we had from Saudi Arabia really tempted me. It would have solved not just my personal life, but also the lives of my parents, my son… a lot of people.”

So even though the situation with Xavi gave him a push, he also clearly wants a big contract at some point. If he doesn't leave this season he will probably leave after 1-2 seasons.

ZenI said:
Diomande?
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We should consider that he is only 19 and has had essentially 1 full professional season. Even being a player with world class potential, there is a good chance we might have to take our time developing him similarly to how Madrid developed Vinicius. Especially given he plays in the Bundesliga and hasn't played in Europe yet. There is said to be Prem interest in him, if we will have to compete against English clubs, we might need to use the entirety of the cap space we get from Raphinha on signing him.

He's really young at 19 and the latest news is that he wants to stay at Leipzig for a bit longer. So he might not be moving this window anyway and we'll just have to monitor the situation for the future.

I would like the club to be able to sign him, in normal times. But I think this is the sort of player which is destined for the Prem. It probably isn't possible with our finances that we will spend 100m on a player who might not immediately be a starter and give him a big contract which he will surely demand.
 
ZenI said:
If he himself wants to leave, than ok I guess. But maybe chill with talk about decline just yet, dude was just 5th on Ballon. Ideally I would try to keep him another 2 seasons and than sell him for 30ish. I honestly don't think we would get anywhere near 100M like some of you speculate...
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We would get it now. That would be the main reason a sale would be considered.

Because his value might go down in 2 seasons. So we will have to replace him in the near future, and the problem is that we don't have the cap space to be able to sign and develop his replacement before we sell him next season for example (which would be the ideal situation).

That's one problem with having to sell before you can buy, it means that we can't buy replacements ahead of time. With that knowledge, if he wants out, they will allow him. Will be down to what he wants most likely.
 
Sell ASAP! It makes sense in a lot of ways. He's the prototype of player that would go to Saudi or Turkey for big money.
 
Barcaman said:
Why would he want to leave? He's an ambitious guy.

There are 4/5 players that should leave first.
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Money?

4/5 players that might not get offers we like and don't want to move to Saudi. Raphinha looks like the kind of guy who would move there for big bucks.
 
For him to really leave this summer, a few things need to happen

1. He needs to want it himself obviously.
2. The offer must be really good for the club to part with an exceptional player and that will be around 100m.
3. Flick needs to be convinced, that the squad won't be weaker, but even stronger.

The third condition will be the most difficult one, because we all know how important his legs for Flick's tactic is. The statistics with/without Rapha show that clearly as well. So in the end, it's pretty unrealistic that he'll leave this summer.
 
He ain't going nowhere most likely. He's gonna be pumped to win a CL with the club and in the future that could be a palpable opportunity for him to cap off a great Barcelona career in a grand manner. He's what, an inch for being 3x Spanish Champion. That is no joke.

I would generally be against selling players who give everything for the badge. But if some absurd offer comes, which make no mistake should be in excess of 100m, and he wants to taste the sweet Arabian money to be set for life, it's his choice.

In short, the club is gonna rest his choice, he's earned that.

In reality we are in no position to sell any of our starter quality players. We can sell some players, sure, but only for seriously juicy offers. Outside of those offers, we are just preparing to lift yet anything big title with these players. If some want to sign multiple Spanish champions from one of the biggest clubs in the world, many of who are Spanish internationals as well, they'll have to pay up serious money.
 
serghei said:
He ain't going nowhere most likely. He's gonna be pumped to win a CL with the club and in the future that could be a palpable opportunity for him to cap off a great Barcelona career in a grand manner. He's what, an inch for being 3x Spanish Champion. That is no joke.

I would generally be against selling players who give everything for the badge. But if some absurd offer comes, which make no mistake should be in excess of 100m, and he wants to taste the sweet Arabian money to be set for life, it's his choice.

In short, the club is gonna rest his choice, he's earned that.

In reality we are in no position to sell any of our starter quality players. We can sell some players, sure, but only for seriously juicy offers. Outside of those offers, we are just preparing to lift yet anything big title with these players. If some want to sign multiple Spanish champions from one of the biggest clubs in the world, many of who are Spanish internationals as well, they'll have to pay up serious money.
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Nobody is saying to force him out.

Mainly that if he wants to leave the club shouldn't stand in his way.

Because it seems he wants to get a big contract whilst it's still on the table. So if it's not this season it might be the next, or after that, and in that case do you delay the sale or collect the highest fee now?

If he is fully motivated to stay and perform we should keep him.
 
Khaled_a_d said:
As Wenger always says, Athletic players like Raphinha lasts longer unless they get injured badly. When they lose a step, they are still fairly quick and athletic, when they lose two, they are just similar.

Messi is closer to Raphinha in that regard. He was a physical demon and remained fairly athletic for his age.

Injuries is the key word, though
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Raphinha is not super quick for an elite winger and relies more on legs/constant work rate.

There are a ton of athletic players who are not the same once reach early 30s.. while they still may be good but not what were you miss the chance to sell on before decline if are happy with that.

Most of the top athletic players who slow down change their game. Raphinha has ability to do that probably at AM but do Barca need a slowed down Raphinha there as opposed to a fee now or next summer?

That is the decision they would have to make.

If Saudi money remains it has to be an attraction for him considering not had a career of large contracts. Maybe not this summer and the possibility could be he runs down contract for couple years then takes it if there.
 
The main player who brings testosterone to a team full of estrogens. Other would be Araujo, but he's not a Barca caliber player. If Raphinha leaves, there will be a void because Barca has not seen a player like him like forever.
 
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