Quique Setien

[serghei]

To be honest, I don't have much to blame Setien for, some mistakes here and there, but nothing too big. I really don't. I got the feeling from him and his assistants that they came with passion and willing to make a difference. Which is what I wanted. If anything, their 6 months have shown just how deep the problems with the veterans have become in the last few years.

I personally see two ways forward form now. I believe this group of veterans have 1 more La Liga push, after which these players (Messi included) will be nearly completely done at this level. In CL they are done for years, and you can clearly see that looking at the performances away from Camp Nou in the last 5 years (remember these numbers, 0-2, 0-4, 0-3, 0-3, 0-4 ).

In general, I prefer managers trying to change things and failing, than managers trying to hide the problems. For me, the fact that Setien and Sarabia got in conflict with the players are things which speak highly of them. It means they came with a plan, and even if the plan failed because the problems are too hard to fix at this stage, I still commend them for that.

Have to say I have been browsing the comments on Sport and Mundo Deportivo and the fans there were supportive of Setien and especially Sarabia, for coming with balls and trying to address the issues full on. That's the proper mentality. It means the fans are prepared to let go of the veterans and really build a new team. We need a new team with a new core, where the veterans are no longer commanding everything.

Personally, I expect the next season with low enthusiasm. But the 2021-2022 season has potential to be satisfying in some ways, even if we win nothing. There's pleasure in watching a new team grow, and watching young players flourish, even if you don't win big titles for a few years.

 

[FinBarcelonafan]

I think even a coach with no experience like Pimienta sees the writing on the wall. It's career suicide for practically any coach to come here now.

Yes. Truth.

 

[DonAndres]

All good teams were in form in 2017.
Then they dropped in form in 2018 and 2019.
Now they returned to form.

You should have learned that by now.

EV had zero influence.
Anyone would have won 2 La ligas with this set of players.

Lol, you're reaching for those grapes my man.

I guess RM didn't go from 93 points in Lucho's last year to 76 points and then 68 points in EV's years?

You're out here painting the picture as if Valverde was the active hand keeping Barca afloat against all odds, in the face of impending doom. Like some kind of martyr, lmfao.

The truth is he oversaw much of the growing toxicity and dysfunction that exists in the squad now. Performance over time under him declined in almost a linear trajectory. Worse and worse over each passing season, increasingly complacent, fewer training sessions, bigger Amigos influence. As the problems grew and become more glaring in every game, Valverde would just say "it is what it is" and that he didn't give a shit about physical preparation, having fewer and fewer training sessions.

This was all culminated in 2 massive European humiliations, if you recall. Valverde didn't keep us from a decline, he oversaw much of that decline and fostered MANY of the horrible circumstances we've found ourselves in.

Our mistake was not firing him sooner, and getting a better new manager who could reasonably try to reboot the project over a summer. Instead we took the half measure and waited until midseason to fire him and replaced him with a guy who was hanging out with his cows and his only other options were coaching in the Saudi/Qatari leagues.

 

[Richard.H]

I personally see two ways forward form now. I believe this group of veterans have 1 more La Liga push, after which these players (Messi included) will be nearly completely done at this level. In CL they are done for years, and you can clearly see that looking at the performances away from Camp Nou in the last 5 years (remember these numbers, 0-2, 0-4, 0-3, 0-3, 0-4 ).

I'm not even sure if Messi has one more La Liga in him. RM will only get better next year. Vinicius is thriving and Hazard is adjusting to the team. Not to mention they are most likely buying Camavinga too, giving a huge boost to their aging midfield. We will see how it goes, but I fear next year might be even worse in la liga

 

[serghei]

I'm not even sure if Messi has one more La Liga in him. RM will only get better next year. Vinicius is thriving and Hazard is adjusting to the team. Not to mention they are most likely buying Camavinga too, giving a huge boost to their aging midfield. We will see how it goes, but I fear next year might be even worse in la liga

Could be. Yet, would be typical for Madrid to have a stinker season next year in La Liga fighting for the 3rd place. Let's not forget that their main players are still aging veterans like Ramos, Benzema and Kroos.

 

[Birdy]

Setien's only fault was to accept the job offered to him by Bertomeu's gang. I know it's an 'once in a lifetime' opportunity, but if he gets the sack unfairly and eventually be Barca coach only a few months, his spell will only hurt his name.

He has improved how the team plays a lot, and the underlying numbers attest to that.
But there is a limit to what he can do with this ageing and ill-equipped squad.
And there is a harder limit to what he can do within the 'Club de Amigos' clique.

Even if someone like Ronald Koman (worse than Setien in terms of developing playing style, but better in terms of imposing his authority -club legend, strict and demanding hard work) comes, he will be undermined again: He will not be given by the board the power to disband the Amigos, and his fate will be Setien's fate soon...

 

[Givenchy]

I'd love it if Setien, as a goodbye or FU, benched Messi and subbed Suarez off 10mins into the first half. if he starts whinning, send Sarabia on to drag the cunt off

 

[kattanib]

Regarding team performance: Valverde=Setien. We didnt lose the title vs Celta away, Sevilla away or Atletico.

But the latter is such an idiot. He already alienated two players, the dressing room seemingly hates his guts. Pimienta is hopefully a good "buddy" coach and trusts our youth. I would settle for that. Pretty sure he takes over in a month at the latest.

At least he is exposing the skunk fair we have in the locker room. The manager naively thought he had the authority to select who plays and who doesn?t and to give the team instructions on how to do things. Apparently Messi doesn?t want to be told what to do, he is an entitled kid that wants the world to revolve around his wishes

 

[snowy]

At least he is exposing the skunk fair we have in the locker room. The manager naively thought he had the authority to select who plays and who doesn?t and to give the team instructions on how to do things.

man sorry katta but this kind of deduction is so half-ass. I agree with you on the 1st part but Setien didn't push it enough. Ok he benched Suarez the other day. And? The sky didn't fall apart right? So why not bench him again?

Apparently Messi doesn?t want to be told what to do, he is an entitled kid that wants the world to revolve around his wishes

OK so Messi keeps acting like a spoiled kid and throwing tantrums

So what! you're the big boss. It's not like Messi's evil eye will kill you on the spot All Setien needs do is be cool but firm and the rest will follow. Give Barto some shit in the media and he'd become an instant hero in my book

 

[Richard.H]

man sorry katta but this kind of deduction is so half-ass. I agree with you on the 1st part but Setien didn't push it enough. Ok he benched Suarez the other day. And? The sky didn't fall apart right? So why not bench him again?

OK so Messi keeps acting like a spoiled kid and throwing tantrums

So what! you're the big boss. It's not like Messi's evil eye will kill you on the spot All Setien needs do is be cool but firm and the rest will follow. Give Barto some shit in the media and he'd become an instant hero in my book

I sort of agree with this take. He has nothing to lose at this point. He is old and it's almost definite that he will get sacked soon. Might as well bench them and let it all blow up in their faces.

 

[Barcilliant]

Is it Setien and his rumbustious young ward, Eder Sarabia, in charge? To cynics like Alba, Messi and Suarez they are "That Man and Boy Blunder." Would you be surprised if I told you that during one of the lockdown Zoom meetings, several players turned up late and one made it clear that his time was precious and he had other things to be getting on with?

The above was taken from a Graham Hunter espn article.

 

[IvanAtanasov]

We need Roy Keane!

 

[Birdy]

This is a 'must read' :
https://www.espn.com/soccer/barcelo...the-players-who-hold-the-powernot-the-manager

By Simon Cuper, written a few days after Setien was hired.
Apart from the first part - where i think he makes the mistake of equating a way of playing (Cruyffism) with the manager not having authority - it's eye-opening in regards to the power the spoiled, entitled players have.
Some quotes:
"Messi's low charisma and habitual public silence are deceptive ... successive presidents have more or less handed him the keys. Although Barca won't admit it, Messi has unspoken veto power over most player transfers, coach appointments or major tactical decision"
"In recent years, Messi has decided that he no longer has the stamina to press opponents and wants to spend most of the game at inside-right rather than further wide. Whoever happens to be Barca coach has to adapt accordingly"
"In Pique's telling, he says, "Listen, Mr. Valverde, we go to a party." Then he mimics Valverde's reply: "Why? Why? Why? I see no reasons to leave you go to party." Laughing, Pique recalls his own retort: "Doesn't matter, we will go anyway"

 

[Richard.H]

This is a 'must read' :
https://www.espn.com/soccer/barcelo...the-players-who-hold-the-powernot-the-manager

By Simon Cuper, written a few days after Setien was hired.
Apart from the first part - where i think he makes the mistake of equating a way of playing (Cruyffism) with the manager not having authority - it's eye-opening in regards to the power the spoiled, entitled players have.
Some quotes:
"Messi's low charisma and habitual public silence are deceptive ... successive presidents have more or less handed him the keys. Although Barca won't admit it, Messi has unspoken veto power over most player transfers, coach appointments or major tactical decision"
"In recent years, Messi has decided that he no longer has the stamina to press opponents and wants to spend most of the game at inside-right rather than further wide. Whoever happens to be Barca coach has to adapt accordingly"
"In Pique's telling, he says, "Listen, Mr. Valverde, we go to a party." Then he mimics Valverde's reply: "Why? Why? Why? I see no reasons to leave you go to party." Laughing, Pique recalls his own retort: "Doesn't matter, we will go anyway"

@Birdy very good article and it was written back in January. Seems like the writing was on the wall since then. Crazy how he says Valverde told him that the players have to make all the decisions and there isn't much he can do in the way of tactics since every Barca player is experienced in their own roles.

 

[Barcilliant]

These clowns should manage themselves and just get an assistant to arrange the training.
A despicable bunch.