Thiago Alcantara

DonAK

DonAK

President of FC Barcelona
MagIX said:
Exactly.
Reading some posts in the forum....Suarez, Griezmann, Dembele, Messi, Coutinho, Iniesta as starter :facepalm:
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Who would you want instead of Griezmann and Coutinho?

Let's add two tall donkeys instead of two supremely talented players because balance :lol:

Man some of you just want to complain without offering any solutions or alternatives.
 
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jamrock

Senior Member
What I'm hearing here is that rakitic extar few inches on Thiago/coutinho would be more important to out footballing success than, the clear obvious bag in talent between those two and him, every teams needs a keita, we had one in our most successful run,but to say a facking tall runner is better than clear 1 truly WC CM is funny as hell.

Then to point to Madrid with Kross and modric in midfield to make the point is even funnier
 
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JamDav1982

Senior Member
jamrock said:
What I'm hearing here is that rakitic extar few inches on Thiago/coutinho would be more important to out footballing success than, the clear obvious bag in talent between those two and him, every teams needs a keita, we had one in our most successful run,but to say a facking tall runner is better than clear 1 truly WC CM is funny as hell.

Then to point to Madrid with Kross and modric in midfield to make the point is even funnier
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Adding Casimero made that midfield better while Reals front three are all good in the air. Which helps compensate a bit.

The physical side of game cant really be ignored but taken to extremes both ways at times.
 
Yannik

Yannik

Senior Member
I think this height discussion is heavily exaggerated, and you guys were previously complaining that other users overrate possession.
Yes, you can certainly overdo it with height issues, but unless you are greatly exceeding a certain minimum level any combination is totally viable, including a midfield of Thiago-Coutinho-Busquets (who is 1.90m btw). Tall players matter more in defensive areas than upfront (unless you plan to cross for days which I think Barca is the furthest away from). Even smaller players can actually add physicality in challenges as a lower center of gravity gives balance advantages.
 
J

JamDav1982

Senior Member
Yannik said:
I think this height discussion is heavily exaggerated, and you guys were previously complaining that other users overrate possession.
Yes, you can certainly overdo it with height issues, but unless you are greatly exceeding a certain minimum level any combination is totally viable, including a midfield of Thiago-Coutinho-Busquets (who is 1.90m btw). Tall players matter more in defensive areas than upfront (unless you plan to cross for days which I think Barca is the furthest away from). Even smaller players can actually add physicality in challenges as a lower center of gravity gives balance advantages.
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Possession is over rated if become obsessed about to point it becomes a weakness.

Height/power in a team has to be a consideration and the point of having those in forward areas is it can be a big help defensively as well at set pieces etc not that it helps when launching balls into the box.

It is all about getting the right mix.

Busquets is tall but not a particularly powerful player. Someone like Paulinho brings more in that regard.
 
DonAndres

DonAndres

Wild Man of Borneo
If RM won because of their superior physicality mainly then why weren't they impressive at all before 2014? They had Ronaldo, Benzema, Ramos, and even more enforcers in Alonso, Pepe, etc.

The difference was Modric, Kroos, Isco. That is the biggest difference actually and those "midget Xavi players" you guys are shitting on are the biggest reason they went on to destroy Juve in the 2nd half of the final, the main reason they turned around in Europe over these past years. They beat Atleti cause of their skill level, not cause they were more physical (which they never were more than Atleti)

The same reason right now that City are loads better than United. Sterling, Aguero, De Bruyne, Silva, Jesus, etc. All of their biggest impact makers are not physically imposing. Nothing compared to Lukaku, Pogba, Matic, etc. It's skill that wins out. The best players are the most skilled 90% of the time, the best teams dominate BECAUSE of the contributions of those skilled geniuses.
 
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JamDav1982

Senior Member
DonAndres said:
If RM won because of their superior physicality mainly then why weren't they impressive at all before 2014? They had Ronaldo, Benzema, Ramos, and even more enforcers in Alonso, Pepe, etc.

The difference was Modric, Kroos, Isco. That is the biggest difference actually and those "midget Xavi players" you guys are shitting on are the biggest reason they went on to destroy Juve in the 2nd half of the final, the main reason they turned around in Europe over these past years. They beat Atleti cause of their skill level, not cause they were more physical (which they never were more than Atleti)

The same reason right now that City are loads better than United. Sterling, Aguero, De Bruyne, Silva, Jesus, etc. All of their biggest impact makers are not physically imposing. Nothing compared to Lukaku, Pogba, Matic, etc. It's skill that wins out. The best players are the most skilled 90% of the time, the best teams dominate BECAUSE of the contributions of those skilled geniuses.
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Because there need to be the right mix. As far as i am aware no one is saying need a team of beasts to win.

One of Citys best and most important players has been Fernandinho as well. Also Otamendi been big for them in both boxes.

Kyle walker has added power and pace on the right as well.
 
Yannik

Yannik

Senior Member
I also always thought winning headers in midfield seems like a pretty pointless thing to do. After the GK kicks it off, or after a clearance I see players repeatedly contesting for headers and it seems pretty irrelevant wether you win it or not. I mean how often do you actually see the resulting header not just aimlessly punting the ball back to some other place on the pitch where another 2 idiots compete for the next header. And that repeats till the ball looses it's g-force and doesn't bounce above 1.80 anymore. It's usually a shitty and pointless sequence of football played, and the result of it is arbitrary barely in any way influenceable. Only makes sense when you want to kill a few seconds off the clock.
 
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jamrock

Senior Member
How many game winning headers for real madrid score over there successful run, that wasn't score my Ramos?

I'm all for physical players in defensive, and a few in the squad, but in the CM/Am and forward positions I could care less
 
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Hamzah

High Definition Member
In the clasico first half barca had a hard time playing from the back, paulinho winning headers (Suarez to a lesser level) was the only outlet, without that barca would have been killed in the first half
 
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JamDav1982

Senior Member
Yannik said:
I also always thought winning headers in midfield seems like a pretty pointless thing to do. After the GK kicks it off, or after a clearance I see players repeatedly contesting for headers and it seems pretty irrelevant wether you win it or not. I mean how often do you actually see the resulting header not just aimlessly punting the ball back to some other place on the pitch where another 2 idiots compete for the next header. And that repeats till the ball looses it's g-force and doesn't bounce above 1.80 anymore. It's usually a shitty and pointless sequence of football played, and the result of it is arbitrary barely in any way influenceable. Only makes sense when you want to kill a few seconds off the clock.
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It isnt pointless but it is not even close to the reason why at times more physicality is needed in some teams. That physicality could be height/power/pace anything and all teams need elements of it.
 
Yannik

Yannik

Senior Member
Hamzah said:
In the clasico first half barca had a hard time playing from the back, paulinho winning headers (Suarez to a lesser level) was the only outlet, without that barca would have been killed in the first half
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Barca WAS killed in the first half, Ter Stegen dragged you through a barrage of chances and that has been a theme in recent Clasicos..

jamrock said:
How many game winning headers for real madrid score over there successful run, that wasn't score my Ramos?
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and Ramos isn't even particularly tall for CB standards.
 
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Hamzah

High Definition Member
Yannik said:
Barca WAS killed in the first half, Ter Stegen dragged you through a barrage of chances and that has been a theme in recent Clasicos..
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It would have been even worse without Paul and Suarez fighting for those headers as they couldn't play from the back, Madrid would have had more chances and probably scored at least once
 
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JamDav1982

Senior Member
Yannik said:
Barca WAS killed in the first half, Ter Stegen dragged you through a barrage of chances and that has been a theme in recent Clasicos..
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While a Bayern team with Thiago looking pretty on the ball gets torn to shreds by Real virtually every time they meet.

That has been more of a theme.
 
S

Stoichkov1

New member
Yannik said:
Barca WAS killed in the first half, Ter Stegen dragged you through a barrage of chances and that has been a theme in recent Clasicos..



and Ramos isn't even particularly tall for CB standards.
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We weren't really killed, Real had 2 good chances(Benzema header and Ronaldo shot) and Barca had 2(Paulinho header and Paulinho shot). It's true that Real was winning all the duels vs our players and we couldn't get past the midfield line but we defended brilliantly.
 
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