11th January 2017, 03:06 PM
Too many players being "shit" point to the problem being something else. It's not the midfield that's bad, 2/3 of that are still Iniesta and Busi. The whole team going through a bad patch at the same time? They all forgot how to play at once? Naive to think the problem is not the man at the helm.
Originally Posted by Neymessi
And regarding the periods of time the team played well... it was after all that drama, elections called, and licho pretty much abandoned his "gameplay". It's only my opinion, but I think Xavi had a great influence in how we played back then. It still showed during the 1st half of the season after he left, then it slowly started to fade, and now we're playing like total garbage, even worse than we were in the 1st 6 months under licho.
Changing dynamics usually improves a team. I know he won't be fired, but he could resign, and that would be for the best. He's out of ideas and out of his depth.
11th January 2017, 04:02 PM
Yes we indeed turned great when he abondoned his gameplay back then but what makes you think he has returned to it now? People are just trying really hard to belittle the times when we were playing good under him. After his crazy rotations and the anoeta incident, he started playing simple efficient football and has been following that since then. Yeah he has reverted a bit to his rotations thing but still he is rotating nowhere like he used to back then. From his interviews and all I feel he isn't as free to try out his techniques etc due to what hapenned in his first 6 months and has been following the same recipe for some time now.
Originally Posted by FlaFCB
Yeah its not a coincidence that so many people turn crap together but I am not talking about players attributes affected by tactics. Suarez and neymar aren't finishing clinically as they used to be for an example. How can we blame lucho for that?
Just like your opinion that xavi had influence back then, I have an unpopular opinion that nothing specific is there for to blame for our current condition. We went from god mode last season to an average team in the second half of the season and from garbage to god mode the season before that for no apparent reason and I wouldn't be surprised if we turn into god mode now.
But yeah I would totally approve if lucho stepped down if things still don't improve from here on and there is no visible pressure exerted on lucho to step down and he does so in his own volition.
Last edited by Neymessi; 11th January 2017 at 04:37 PM.
11th January 2017, 04:40 PM
What makes me think that? Because now the way the team play is completely different. Midfield isn't "shit", it's being bypassed on purpose. Have you seen how the rcm plays now? Wide and upfront, like in his first 6 months. When the lcm isn't Iniesta, it's the same. Wide and upfront. There's a huge gap in the middle. The team can't cope with high pressure because of that. And the defense gets even more exposed, and more mistakes happen. He also shifted Neymar's position. And Messi is now too central, with no one on the right. A decent coach would fix those problems. And what god mode last season? In 2015, maybe, but the whole of 2016 the team deteriorated, there was no "god" mode.
Originally Posted by Neymessi
11th January 2017, 11:53 PM
As much as we hoped system didn't change tonight. Messi dropped in middle and we were strapped naked on right side as Rafinha (this time) couldn't do anything up-front.
Crowd chanted his name for 15 seconds but it died soon.
Mind you, even with this limited system we can still go all the way but just how much better would it be if Lucho wasn't so stubborn, we'll never know.
12th January 2017, 04:16 AM
12th January 2017, 06:39 AM
The thing is, without Alves to link up with, maybe it is wiser to move Messi more towards the center. This could very well mean Lucho has realised that we lack attacking talent there, both at RB and at RCM. So Messi is pretty alone there.
Last edited by serghei; 12th January 2017 at 06:41 AM.
12th January 2017, 07:51 AM
Since our left aide is so strong and Neymar and Alba are linking well, I'd like to try Iniesta at RCM to bring him.closer to Messi. It would give him someone to link with and give Neymar and Iniesta more room to operate plus balance the team.
12th January 2017, 08:41 AM
Messi is the best playmaker in the team,he is also the best goalscorer in the team,when you have a player like that it is always better for him to play centrally not on the wings. He is also 29 moving to 30 in summer. Players move centrally with age not the vice versa
I would like to see Messi playing on RW again,but really it isn't gonna happen and I think it shouldn't. He is the best player in the team-well in the world actually- and you need to play him in his comfort area not the other way around. The RW experience was gr8 but it was never gonna be long term solution.
It leaves us tactically weak,even with Alves we got exposed when played against strong left side against RM with and with Alves age. With Roberto we got even more exposed.
It leaves us tactically challenged,but I don't think just moving Messi to RW is the right solution either,I think those days are long gone.
I am starting to think that it might be better that Messi moves to AM position in permanent bases next year and we get a new RW and Iniesta starts to take the bench role for him. That would actually makes more sense for Gomes too as he will fit in the LCM with more reserved simple role beside a creative player like Messi too. Either that or get a RB that is really fast with gr8 stamina who can cover the whole right flank. That isn't Roberto nor Cancelo. The only one that might fit the criteria right now is Bellerin as much as I hate to say and even him well be over priced,currently overrated never mind being an Arsenal player who said b4 he won't come back. May be there is some hidden em in France who fit that criteria?
I prefer the 1st solution though
12th January 2017, 09:23 AM
How about Tin Jedvaj then? https://www.whoscored.com/Players/12...how/Tin-Jedvaj
Originally Posted by khaled_a_d
He's only 21 but already plays Alpha similar to Umtiti. Whoscored has him at 184 but I'm pretty sure he's 188cm. Moves well too.
12th January 2017, 09:38 AM
Whoscored... Saw their best rated player this season in all leagues is Neymar
Originally Posted by snowy
From what I know about my compatriot Jedvaj is a right defender who is comfortable as cb. He isn't really suited for wing back role in Barca.
12th January 2017, 09:52 AM
GO GO NeyNey GO
why not suited for Barca wing back? stamina issue due to his size? Shame, it'd be cool to have another tall defender like Pique and Umitities
if so, how about Pereira then? He looks like he could run 4vr:
12th January 2017, 10:14 AM
This theory makes sense to some extent, like: Lucho figured out that Messi is isolated on the right (with Roberto and Rakitic), and this is why he is moving to a center.
Originally Posted by serghei
But, the problem is: Messi was doing the same in the last season also, when we had Dani Alves on the right.
I mean, to some extent it is ok for Messi to move to the center in this season, but why was he doing the same even when we had Alves+Rakitic on that side?
So, it could mean also that Lucho doesn't have anything with that idea, and that Messi just randomly changes positions and does whatever he wants in a certain moment :/
12th January 2017, 10:22 AM
As Bojan said: Jedvaj could be a decent Cb one day if he'll develop well. He has passion and he is quite fast and strong.
Originally Posted by snowy
About him being a RB, he is a pure defender who is for some reason turned into a RB.
His attacking abilities are quite limited in general, not only for a top team like Barca.
One day (if he'll develop extremely well) maybe he'll reach Barca's level as a CB (as said, he is fast, strong, good in air, good in tackles, quite brave, has "balls" and lion heart like Puyol). But as a RB, he is just like Pique/Umtiti/Masch/Mathieu when you put them at LB or RB. Good defending, zero link-up in attack for the highest level.
Last edited by BBZ8800; 12th January 2017 at 10:27 AM.
12th January 2017, 10:46 AM
Not nearly to the same degree imo. Yes, he has had seasons when he drifted in the center more, but now he's basically playing as an attacking central midfielder almost.
Originally Posted by BBZ8800
12th January 2017, 02:28 PM
The best system to play an aging Messi in would be behind Suarez in a 3 line with a double pivot behind him to work as a shield for our back 4. You absolutely can't play Messi in a midfield 3 because he doesn't have the workrate to play there. But if you play him as a trequartista, in a free role, he can shine like a much better Totti until he's 35-36.
Originally Posted by khaled_a_d
We need something like this to make an aging Messi work very well. In this position you can allow Messi and Suarez at the top, and form a tight 4-4 line in defence. For that we need a wing player who is the profile of Pedro or Alexis Sanchez. Fast and hard working, willing to help the defence quite a lot (really surprised that Neymar's been putting some defensive work as well). Also, the DM needs to be very specialist in that position, he must be an ace at fouling at the right time, tackling, and a beast in 1 vs 1 defensively. Both the defenders behind Messi should take only moderate risks. They have to be there if Messi loses the ball, not be caught above Messi on the field, because then every lost ball will potentially lead to an attack being initiated directly on our back 4.
The 4-2-3-1 would mean though, that both wingers need to come down, in order to help on the defensive transition and form a midfield 4, or even midfield 5 if one of Messi and Suarez (they can intercharge) drops a bit. 4-5-1 seems to be the most solid defensive shapes around atm.
Last edited by serghei; 12th January 2017 at 02:45 PM.
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