Quique Setien

Alik said:

Riqui Puig did not get a single chance with Valverde and you think it's inexcusable he is not a starter in Quique's first match?

Bringing him on as a sub was the right decision imo.

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Its inexcusable for the following reason. If you did a poll of Barca fans worldwide, who by the way aren't the most knowledgeable about football, about who would they start vs Granada at home Puig or Rakitic, I'm sure Puig would win by a landslide. I don't even like Puig much but in the match chat he was in my team ahead of Rakitic.

And he ended up doing more in 20 minutes than Rakitic did in 70m. Now, if all of us can see that then why the hell can't our new manager see it? Isn't it inexcusable that he can't see what the majority of the fan base can see clear as day?

We need to stop comparing Setien to EV because we are setting the bar rather low if we do so. This is what is occuring on this forum. Comparing him to EV and making him look like a world class manager as a result. We need to stop doing that.

We need to start comparing Setien to THE STANDARDS EXPECTED OF A BARCELONA MANAGER.

[tw]1219278846798811136[/tw]

No rest. No days off.

13 days of training over the next two weeks.

[tw]1219278707216482305[/tw]

#SetienExcellence

JohnN said:

What reasons exactly, has Setien managed to give in his one week tenure, that can explain the negative bias shown in the forum against him by some people? The answer is none. There is a clear difference here.

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What reasons?
Speak for yourself.

Those things are subjective.
What is a big deal for one fan is irrelevant for the other.

Here are some red flags about Setien from his past and from his first week:
1. Aged 61 with barely any decent results. His career preBarca is worse than Valverde's career pre Barca
2. He has never managed a big team
3. He has never managed top players and egos
4. Since he hadn't coached a big team, he don't have an experience in rotations and keeping players fresh and motivated for 3 competitions
5. He has never managed such an old and physically drained team like ours, so with too intensive training regimes, there is a high chance that he will burry them to the ground by March and then there is no way back
6. He is a Cruijffista, but he seems to be "the original Cruijffista" from 1990-1994. Football played yesterday looked like a football from 90s, heavily relied on playing through the middle, no flanks, weird attacking patterns, no no9, zero crosses.
It should work against Granada (even though we struggled to score against 11 men).
But how it will work on any away match or even against Napoli? KO against Napoli is on cards now.
7. He hasn't played a single CL match in his life.
Other Cruijffistas with Cruijff's style have the worst numbers on away KO matches in our history, yet Cruijff and Pep coached Barca for several years (and they still sucked insanely on any away match).
So it is fair to ask: how will Cruijffista's style from 1992 cope in Europe in 2020, led by a coach with zero experience in Europe, how to physically prepare team for Europe and how attacking or cautiously to play on away KO matches
8. He was sacked by Betis and apparently their fans hated him in the last season due to a style with 1000s passes, lots of possession, horrible execution in attack and a bad end product (and a bad defense)

Obviously, yesterday he asked from players to play passes after one or two touches instead of letting players to dwelwe on a ball like during EV.
But as mentioned above, there are tons of red flags and questions about his abilities.

In terms of a result, this was the worst home match by Barca (except El Classico) in this season.

If you are happy and dreamy, fine.
Do we all need to have the same opinion and the same expectations?

For me, yesterday we have seen some improvements and some deadly red flags, especially chaotic attack and a style from 1992 with no wing play and everything going through the middle.

Lmao, this clown BBZ saw deadly red flags with one game under Setien while never mentioning 'red flags' in relation to his father, EV, despite this guy serving up 2 of the 5 biggest CL humiliations in Barca history in back to back years.

JohnN said:

People who disliked EV and were fed up with him, wanted our team to lose some games, so he can get sacked, expecting that to be in favour of the team. If they are right or wrong can be argued but the intention seems clear.
People who jump on Setien from day one, want the team to fail so they can be proven right. Not for the good of the team. Intentions seem clear here too.

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It works both ways.
What if people think that a 61 years old coach with zero results in his career and who seems to be playing football from 25 years ago isn't a person who will drive us forward?

Dembele was dead for me after 2 matches because he was dumb and you can't fix that.
If Setien will continue this no-flanks football, then lol, do I even need to comment?

Some people want to see triangles.
Other people don't care about triangles.
Some people want to see a modern football with 10 attacking options.
Other don't want to and they jerk off to 1000 passes through the middle.
Some people want a true No9.
Other people want 3 attackers who move a lot, change positions and don't have a fixed position.

You will never make everyone happy.

Some of people against Setien:
1. Are mad because EV is fired
2. Some are just contrarians
3. Some are genuinelly not impressed by his history or yesterday's match

If you enjoyed a match, fine.
If some others think that it was a same old shit only with a different color, fine.

Million people, million opinions and million different views and ideas.

lol @ bbz masquerading his BS opinions by saying it is just an opinion so it is subjective.

One can claim pele is better than messi and that would be an opinion and totally fine but if someone says balotelli is better than messi then technically that is an opinion also but it is obviously wrong and someone claiming that can be called out for.

What bbz says can't be defended by the "It's just an opinion" shit. When after ages we finally saw something fruitful from barca and you see red flags when you saw none after a shitshow for years and consecutive CL humilations then you are biased, dumb or both. Probably both.

BBZ8800 said:

It works both ways.
What if people think that a 61 years old coach with zero results in his career and who seems to be playing football from 25 years ago isn't a person who will drive us forward?

Dembele was dead for me after 2 matches because he was dumb and you can't fix that.
If Setien will continue this no-flanks football, then lol, do I even need to comment?

Some people want to see triangles.
Other people don't care about triangles.
Some people want to see a modern football with 10 attacking options.
Other don't want to and they jerk off to 1000 passes through the middle.
Some people want a true No9.
Other people want 3 attackers who move a lot, change positions and don't have a fixed position.

You will never make everyone happy.

Some of people against Setien:
1. Are mad because EV is fired
2. Some are just contrarians
3. Some are genuinelly not impressed by his history or yesterday's match

If you enjoyed a match, fine.
If some others think that it was a same old shit only with a different color, fine.

Million people, million opinions and million different views and ideas.

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The rational and honorable thing would be to give Setien a run of games, including the Napoli CL away game before starting to draw conclusions.

Notice I didn't post anything in Setien's thread singing his praises just yet. It's only one game.

But you're the clown who couldn't wait even 55 minutes into the game before spewing your bile in the thread. Btw, we scored and won once your worthless 'Raki' was taken out.

No problem with you having your opinion. It's your double standards/hypocrisy/cowardice that's the problem.

KingLeo10 said:

The rational and honorable thing would be to give Setien a run of games, including the Napoli CL away game before starting to draw conclusions.

Notice I didn't post anything in Setien's thread singing his praises just yet. It's only one game.

But you're the clown who couldn't wait even 55 minutes into the game before spewing your bile in the thread. Btw, we scored and won once your worthless 'Raki' was taken out.

No problem with you having your opinion. It's your double standards/hypocrisy/cowardice that's the problem.

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The red flags start to appear when we try to play the old way.

I mean not during the entire time during Valverde's reign did the red flags appear! clearly that means we should go back to playing football that makes relegation fodder look good instead.

LeeRomeno said:

Cannot really think of anything more annoying than "told you so" type of people. Especially considering the expectations people have for the future can be totally different.

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Consider this. You are on a Lada Niva going 150Kph (if it can even reach that) through heavy rain, a steep turn is ahead of you and you can clearly see it. If you slow down to avoid falling down the hill are you a prophet or a reasonable human being?
Your expectations may be whatever, but reality does not care about your expectations. EV was not good enough for this team and that was evident and demostrable.

LeeRomeno said:

As for team was going downhill for a long time, what loads of bull. We had won 5 previous games, then lost with benchers to Celta Vigo in nonrelevant game before the loss at Anfield and actually rested the starters as many wanted. We were well on course for 3 trophies in May.
This season has been been of course played at lower quality, but up until Anfield loss and doing the exact same mistake twice, there was no real reason to get rid of Valverde. Unless you understand that logic and that many people actually agree to that, it is not possible for you to understand why there are people who have negative comments towards Setien.

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Yes, we were top of the league, had a massive advantage in CL semi and at the final of the Copa.. Of course EV wasn't gonna or shouldn't have gotten fired until the Anfield game because results were coming and we were in all competitions. And no one advocated we lose in CL so he gets fired.
But the team was saved again and again and again by Messi and Mats. The overall play deteriorated massively throughout the season. Bad choices were made left and right as far as our starting 11 and tactics were concerned. So, the team was going downhill is a true statement. Except if someone only reads the game results.
In my opinion, he should have gotten fired the day after Anfield.

LeeRomeno said:

As for last point, have you been in future and know exactly that we would not be in even worse situation for summer with Setien? After all, everyone is being a prohpet here. Sooner you cut off the cancer, bigger the chances of surviving the disease right?

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I am saying, that advocating for the new manager, who was appointed in the middle of the season, just over a week ago, to fail, for the better of the team, is illogical.

LeeRomeno said:

Also, Barcelona is top quality team and 99% of coaches would love the opportunity to be at charge, no matter the circumstances.

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But they didn't line up to take the job now, did they? Reality hits us again, because it doesn't care about our beliefs. Even Xavi turned us down. That should be enough evidence that 99% of managers would certainly not love the opportunity to be in charge. Add to that, that 99% of managers are not better than Setien and it goes downhill really fast.

BBZ8800 said:

1. Aged 61 with barely any decent results. His career preBarca is worse than Valverde's career pre Barca

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Irrelevant with the game played.

BBZ8800 said:

2. He has never managed a big team

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Irrelevant with the game played and contradicting with supporting EV. EV never managed a big team before. neither did Pep . neither did Lucho. etc.

BBZ8800 said:

3. He has never managed top players and egos

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Same as above.

BBZ8800 said:

4. Since he hadn't coached a big team, he don't have an experience in rotations and keeping players fresh and motivated for 3 competitions

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Irrelevant with the game played. EV did a really bad job for 2 seasons on this departement. But you still supported him.

BBZ8800 said:

5. He has never managed such an old and physically drained team like ours, so with too intensive training regimes, there is a high chance that he will burry them to the ground by March and then there is no way back

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Irrelevant with the game played. The team has had bad physical preparation for ages. If they can't cope with a little bit of intensity, they shouldn't be here. Apart from that, purely speculative claims with no backing.

BBZ8800 said:

6. He is a Cruijffista, but he seems to be "the original Cruijffista" from 1990-1994. Football played yesterday looked like a football from 90s, heavily relied on playing through the middle, no flanks, weird attacking patterns, no no9, zero crosses.
It should work against Granada (even though we struggled to score against 11 men).
But how it will work on any away match or even against Napoli? KO against Napoli is on cards now.

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This is the first relative point to the last match.
What does "weird attacking patterns" even mean? We had 5-6 good combos on the final third. That is 5-6 more than we had since 2017.
" no no9, zero crosses": Suarez is injured so we didn't have a 9 and nobody to cross to. I don't feel we would cross anyway, but is this on the coach? really?

BBZ8800 said:

7. He hasn't played a single CL match in his life.
Other Cruijffistas with Cruijff's style have the worst numbers on away KO matches in our history, yet Cruijff and Pep coached Barca for several years (and they still sucked insanely on any away match).
So it is fair to ask: how will Cruijffista's style from 1992 cope in Europe in 2020, led by a coach with zero experience in Europe, how to physically prepare team for Europe and how attacking or cautiously to play on away KO matches

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Irrelevant with the game played but valid question. How will Setien's style work? Well, I hope better than our last two humiliations with EV's style. Still, speculative stuff.

BBZ8800 said:

8. He was sacked by Betis and apparently their fans hated him in the last season due to a style with 1000s passes, lots of possession, horrible execution in attack and a bad end product (and a bad defense)

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Irrelevant with the game played. Setien managed to get Betis 6th on La Liga. Their best position since 2004–05. They just dropped to 10th the next season, which is not bad at all by their standards.

BBZ8800 said:

In terms of a result, this was the worst home match by Barca (except El Classico) in this season.

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Slavia Prague says hi. Except that, only thing missing was many many goals. We created plenty of chances.

What I get out of all this is that you didn't have red flags because of the game but before it.
You may have different expectations and I get that, but condemning the new manager with the slightest bit of SUBJECTIVE problems you find in his first game while defending EV to fucking death until Anfield is mind bending.

Valverde was the most experienced coach we had hired in a long time.

More experienced than the likes of Lucho, Tata, Tito, Pep, Seiten, etc. But other than the two league titles in the Copa, he failed to evolve this team and we regressed quite a bit in a number of areas as well compared to the Pep and Lucho days.

Sometimes even having an experienced CV may not always be a good thing if the coach simply isn't a right fit.

KingLeo10 said:

The rational and honorable thing would be to give Setien a run of games, including the Napoli CL away game before starting to draw conclusions.

Notice I didn't post anything in Setien's thread singing his praises just yet. It's only one game.

But you're the clown who couldn't wait even 55 minutes into the game before spewing your bile in the thread. Btw, we scored and won once your worthless 'Raki' was taken out.

No problem with you having your opinion. It's your double standards/hypocrisy/cowardice that's the problem.

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You play the: I am objective game.

Yet, you are calling me a clown for mentioning negative things after 1 match.
Yet, you didn't call anyone a clown who were singing praises about Setien before a single minute played.
Why are you using double standards?

If you were objective, you should be as equslly as pissed by both premature overly positive and premature overly negative posts.
Yet, you are pissed only with premature negative posts.
Let's call Sherlock to help us to explain why are you acting like that, lol.

As always, cool story.

BBZ8800 said:

You play the: I am objective game.

Yet, you are calling me a clown for mentioning negative things after 1 match.
Yet, you didn't call anyone a clown who were singing praises about Setien before a single minute played.
Why are you using double standards?

As always, cool story.
I believe in your objective and non-biased views, as always.

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Because the others don't post 5,000 word essays with biased statistics and prejudiced numbers to 'support' their point.

It's not just me who views you like this.

It's practically the entire forum at this point.

I'm objective about Setien. I want 85 points in Liga and good performances in away CL games. If he doesn't deliver those, we move onto another coach. What I know for sure is that the players put a greater effort yesterday than they did under EV for a long, long time.