Quique Setien

ini4ever

ini4ever

Member
snowy said:
ayaiiiii not gonna lie, I would've benched him for that! Setien and Sarabia are zen monks for not losing their cool there :innocent:


Benching Messi here sends the smart message

Don't mess with Sheitan :evil:
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Setien looks clueless over there lol its like he's standing there and being afraid to talk to senior players.
p.s : I'm starting to dislike Messi as well whatever instructions Sarabia giving you, you shouldn't behave like that what the fuck.
 
Potroh

Potroh

New member
Luftstalag14 said:
Yes the main problem is the board but you kind of see a pattern here already with the senior players. They clearly don't respect Setien and his men and I don't care how right the senior players were in their disagreement with Setien, it was plain wrong for them to behave like they did, openly ridiculing and humiliating Sarabia and Setien. That was just not right.
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Each and every team has senior players.
If the team consists players around 20, then the remaining "old" 23 years old becomes the "senior".
There is always a sort of hierarchy in the locker room and you can't avoid that.

Nonetheless, as I have already mentioned that in this forum, football is NOT military service, it is a creative GAME, where the admirals do have the authority, but RESPECT is not part of it.
Respect needs to be earned and cannot be forced upon any player.
If Setien or Sarabia weren't able to earn that, it's their fault and problem, the players are human with strong egos and relati8vely childish considerations in the bag. Either the coach is able to handle that or he is not capable.

There is no worse football team than an artificially disciplined one, scared to express their true feelings...
 
serghei

serghei

Senior Member
Potroh said:
If Setien or Sarabia weren't able to earn that, it's their fault and problem, the players are human with strong egos and relati8vely childish considerations in the bag. Either the coach is able to handle that or he is not capable.

There is no worse football team than an artificially disciplined one, scared to express their true feelings...
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Only on the premise that the veterans are reasonable and put the team first. Which is a false premise imo. If the veterans mainly care about their comfort, which is the most likely case imo, then they can't be reasoned with.
 
P

Porque

Senior Member
Messi983 said:
From what I've read Pimienta would only replace Setien for the CL. At that time Barca B season will be over. Then he would return to Barca B. I don't believe he's seriously considered to be a first team coach next season at this point but things could obviously change if he would win the CL. And he would have to be a coaching genius or extremely lucky for that to happen with this team.

Anyway, I don't know how much sense another coaching change before the CL games would really make. Maybe we could create a "shock effect" that would last for four games but coaches can't change things over night with little time to prepare and implement their ideas and even less so without knowing the players. Even Pimienta who is already at the club has never worked with any of the current first team members except Puig. And well, he has worked his entire career inside the locker room full of kids willing to listen to him and not entitled, overpaid divas who don't give a s*** about what coaches are telling them. It's a pretty big difference between motivating young, hungry players and unmotivated veterans.
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I didn't read the details. In that case it is less of a problem. Imagine entering the last 16 of Europe's premier competition with our B team coach though. Someone with no senior professional management nor top level playing experience. Could be career ruining (or making).
 
serghei

serghei

Senior Member
This is not about respect. This is about the old guard not wanting to change their ways. They do not want to change how they play. They want to keep playing as they see fit, and for the manager to accept that like a puppet, and find ways to work with that.

They will have next season with a puppet manager to convince us they can still dominate. If not, they have to be replaced. And whoever doesn't like it can go too no matter the status.

Porque said:
I didn't read the details. In that case it is less of a problem. Imagine entering the last 16 of Europe's premier competition with our B team coach though. Someone with no senior professional management nor top level playing experience. Could be career ruining (or making).
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The coach will be the veterans. Pimienta won't do anything in regards to how the team plays that is not approved by Messi, Suarez, Pique etc.
 
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vinni

vinni

Member
snowy said:
ayaiiiii not gonna lie, I would've benched him for that! Setien and Sarabia are zen monks for not losing their cool there :innocent:


Benching Messi here sends the smart message

Don't mess with Sheitan :evil:
Click to expand...

Sadly i don't know spanish. Can any anyone give a quik summary of what they are saying? Just looking at the photos, this can be a big deal or nothing big at all.
 
Alik

Alik

Moderator
serghei said:
Only on the premise that the veterans are reasonable and put the team first. Which is a false premise imo. If the veterans mainly care about their comfort, which is the most likely case imo, then they can't be reasoned with.
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The veterans care about winning and need to be convinced that the coach's methods will lead to that.

I think it's too simple to assume that the veterans enjoy losing while being comfortable.
 
serghei

serghei

Senior Member
Alik said:
The veterans care about winning and need to be convinced that the coach's methods will lead to that.

I think it's too simple to assume that the veterans enjoy losing while being comfortable.
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It's impossible for them to be convinced if they refuse to comply with what is asked of them. They do not want to work harder, because they are old, their hunger is gone, and they just want to relax at the end of their careers. Ideally, they want the younger players to do the running for them, but that doesn't work.

They care about winning, just not as much as to give up their old ways.

Messi likes to vacate his position purely at will. He doesn't want to pass to Griezmann much, and he loves passing to Suarez. Suarez the same, doesn't fancy Griezmann much, and has eyes only for Messi. Even Vidal figured out that the way to fit in the offense is to pass to Messi and Suarez and often ignore better runs.

These are things which are toxic for the team. Ignoring better-placed teammates to feed balls to your older pal is just unacceptable at any top club.
 
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jairzinho

jairzinho

Senior Member
Alik said:
The veterans care about winning and need to be convinced that the coach's methods will lead to that.

I think it's too simple to assume that the veterans enjoy losing while being comfortable.
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If there's one thing Anfield taught us is that the veterans are DONE. They simply can't cut it at that level anymore.

I thought the Liverpool game humbled them but it seems some of them are more arrogant than ever.

They can't be reasoned with and openly scoff at instructions.

That clip with Setien, you can clearly see he's a broken man, not sure how to get across to the players.
 
Andrew M

Andrew M

New member
jairzinho said:
If there's one thing Anfield taught us is that the veterans are DONE. They simply can't cut it at that level anymore.

I thought the Liverpool game humbled them but it seems some of them are more arrogant than ever.

They can't be reasoned with and openly scoff at instructions.

That clip with Setien, you can clearly see he's a broken man, not sure how to get across to the players.
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Why can't Setien speak to the players directly instead of using his sidekick?
 
The Observer

The Observer

New member
Umtiti post knee injuries is a train wreck yet Setien is trying to force him into the lineup in important games because he is a better ballplaying defender than Lenglet. Completely clowned for both Celta goals.

These Cruyff boy coaches with no own ideas are the worst.
 
Potroh

Potroh

New member
Alik said:
The veterans care about winning and need to be convinced that the coach's methods will lead to that.
I think it's too simple to assume that the veterans enjoy losing while being comfortable.
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Absolutely true!
Regardless their ages they are success-oriented, thus they almost always respect, admire and follow a coach coming up by winning ideas.
 
Potroh

Potroh

New member
serghei said:
Messi likes to vacate his position purely at will. He doesn't want to pass to Griezmann much, and he loves passing to Suarez. Suarez the same, doesn't fancy Griezmann much, and has eyes only for Messi. Even Vidal figured out that the way to fit in the offense is to pass to Messi and Suarez and often ignore better runs.

These are things which are toxic for the team. Ignoring better-placed teammates to feed balls to your older pal is just unacceptable at any top club.
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"Toxic" is a very heavy word and absolutely inappropriate in the context.
If you are angry for the lack of performances, it doesn't necessarily implies that something is "toxic", maybe counterproductive or undesired.

Furthermore:
Everybody who played a bit of football in his life knows that there are many quick situations, when the player has no idea where X, Y or Z other player is, all he sees and notices is the color of the shirt.
Thus passing in an offensive phase to X or Y is usually instinctive.
Either he looks up - and by that wastes some valuable time - and purposely passes to the given player, or he passes to the practiced position of an other player, or he faintly notices a shirt color while moving or running, without actually knowing who that teammate is.
Mind that please, watching a game on TV is not at all what a player experiences on the pitch.
 
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