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Thread: LaLiga proposes that the 26th-October Classic pass to the Bernabéu

  1. #46
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    Vilarrubi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfe View Post
    Money is a completely moot point. It's not a factor if signings are misused tactically.

    Isco has played 33% of total minutes he was available for last season. He played sod-all this season, essentially an equivalent of Rakitić at this point, but with a longer contract. He's 90% finished here and I suspect this last night was basically Zidane saying "OK, you're out tonight, it's your chance to prove you can be a valuable CM in a team that doesn't really play AMs". Which backfired.
    Jović as the lopsided RW is idiotic. Benzema as inside forward would have made far more sense instead of whatever Zidane tried last night.
    Odriozola is rather weak and leaving Carvajal out has been questioned with him being fit during the international break. But that is also on the manager.
    Militao had a poor first half, picked up in the 2nd. Right now he's almost always playing like his mates are. Also, him costing 50M is not a 'big money' signing for a young CB on the market.

    And no, you shouldn't judge by last game. We played 2 CFs, 2 AMs and 1 19-year old winger who isn't a starter, everyone basically out of position with James playing the best of them all as he proved he can. This is not 'form', this was a managerial blunder.

    Also lol - 'we'll win' vs 'we'd have destroyed them'. Yeah, not fooling anyone.
    We’ll have to agree to disagree then, I don’t think you can ignore it as form having Benzema, Casemiro, Marcelo, Ramos, Courtois, Vinicius, Jovic, Isco, Militao and Odriozola on the pitch at the same time, regardless of tactics.

    Based on what I’ve seen of Madrid so far I’ve thought we’d beat you comfortably in the Clasico for a while,, whether I said we’ll win, destroy you etc doesnt matter.
    #ValverdeOUT

  2. #47
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    @devo901
    Indeed, it doesn't. And it's likely to continue. I only take issue with talking about form after a game like this, where it wasn't the players' lack of form that was the issue.

    @Vilarrubi
    Tactics don't matter... Yeah, sure.

    Lol, sure you did. Just to clarify, as comfortably as in February? How 'comfortably' are we talking here?
    Last edited by Wolfe; 20th October 2019 at 12:50 PM.
    People are boring.

  3. #48
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    Wolfe it might be better to take out your frustrations elsewhere rather than debating what the word form means.

  4. #49
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    Hey, he started it. By being wrong.
    People are boring.

  5. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfe View Post

    @Vilarrubi
    Tactics don't matter... Yeah, sure.

    Lol, sure you did. Just to clarify, as comfortably as in February? How 'comfortably' are we talking here?
    Thought we’d win by at least 3 goals.

    So if you had your starting 11 playing a few games in a row but for one game Zidane decided to play a different formation with a few players out of position we have to disregard that game too? Your logic is all over the place.

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    I just looked it up, many were insured (for the match yesterday) that is crazy.....

    Asensio M.(Knee Injury)
    Bale G.(Calf Injury)
    Carvajal D.(Rest)
    Kroos T.(Groin Injury)
    Lucas(Leg Injury)
    Modric L.(Thigh Injury)
    Nacho (Knee)

    many were insured and just made a comback... Casimiro, Marcelo, Isco,
    No suprise there is no "harmony".
    @Wolfe; Who in the real team do you consider being in an "OK-ish" form right now?
    If you observe something that does not make sense, remember: it's all about the dough!

  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vilarrubi View Post
    Thought we’d win by at least 3 goals.

    So if you had your starting 11 playing a few games in a row but for one game Zidane decided to play a different formation with a few players out of position we have to disregard that game too? Your logic is all over the place.
    One game with a different formation? No.
    Players out of position? Probably. You're telling me you're investigating team form when De Jong is playing LM and you play Perez and Fati on the wings and Semedo at LB?

    @devo901
    To be precise...


    James, Benzema, Bale, Mendy, Valverde and Casemiro are by some margin the best relatively consistent performers. Followed by Kroos, Carvajal (our top assistant, missing yesterday unexplicably), Ramos, Militao and maybe Nacho+Varane if you were to push it - all had good stretches of games punctured by horrendous mistakes. Then you have the crowd who are either very patchy, off-form, unfit or misused i.e. Vazquez, Hazard, Jović, Vinicius, Odriozola, Isco. The last lot, for whatever reason, should not be starting unless for a specific scenario. And many times recently we were forced to play them to keep some shape. Now Zidane made a big mistake of playing a non-system and introducing all 4 of the latter in between some of the group 2 and group 1 players.
    People are boring.

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    Lovely seeing @Wolfe get so riled up. About time RM were absolute shit so he could deviate his energy from trolling Barca to wallowing about the definition of 'form'.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfe View Post
    One game with a different formation? No.
    Players out of position? Probably. You're telling me you're investigating team form when De Jong is playing LM and you play Perez and Fati on the wings and Semedo at LB?

    @devo901
    To be precise...


    James, Benzema, Bale, Mendy, Valverde and Casemiro are by some margin the best relatively consistent performers. Followed by Kroos, Carvajal (our top assistant, missing yesterday unexplicably), Ramos, Militao and maybe Nacho+Varane if you were to push it - all had good stretches of games punctured by horrendous mistakes. Then you have the crowd who are either very patchy, off-form, unfit or misused i.e. Vazquez, Hazard, Jović, Vinicius, Odriozola, Isco. The last lot, for whatever reason, should not be starting unless for a specific scenario. And many times recently we were forced to play them to keep some shape. Now Zidane made a big mistake of playing a non-system and introducing all 4 of the latter in between some of the group 2 and group 1 players.

    This is why I tend to take Madrid fans opinions with a pinch of salt. You spent 380m ( the madrid press continually try to make it seem less) in the summer viejo, and now your moaning about injuries. Two of the best performing players anywhere are yours but you decided to loan them out (Odegaard and Hakimi)

    Anyway I'm glad the Classico was cancelled regardless. There are few things more important than a Classico but the situation in Catalunya is one of them. Glad the cancellation has raised the issue of an oppressed minority in Spain. Hoping the Basques will be next.

  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfe View Post
    One game with a different formation? No.
    Players out of position? Probably. You're telling me you're investigating team form when De Jong is playing LM and you play Perez and Fati on the wings and Semedo at LB?
    At the start of the season even when we were playing those players and without Messi, yes I’d say we were in bad form.
    We’re a team at the end of the day with a full squad which has to be used in all situations. Saying Barca were in bad form at the start of the season is a completely true statement, regardless of players/formations.
    #ValverdeOUT

  11. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vilarrubi View Post
    Saying Barca were in bad form at the start of the season is a completely true statement, regardless of players/formations.
    Isnt it, that one (form) is a result of the other (players)?

    Keyplayers are insured -> rest feels insecure -> nothing works -> bad results -> toxic team spirit -> blaming -> even more bad results -> ppl are not motivated to train / run -> team appears out of form

    missing players
    game 1 Messi ... loss
    game 2 Suarez, messi, dembele ... win
    game 3 dembele, messi, suarez, ... draw
    game 4 dembele, messi, umtiti, ... win
    game 5 umtiti, alba, dembele (messi coming from bench) ... loss
    game 6 umtit, alba, ... win


    it reminds me when mo was asked - what do you need for winning a game and he said: "good players, thats all". captain obvious : who would have thought...

    now, I am not saying this limited data points proves me with my chain above, but at least it is not paniting a contrasting picture.....

    So this leads me to the conclusion - yes, we looked bad because key players were missing and new players felt not familiar and thus acted less effective (Griez, although he ran like a husky). And then we were all over the place and EV is not the guy that is able to fix that. And then dark clouds populate the insecured minds of players and we look even more out of form.
    Last edited by devo901; 20th October 2019 at 03:37 PM.
    If you observe something that does not make sense, remember: it's all about the dough!

  12. #57
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    So, have they picked a date yet or no?

  13. #58
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    Clubs settled for 18th and communicated this to La Liga and the Federation, but Tebas is appealing it and wants it moved to the 4th. They kind of made good points, but no final decision made yet I think.
    People are boring.

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    Thanks @Wolfe.

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    20:00 CEST confirmed