Erling Braut Haaland

I'd argue Neyboy is doing quite well for himself despite the mistakes. If they reach at least one CL final in his time in Paris and do not embarrass themselves there, it's a good career move after all. Doing it 'on your own' as opposed to as part of a legendary trio is much better for your legacy aka mini-LeBron post-Miami.

Riordon said:

BBZ was a Barca fan way before Pep, take that into consideration. The way he wants us to play is really not much different to how Rijkaard and to some extend Cruyff played. Even pep 08/09 goes well with BBZ football

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Thanks.
When I was a teen, we were an absolute shit in Europe.
And I had to wait 14 years for us to even play in a CL final (in 2006).
So, after 14 years of being naive, Rijkaard brought more balance, physique and logic into our game (paired with Barca's DNA, of course) and we started to rule the world again.

For Serghei, this was a key match in our history, 1/8 in 2006.
A season before that, we were playing the best football in Europe, but we lost to Mou's Chelsea in a naive way.
For the first time in 10 years, Barca played more cautious and result-oriented on away matches.

Look at our lineup from that match:
Motta 187 cm
Oleguer 187
Edmilson 186
Marquez 184
Etoo 181
Ronaldinho 180
Puyol 178
Van Bronckhorst 178
-----------------------
Deco 174
Messi 170

We had only 2 short players on a field.

So, yes, if you started to watch Barca during Pep, like majority of guys here, then my ideas look like out of this world.
While in reality, majority of my ideas are coming from Barca during Rijkaard and Ac Milan from 90s, where Rijkaard was a key member and they were the best team of that decade.

Since there are no matches currently, enjoy this clip for 10 minutes.
Barca with tall players, Barca playing more cautious, Barca playing a strong defense, Barca not being weak on headers, Barca using crosses, longballs and headers in the attack.
And Barca's midfield consisted of Thiago Motta and Jose Edmilson, lol.

Enjoy our road to the first CL after 14 years of waiting:

** Btw, when we played that way, on 3 away matches, we conceded only 1 goal:
Chelsea 1:2
Benfica 0:0
Milan 0:1

The only goal conceded was an own goal from Motta vs Chelsea.

Did we EVER in our history had a better record on away matches in a CL?
And paradoxically, our best away record came when we moved away from too naive (too attacking, too light) Barca's style.

Who would say?

BBZ8800 said:

Thanks.
When I was a teen, we were an absolute shit in Europe.
And I had to wait 14 years for us to even play in a CL final (in 2006).
So, after 14 years of being naive, Rijkaard brought more balance, physique and logic into our game (paired with Barca's DNA, of course) and we started to rule the world again.

For Serghei, this was a key match in our history, 1/8 in 2006.
A season before that, we were playing the best football in Europe, but we lost to Mou's Chelsea in a naive way.
For the first time in 10 years, Barca played more cautious and result-oriented on away matches.

Look at our lineup from that match:
Motta 187 cm
Oleguer 187
Edmilson 186
Marquez 184
Etoo 181
Ronaldinho 180
Puyol 178
Van Bronckhorst 178
-----------------------
Deco 174
Messi 170

We had only 2 short players on a field.

So, yes, if you started to watch Barca during Pep, like majority of guys here, then my ideas look like out of this world.
While in reality, majority of my ideas are coming from Barca during Rijkaard and Ac Milan from 90s, where Rijkaard was a key member and they were the best team of that decade.

Since there are no matches currently, enjoy this clip for 10 minutes.
Barca with tall players, Barca playing more cautious, Barca playing a strong defense, Barca not being weak on headers, Barca using crosses, longballs and headers in the attack.
And Barca's midfield consisted of Thiago Motta and Jose Edmilson, lol.

Enjoy our road to the first CL after 14 years of waiting:

** Btw, when we played that way, on 3 away matches, we conceded only 1 goal:
Chelsea 1:2
Benfica 0:0
Milan 0:1

The only goal conceded was an own goal from Motta vs Chelsea.

Did we EVER in our history had a better record on away matches in a CL?
And paradoxically, our best away record came when we moved away from too naive (too attacking, too light) Barca's style.

Who would say?

Click to expand...

I think this is pretty common knowledge for Barca fans. We have been awful away for a long time. Our team just can't handle any sort of pressure and we can't play defense. The team you mentioned could absord pressure which is very important in away games.

FinBarcelonafan said:

I think this is pretty common knowledge for Barca fans. We have been awful away for a long time. Our team just can't handle any sort of pressure and we can't play defense. The team you mentioned could absord pressure which is very important in away games.

Click to expand...

But check the pattern:
Pep had something like 20% of wins on away KO matches.
Cruijff something like 16-18%.
Rijkaard 50%.

Pep's City continues to be an ultimate shit on away matches, conceding 3-4-5 against anyone in Europe.
What are the similarities?
= Pep's and Cruijff's too attacking style is usually suicidal in Europe.
It works perfect in league competitions over 38 matches where the opponents are usually weaker than you.
Pep's style is by far the best style for terrorizing Getafe, Girona, Las Palmas and other lowtable teams.

In Europe, though, that style worked ONLY when we had the best generation ever.
Both Rijkaard in 2006 and Lucho in 2015 actually won a CL when we MOVED AWAY from our style.
Rijkaard played like AC Milan: strong defense, more physical players, but we still had a touch of magic upfront.
We didn't concede goals, yet we always found a way to score 1-2.
So, we didn't play to score MORE than opponents, but more like: to concede less than the opponent.

Lucho in 2015 totally abandoned possession and our midfield.
Our game was similar to Rijkaard's in a lot of areas: strong defense, we weren't leaking goals.
Yet, we had magic in attack and we always managed to score.

How I see Pep, his matches in Europe always tend to end 4:0, 0:4 or 4:4.
He is asking for goals, but he is also asking for problems at the back.
Rijkaard wasn't asking for problems in defense.
Lucho wasn't asking for problems in defense.
Real Madrid who won 4 out of 5 didn't ask for problems in defense.
France in 2018 or Portugal in 2016.
In fact, you can find a lot of similarities in all these teams mentioned above.

Since Pep in 2011 and Spain in 2012, in the last 8 years in a CL and on World cup/Euros, all winners were quite similar and everyone were more direct oriented and with a cautious defense.
People will always reply: but but but, we won during Pep.
Yes, we won when we had prime Messi, Xavi, Iniesta, Busi, Alves.

As lots of other users mentioned over years, it seems that with our style or to be more accurate, with Pep's style=you can win ONLY if everything is perfect.
If your team is not perfect, it is almost impossible to win in Europe with that style.
Someone will reply: but but but, EV played your way and we still lost.

Let's say it that way:
Pep's style without prime Messi-Xavi-Iniesta=chances for a CL win 5%
Rijkaard's%Lucho's style without prime Messi-Xavi-Iniesta=20%

Wolfe said:

I'd argue Neyboy is doing quite well for himself despite the mistakes. If they reach at least one CL final in his time in Paris and do not embarrass themselves there, it's a good career move after all. Doing it 'on your own' as opposed to as part of a legendary trio is much better for your legacy aka mini-LeBron post-Miami.

Click to expand...

Not even Neymar believes that rubbish lol

BBZ, you're ideas are way more extreme than that Rijkaard side. I love it how you leave out that the most important midfielders in that team were Xavi and Deco. 1.70m and 1.74m.

You overstate the importance of physicality in that team over technique.

That team was the best team in the world on a technical level. You make it sound as if they were some strong dudes who could barely pass the ball.

Yes, we had Motta and Edmilson. But we also had Ballon d'Or Ronaldinho, one of the most talented players of all time, lightning fast Messi who was unplayable that night, and Eto'o, the best striker of his generation.

Messi - 10/10 technique
Eto - 9.5/10 technique
Ronaldinho - 10/10 technique
Deco - 9.5/10 technique
Xavi - 10/10 technique

The key components of that team, from defense up, is formed by not very tall players who are elite in terms of technique, passing, dribbling.

There are 2-3 positions where you actually need to have strong players most of the time, as in athletic abilities are absolutely key for their role. DM and CBs. And even in those positions there are very notable exceptions.

For wings you need shorter and fast players, with low center of gravity usually, both as wingers and as fullbacks.

Wolfe said:

I'd argue Neyboy is doing quite well for himself despite the mistakes. If they reach at least one CL final in his time in Paris and do not embarrass themselves there, it's a good career move after all. Doing it 'on your own' as opposed to as part of a legendary trio is much better for your legacy aka mini-LeBron post-Miami.

Click to expand...

Naahh...history aint that kind. People will just look up how many times PSG won it since Neys arrival. If the number shows zero thats it, most people will draw their conclusions from there.

serghei said:

BBZ, you're ideas are way more extreme than that Rijkaard side. I love it how you leave out that the most important midfielders in that team were Xavi and Deco. 1.70m and 1.74m.

You overstate the importance of physicality in that team over technique.

That team was the best team in the world on a technical level. You make it sound as if they were some strong dudes who could barely pass the ball.

Yes, we had Motta and Edmilson. But we also had Ballon d'Or Ronaldinho, one of the most talented players of all time, lightning fast Messi who was unplayable that night, and Eto'o, the best striker of his generation.

Messi - 10/10 technique
Eto - 9.5/10 technique
Ronaldinho - 10/10 technique
Deco - 9.5/10 technique
Xavi - 10/10 technique

The key components of that team, from defense up, is formed by not very tall players who are elite in terms of technique, passing, dribbling.

There are 2-3 positions where you actually need to have strong and tall players most of the time, as in Athletic abilities are absolutely key for their position. DM and CBs.

For wings you need shorter and fast players, with low center of gravity usually, both as wingers and as fullbacks.

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Also, the proof is in the pitch (Stamford Bridge) v Chelsea 2006.

Look at the absolute state of it. If Mourinho didn't fear our technical prowess, he wouldn't have dished out a potato farm field.

Its either/or for BBZ. No inbetween. I dont think anyone here ever suggested that we should (forcibly) go back to Peps style. Generally speaking it helps to have the best players, and adapt our system to them. Our philosophy is just a vague guide (which can be helpful).

I personally hope that our blue print for the future is Frenkies Ajax (with more individual quality). Great players make great systems/teams.

KingLeo10 said:

Also, the proof is in the pitch (Stamford Bridge) v Chelsea 2006.

Look at the absolute state of it. If Mourinho didn't fear our technical prowess, he wouldn't have dished out a potato farm field.

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Exactly. Just because we were not as bad as now physically doesn't mean physicality was what that team was known and feared for. We were a premiere technical side who could cut you open with passes and dribbles everywhere.

Xavi did miss most of that run because of injury tbh.

serghei said:

BBZ, you're ideas are way more extreme than that Rijkaard side. I love it how you leave out that the most important midfielders in that team were Xavi and Deco. 1.70m and 1.74m.

Click to expand...

Xavi was injured and it was good to the team since MVB fit that team better (selling him cost us Liga next year) and while Deco was short he was a very strong player.

Okay let agree it is needed combination of speed strenght and technique.

We have lack of speed , motivation, coach ideas and few quality players

Why is physique only talked about in terms of height and strength?
Isnt acceleration, speed and balance also part of the equation?

Haaland with a header, doesnt happen so often, despite his height.