Page 6 of 6 FirstFirst ... 456
Results 76 to 85 of 85

Thread: FC Barcelona tactics under Ernesto Valverde - matches analysis with pics

  1. #76
    Senior Member
    Leo_Messi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    Italo-Spaniard in exile.
    Posts
    2,878
    Not sure where to post this post as it has little to do with Malmierda's actual "tactics" but more about tactics in general and what I would like to see be implemented tactically at least a couple of times this season.

    Just a quick thought.

    -----------MaTS-----------
    Semedo---Piqué---Todibo
    ------FDJ--------Arthur----
    Pérez---------------------Alba/Firpo
    -----------Messi----------
    ----------------Griezmann----
    -----------Suárez-----------

    Pérez and Alba/Firpo to ensure width on both flanks of the pitch. Pérez' defensive work rate is very underrated and he has the necessary pace as well as the lungs to stretch the pitch constantly, open up passing lanes for his teammates and to make runs behind the defense. Much like Alba and Firpo on the other flank.

    Todibo and Semedo would ensure a very pacy back three, unlike the current extremely slow Piqué-Lenglet CB partnership, that would be moreover covered by Pérez and Alba when needed with the midfield bulwark of FDJ and Arthur in front of them.

    Messi would have the ideal role for him in such a formation while Griezmann would not have to be wasted on the "wing" and likewise play in his preferred position as a second striker right behind Suárez. A Suárez that would be much less involved in terms of creation, preferred option in his current state, playing behind creative masterminds like Messi and Griezmann.

    The formation leaves out the likes of Dembélé and Fati (perfect impact subs against tired defenses) but the formation allows tactical flexibility with just 1 substitution. Pérez' position could be replaced by Roberto (if instructed to play as a very offensive wing-back) or Dembélé depending on the opposition.

    Of course Malmierda is never going to even consider such an unorthodox formation but it could be a solution at times (depending on the respective opponent's weaknesses and strengths) if the intention is not to be wasting Griezmann by playing him out of position while at the same time not leaving Suárez out of the starting 11 and ensuring that there will be width in the team on both flanks.

    Leaving Busquets (a shadow of his former self), Rakitic (virtually discarded by Malmierda and the board) and Vidal out is not the greatest sin in the world given their respective current levels and advanced age. In any case, if greater midfield control is needed, Pérez can be replaced by either of the 3, with the formation automatically turning into a 4-3-1-2 or last nights pseudo "4-3-3" formation.

    Most importantly the team would have tons of PACE and MOVEMENT using that formation. Piqué's lack of pace (in his current version) would be covered very well in that formation and so would Messi's and Suárez' lack of pace and pressing as long as Pérez and Alba/Firpo would do what they are best at, likewise the FDJ and Arthur duo and Griezmann being the old Atlético de Madrid Griezmann that works his ass off and compensates for the lack of pressing and off the ball movement of Messi and Suárez.

    Worth a try at least and I would not be the least surprised if it worked very well in practice. However we would need a manager a "bit" more advantageous, brave and innovative than the sorry excuse of a manager that Malmierda is, for such a formation to be implemented let alone tried. For some "club de amigos" clan members (mostly the midfield members) to admit defeat too.

    EDIT: Imagine having the option of Bernardo Silva (the same guy that I openly wanted us to buy back in 2017, rather than the fraud Coutinho) in Pérez' position. Would be ideal.
    Last edited by Leo_Messi; 3rd October 2019 at 07:59 PM.
    Bartomeu Dimissió!

  2. #77
    Senior Member
    Leo_Messi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    Italo-Spaniard in exile.
    Posts
    2,878
    Moving the debate over to this thread as the discussion has less to do with Griezmann than our overall tactics as a whole.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ernesto GOATverde Tejedor View Post
    I have been advocating a 3 5 2 with Semedo as a RCB since pre-season. Not only does it cover many of our flaws that get exposed in the 4 3 3 but it allows for greater flexibility.

    For example above , I would personally play Dembele as the RWB in home games and Bob or even Wague in away games. Imagine Dembele as the main outlet To use his pace for transition from defense into attack. To see out tight games sub off Griez and put on Vidal and get him to sit above the 2 CMs or even next to them if under too much pressure.

    352 is the only formation where every player gets to play in his best position. Personally, we have no chance of the CL with any other formation

    The exact formation is not really the key but more about alleviating and covering the team's main weaknesses while emphasizing it's strengths and the individual talent of each player or more precisely our best players. For starters, I believe that it is criminal to invest €120 million on a world class player like Griezmann for him to be wasted in the current useless (largely) setup or worse for him to warm the bench.

    You could call my formation for a 3-2-2-1-1-1 or 3-2-2-1-2 formation as well. The formation should not be set in stone but rather emphasize a more fluid, pace and movement-based football while trying to fit our 3 best (individually) offensive players in Messi, Suárez and Griezmann, our 2 by far best midfielders in Arthur and FDJ as well as retaining the width of the team and Semedo's and Alba's pace.

    Pérez could be replaced by Dembélé, me being one of the few users here on Barçaforum that has not yet given up on him completely, but I don't think that the current version of Dembélé is disciplined (offensively or defensively) or hard-working enough to do what a humble canterano like Pérez could do in that position. Pérez might not be the greatest individual talent but it is hard not to admire his work rate, pace, La Masia upbringing, grinta and humbleness. I really believe that he would excel in a formation like that where he would not have the burden of being the sole creative outlet on the right flank with Semedo's rather unimpressive offensive abilities but much greater defensive contribution in fairness. Pérez would also happily cover for Messi defensively in such a position. Much like Rakitic did in the 2014-15 season. Pérez being a much more dynamic player who can easily beat his man one on one but lacking in other departments compared to a prime Rakitic. However as I wrote, Dembélé could be used in that role depending on the strength and weaknesses of the opponent. Likewise Roberto if you want a more conservative approach. Malmierda and all.

    Agree with the rest and I have been saying the same thing ever since I saw a sharp decline in Busquets's and Rakitic performances in the 2016-17 season as well as Messi and Suárez becoming defensive liabilities when not in possession.
    Last edited by Leo_Messi; 3rd October 2019 at 09:44 PM.
    Bartomeu Dimissió!

  3. #78
    Senior Member
    serghei's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Forum de Amigos - Tactical Ops. Office
    Posts
    21,906
    A prolonged build-up from the Levante game analyzed on video for who cares about these things. It shows and explains the many defficiencies we have, especially in the tactical areas (mainly positioning, strategy in build-up and preferred playing patterns), but also on how we use the wrong players for wrong roles. And also how easy it is for even a mediocre team like Levante to block us.

    https://drive.google.com/file/d/14km...ew?usp=sharing
    Last edited by serghei; 3rd November 2019 at 04:30 PM.

  4. #79
    Senior Member
    Gaudi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    1,512
    Quote Originally Posted by serghei View Post
    A prolonged build-up from the Levante game analyzed on video for who cares about these things. It shows and explains the many defficiencies we have, especially in the tactical areas (mainly positioning, strategy in build-up and preferred playing patterns), but also on how we use the wrong players for wrong roles. And also how easy it is for even a mediocre team like Levante to block us.

    https://drive.google.com/file/d/14km...ew?usp=sharing
    Simple, even a simpleton can read Barca this days, we avoid the middle, try to progress through the flanks but we don't cross as this is not our thing, neither we attack the box...we just...pass the ball back and repeat. Nobody even closes our wings that much anymore

  5. #80
    Junior Member
    The Unsackable's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2019
    Posts
    74
    My grand Strategy is simple: "Pass the ball... untill the opponent passess out so we can score."

    The Board told me the day they hired me: "In Bilbao & Olympiacos you played certain style of football we dislike. We want players to pass the ball a lot. Just do that and all will be fine."

    As long as we keep on passing the ball around, I'm safe.

    "Passing is above wining" - the Board
    There is no humiliating defeat that can have me fired!

  6. #81
    Senior Member
    Vilarrubi's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    6,294
    Came across this today, quick analysis of 2011 CL Final. Rio himself said that at all times we outnumbered United players all over the pitch whatever area the ball was in. Seems like the complete opposite to what we do now like Serghei showed in his video, now the opponent seems to outnumber us, leaving no options for passes.


  7. #82
    Senior Member
    LABarcaFan's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Posts
    835
    Quote Originally Posted by Gaudi View Post
    Simple, even a simpleton can read Barca this days, we avoid the middle, try to progress through the flanks but we don't cross as this is not our thing, neither we attack the box...we just...pass the ball back and repeat. Nobody even closes our wings that much anymore

    Very good point.
    To close our wings, including J.Alba, we need to have very athletic and fast central midfielders to cover immediately their backs. Perfect example for it is Liverpool and Klopp's system. When T.Alexander and A.Robertson are involved in the attack, their midfielders (Fabinho, Vijnaldum, Henderson and Milner) are covering their zones to prevent eventual counter-attack. Barcelona does not have this kind of players. One Franki de Jong is not enough to cover for everyone. Instead of paying hundreds of millions for useless wingers like Dembele and Griezmann, we should look to solidify first our midfield, then looking for faster and younger wingers and of course, for a proven central forward.
    This is not about system. This is about finding the right pieces for your team. Barcelona is struggling in that department very badly.

  8. #83
    Senior Member
    LABarcaFan's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Posts
    835
    Quote Originally Posted by JohnN View Post
    We cannot win la Liga and Copa del ray with this squad? If we were against a top class Real and Athletico Madrid then ok. But it's not the case.
    Also, our squad is better than last year with Griezmann, FDJ and Firpo in addition to Arthur getting better and Fati breaking out. Also, Rakitic not playing makes the squad even better .
    Only Messi's injuries are a bad sign, but he has been injured for a long time in the past too. We will see in what kind of form he will be after all this time.
    I don't get why we cruised to the league title last year, but can't win it this year with a better squad.
    Yes. I can answer your question. We have better squad ONLY ON PAPER.

    J.Firpo is nailed to the bench in favor of 31 y.o. Alba and will see playing time only, when Jordi is injured.

    F. de Jong was a lot better player in Ajax, because he has freedom to operate in the mid-field and often was creating situation for goal. In Barca, he is used as a defensive midfield,same as Arthur. The reason for that is one. Busy and Rakitic are not playing even close to their last years performances. The experiments with Sergio Roberto did not bring back any positive results. So, our midfield zone is weaker than last year. We brought in Arturo Vidal as a play-maker, but his age is not allowing him to operate effectively in that zone.

    Last year, Luis Suarez has scored what? ...25 goals if I am not mistaken. This season, his playing is harmful for the team. And the board did not look for the right person as his replacement.
    Dembele is always injured, same as at this moment and is very ineffective. Griezmann is the biggest disappointment for Barca in the last decade. We brought him in to be our new top scorer and to replace Luis Suarez. He failed to do it and still can not find his place in our attack.
    To add to all of this the weakest defensive line we have will give you the answer, why we are a worst team than last two seasons.

    At the moment of this post, we share the first place with Real and just a point ahead of Sevilla. Do you remember how many points we were ahead of them last year, after 14 games?
    This years Barca team is not the same as last year and a year before. Our main players Pique, Busqets, Alba, Messi, Vidal and Suarez are all 31. The youngster we brought, beside FDJ are not performing at the level we need and expected. So, logically, we are playing worst than last year. The embarrassing losses this season are the best prove.

  9. #84
    Senior Member
    JerseyAddict's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Posts
    4,414
    I hope this thread can somehow get some "conclusion" post about how all this EV "tactics" stuff influenced this team and what needs to be done to "compensate" that "damage".
    Andres DON Iniesta is the only player in football's history to be Man of the Match in a Champions League final, EURO final and World Cup final.

  10. #85
    Senior Member
    JohnN's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Greece
    Posts
    1,152
    Quote Originally Posted by JerseyAddict View Post
    I hope this thread can somehow get some "conclusion" post about how all this EV "tactics" stuff influenced this team and what needs to be done to "compensate" that "damage".
    I can sum up.

    Tactics under EV were shit.