Lionel Messi - v7

BBZ8800

BBZ8800

Senior Member
KingLeo10 said:
One interesting observation about the modern greats. They've put up more more amazing (statistically) and more frequent amazing performances than the greats of the past but they've also mostly done this when things are in their favor.

Messi, Xavi, Iniesta had each other. All 3 had Pep.
CR7 had top coaches in SAF, Mou, Ancelotti, ZZ and has played for a strong European side basically from 06-07 to 17/18 (Last 3 at United, all 9 at Madrid except maybe 09/10).

Yes, I understand that these modern greats helped make conditions favorable for their teams but still...

I personally feel like greats of the past had more in them in adverse situations. R10 was a beast against a strong Chelsea and Milan at their stadiums for example when I felt we were the inferior team. Never saw Maradona play but seems to be the story about his 86 WC or even 90 WC.
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The differences between teams income is larger.

In 90s, 4-5 teams fought for titles.
Today 1-2 teams are dominating leagues.

In the past, results were closer to 2:0.
Today, Bayern, Psg, Barca, Real are winning 6:0 and 7:0 too often.

So, league stats from current greats are inflated.
 
R

Raki13

Active member
Blaugrana Bull said:
Nowhere near world class let alone GOAT status. Messi like we have known him is done.
I have always believed in him, he has always been THE one outstanding player for me but it is over.
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What a ridiculous childish comment. Going by what people these days consider is world class Messi is still the best of the lot of them. Sure hes not as fast as he was but technically nobody is anywhere near him in the game today. Age catches up with all players , you wont get any criticism from me hes the greatest theres ever been.
Who needs enemies with fans like this.
 
fergus90

fergus90

Senior Member
Messi's level is bound to have declined, he unfortunately is human but to say he's no longer world class anymore is just lunacy. With a better supporting cast around him I am certain his career at Barca can be prolonged for 4 or so as long as we lighten the creative and scoring burden from him.
 
Catta

Catta

Senior Member
Messi is a victim of his own high standards. If any other player had Messis stats from this season, there would be a campaign for a Ballon d'Or. He is still world class, but he is not on his GOAT standard anymore.
 
Xaviniesta

Xaviniesta

Senior Member
EcyuzxhXoAEaIYa


playing as a CAM/SS who doesn't run these days
 
KingLeo10

KingLeo10

Senior Member
Absolutely insane that he plays farther and farther away from goal as he ages.

Elite midfielders run 11-13 km a game. Even Pirlo ran this amount. He simply doesn't have the legs for what he wants to play.
 
FinBarcelonafan

FinBarcelonafan

Well-known member
KingLeo10 said:
Absolutely insane that he plays farther and farther away from goal as he ages.

Elite midfielders run 11-13 km a game. Even Pirlo ran this amount. He simply doesn't have the legs for what he wants to play.
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Not to mention he is the best goal scorer in the world and you want him to play midfield. Stupid nonsense.

I think it's nice he broke LaLiga assist record but more valuable to us would be Messi scoring goals
 
henias

henias

New member
Thats because u have two strikers taking too much central roles, and if there is a right winger who can provide width and take off his load and draw defenders he can easily attack the half space and penetrate. It has nothing to do with him deciding to play farther away from goal. Back then he used to drop extremely deep during Enrique's period and in Argentina too. It's him unable to go forward this days due to the lack of quality wingers. When Neymar decides to drop deep and playmake thats when Messi struggled too.

And for the false 9 role he has all the freedom and space to attack. That's pretty clear cut.
 
T

Tackle

Senior Member
Batistuta9 said:
Nope. Number 1 reason Messi has been the best, is his technical ability and understanding of the game. He was never going to play as a 10 at Barca as a 17 year old. He had insane acceleration which helped him so much, but it isn't what made him the best. There are players faster than Messi that are garbage. No one would really describe Messi as possessing elite physical attributes
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Messi was elite physically for a long time. Maybe not in the traditional sense, but his acceleration, agility, balance, strength holding off defenders, riding challenges etc. were all second to none. His top speed was maybe not Mbappe level, but still world class. You don't become one of the best ever without physical gifts. Of course his intelligence played a big part in him becoming the player he was, but this idea that Leo was always some limp noodle that got to the top merely off his technical ability and reading of the game is complete nonsense.

[youtube]CawopE4QJSs[/youtube]

Watch that and try telling me he wasn't elite physically.
 
KingLeo10

KingLeo10

Senior Member
Tackle said:
Messi was elite physically for a long time. Maybe not in the traditional sense, but his acceleration, agility, balance, strength holding off defenders, riding challenges etc. were all second to none. His top speed was maybe not Mbappe level, but still world class. You don't become one of the best ever without physical gifts. Of course his intelligence played a big part in him becoming the player he was, but this idea that Leo was always some limp noodle that got to the top merely off his technical ability and reading of the game is complete nonsense.

[youtube]CawopE4QJSs[/youtube]

Watch that and try telling me he wasn't elite physically.
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He had the best acceleration (or top 3 at least) among attackers between 2005 and 2012. Resurgence in 14/15. Has been physically declining ever since.
 
Batistuta9

Batistuta9

New member
Tackle said:
Messi was elite physically for a long time. Maybe not in the traditional sense, but his acceleration, agility, balance, strength holding off defenders, riding challenges etc. were all second to none. His top speed was maybe not Mbappe level, but still world class. You don't become one of the best ever without physical gifts. Of course his intelligence played a big part in him becoming the player he was, but this idea that Leo was always some limp noodle that got to the top merely off his technical ability and reading of the game is complete nonsense.

[youtube]CawopE4QJSs[/youtube]

Watch that and try telling me he wasn't elite physically.
Click to expand...

I'm not talking about the young Messi. He was very good physically. Since 2013/14 his speed started declining. Even through his decline in speed, he has been the best individual player in the world, or do you believe the years CR7 won the ballon dor's he was actually better than Messi? The ballon dor has become an award for the best player in the CL winning team. If it was based on the best individual performance in a season, Messi should have won from 2009 onwards. This season is the only one where he hasn't been clearly the best
 
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