Lionel Messi - v7
- Thread starter Barcaman
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Marie-Antoinette
Banned
I guess we now know what you think of Marie-Antoinette too.
Hell yeah😉, she had a short life but damn did she enjoy herself. I still don't wish the same fate to Antonella though!
JerseyAddict
Well-known member
Great act by Leo.
So i had a chance to rewatch the 2011 champions league final, which barcelona have put up on thier website for free. (for anyone thats bored in isolation..a great way to kill some time!)
A few things from watching the game and comparing it todays game somewhat 9 years later..
1) Messi dropped back deep a lot to pick up the ball and drive forward. Something that hasent changed today to all the people complaining about it. Difference is Xavi and Iniesta knew how to drive forward and play lots of forward passes and throughballs.
We are missing this element sorely atm. Messi's role in the team is the same as it was back in 2011 (for anyone thats saying he's dropping deeper and deeper - watch the game.)|He has a free-role. The reason he's having a hard time atm is because of the midfielders and
forwards that's surrounding him and thier ability to drive forward. Just have a look at Xavi and iniesta always looking to playing through the lines and Pedro and Villa looking for those
throughballs. Raktic wont cut it as the dude only knows how to pass sideways and bakcwards. Artur has the potential but i still feel like hes playing it too safe. Frenkie needs to take up the role of busquests and we need another midfielder who can hold the ball and still drive
forward (alena?)
2) Wingers (villa/ pedro) knew when to pass and when to drive forward and shoot. They don't always look for Messi. This is another big lacking feature in todays game. When was the last time Griezmann tried to take on defenders, or even coutinho. Demeble
did well but alas is always injured. Bringing Neymar back can actually help. He knows the system, knows how to take on defenders and actually can fucking score (looking at you Griezmann).
3) The pace of Barca's game back then was so quick. one-touch passes made tiki-taka hard to break down. Combine with through-balls and we created quite a lot of scoring chances. ONE important thing to remember is that it was a combination of Messi, Xavi and Iniesta creating through/Key passes to Villa/ Pedro and Dani Alves when he bombs forward. See the difference between just Messi creating chances (in today's game) compared to 3 back then?. I remember Setien's first game we had a lot of quick one-touch passing football as well..but then somewhere along the line it was resorted back to the slow playing shit that makes us so predictable atm.
Overall Messi was a vital cog in a good team. Now its a team built around one man which is why it'll never work consistently (esp against big teams) - Liverpool home and away. IF they close him down with 3-4 players, the other guys have no fuking clue what to do as the plan is to drive the ball through Messi to create chances (current Barca and Argentina). The 2011 team had so many players driving forward that the opposition couldn't afford to man-mark messi with 3-4 players, as they knew it would open space up for Villa and Pedro.
This current team is so damn conservative and scared to take risks, which incidentally is whats fucking us up BIG TIME.
A few things from watching the game and comparing it todays game somewhat 9 years later..
1) Messi dropped back deep a lot to pick up the ball and drive forward. Something that hasent changed today to all the people complaining about it. Difference is Xavi and Iniesta knew how to drive forward and play lots of forward passes and throughballs.
We are missing this element sorely atm. Messi's role in the team is the same as it was back in 2011 (for anyone thats saying he's dropping deeper and deeper - watch the game.)|He has a free-role. The reason he's having a hard time atm is because of the midfielders and
forwards that's surrounding him and thier ability to drive forward. Just have a look at Xavi and iniesta always looking to playing through the lines and Pedro and Villa looking for those
throughballs. Raktic wont cut it as the dude only knows how to pass sideways and bakcwards. Artur has the potential but i still feel like hes playing it too safe. Frenkie needs to take up the role of busquests and we need another midfielder who can hold the ball and still drive
forward (alena?)
2) Wingers (villa/ pedro) knew when to pass and when to drive forward and shoot. They don't always look for Messi. This is another big lacking feature in todays game. When was the last time Griezmann tried to take on defenders, or even coutinho. Demeble
did well but alas is always injured. Bringing Neymar back can actually help. He knows the system, knows how to take on defenders and actually can fucking score (looking at you Griezmann).
3) The pace of Barca's game back then was so quick. one-touch passes made tiki-taka hard to break down. Combine with through-balls and we created quite a lot of scoring chances. ONE important thing to remember is that it was a combination of Messi, Xavi and Iniesta creating through/Key passes to Villa/ Pedro and Dani Alves when he bombs forward. See the difference between just Messi creating chances (in today's game) compared to 3 back then?. I remember Setien's first game we had a lot of quick one-touch passing football as well..but then somewhere along the line it was resorted back to the slow playing shit that makes us so predictable atm.
Overall Messi was a vital cog in a good team. Now its a team built around one man which is why it'll never work consistently (esp against big teams) - Liverpool home and away. IF they close him down with 3-4 players, the other guys have no fuking clue what to do as the plan is to drive the ball through Messi to create chances (current Barca and Argentina). The 2011 team had so many players driving forward that the opposition couldn't afford to man-mark messi with 3-4 players, as they knew it would open space up for Villa and Pedro.
This current team is so damn conservative and scared to take risks, which incidentally is whats fucking us up BIG TIME.
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I get what you mean man, we won't be finding midfielders like them anytime soon. My point was targeted more towards our players being more conservative and using Xavi-Iniesta purely as a reference as to how they loved to drive the ball towards goal. I feel like Artur has the talent but is slowly being molded more into a rakitic (?). Like have a look at how our fullbacks play. Semendo barely tries to take on his attacker. I've seen Frenkie take on his man and dribble forward which is great but the whole team mentality of playing it safe might catch up with him as well.
I could be wrong but thats how i'm reading the current situation when looking back through the past games.
tacticvarium
New member
I would say this club will never see midfielders as good as them or perhaps for the next 30 years at least.
Laudrup was a great player but to say he was better than Iniesta is ridiculous. Iniesta was probably the greatest midfielder that played the game IMO.
Richard.H
Senior Member
15 year gap between Laudrup and Iniesta. If you don't think that's a long time, then I have no clue what is.
Catta
Senior Member
Iniesta was always overrated because of his clutch goals. Both he and Busi have benefited from playing with Xavi, he made them two times better than they really are. Xavi is the midfield GOAT and nobody else.
Its all about opinions , for me Xavi was nowhere near as good as Iniesta.
And for anyone to say Iniesta was overrated is just plain stupid and shows how much you know about the game.
Messigician
Senior Member
Shutr up u eggs they are equal. Xavi improved Iniesta, and Iniesta improved Xavi they completed Tiki Taka
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