10 - Lionel Messi

[sikkboy]

lame

You're right it's also arrogant pish!

[George_Costanza]

Top men’s football player jerseys sales by state from @SoccerDotCom.

[Latschenkiefer]

In two year's time it will be Dest in every single state.

[Horatio]

Alaska Rashford? How dit that happen?

[JohnN]

You claim folk 'hate' Messi and have admitted it which is a lie for a start.

But you assume this 'hate' is the reason they criticise Messi when in fact you have it backwards and the criticism of the performances/attitude is what leads to the opinion of him.

I specifically speak about Serghei. He, himself has admitted he dislikes Messi as a person. It is kind of hard to make
unbiased criticism about someone you dislike.
He is constantly taking for granted every piece of rumor that supports his predefined view and dismisses anything else.
You can see the same pattern in BBZ. He dislikes Puig ( for example, as he dislikes many) so much, that he will make up numbers or scenarios to justify why he is not good enough.

Is that criticism that leads to an opinion or pre existing world view thar leads to the criticism?

[BBZ8800]

Sikboy and co says that Messi is not a huge part of our CL failures in the last few years.

Now, look at this:
1. during Pep, we were winning and Messi was a GOAT
2. Messi was winning both individual and team trophies:
CLs in 2009 and 2011
BDOrs in 09, 10, 11, 12
3. His first true real failure is La liga 2012 and Chelsea 2012.
Pep is also leaving a club.
In 2013, Tito is ill.
Barca gets beaten heavily, CR7 is emerging and winning Ballon D Or after Messi's 4 years in a row.
Now, since CR7 won it in 2013, the pressure is even bigger on Messi due to Messi vs CR7 media battle, and especially since he has also LOST the battle for the first time.
And then we have 2014:
1) Messi lost Ballon D Or in December of 2013
2) we got beaten by Bayern 7:0 in 2013
3) he is not the best in the world on an individual level and Barca is getting beaten as a club on a CL level.
4) also, World cup 2014 is coming and if he fails to win it, people will crucify him
And imo, he started to play worse since that moment.
Aldo, didn't he start to vommit during matches on a field in those days?

Now, when you sum it all, look at how Messi started to play (and sulk) in away matches since April of 2014:
2014:
Atletico 1:0

2015:
City 0:2, Suarez x2
Psg 1:3, Neymar, Suarez x2
Bayern 3:2, Neymar x2
Juventus 3:1, Rakitic, Suarez, Neymar

2016:
Arsenal 0:2, Messi, Messi (pen)
Atletico 2:0

2017:
Psg 4:0
Juve 3:0

2018:
Chelsea 1:1, Messi
Roma 3:0

2019:
Lyon 0:0
Man Utd 0:1, Shaw own goal
Liverpool 4:0

2020:
Napoli 1:1, Griezmann
Bayern 8:2, Suarez, Alaba own goal

World cup 2014
Switzerland 0:1, Di Maria
Belgium 0:1, Higuain
Nerherlands 0:0, 2:4
Germany 1:0

World cup 2018:
France 4:3, --

Copa America 2015
Colombia 0:0, penalties 4:5
Paraguay 1:6, --
Chile 0:0, penalties 4:1

Copa 2016:
Venezuela 1:4, Messi x1
Usa 0:4, Messi x1
Chile 0:0, penalties 4:2

Copa 2019:
Venezuela 0:2, --
Brasil 2:0

Since the April of 2014, Messi has played 29 KO matches on a neutral ground. (I didn't count CDR for obvious Mickey Mouse reasons, lol).
He scored 4 goals from an open play plus one pen.
He scored goals only on 4 matches out of 29 (Arsenal x2, Chelsea, Venezuela, Usa) and he didn't score against any of big teams.

He played 4 finals since then, 3 defeats, 0 goals.

Now, when we analyze his whole career, something happened mental wise with him in 2014 before the world cup.
As explained, imo, it is a mix of:
1. Media expectations
2. Cr7 Ballon D Or
3. Pressure to win WC with Argentina
4. Barcelona started to be mortal in a CL, unlike in Pep's years
5. He became a father in 2012 and 2015

And more or less, since then we have this walking-sulking Messi in away matches where he is dead from the moment we start to lose 0:1.

[sikkboy]

Mods why is this troll tolerated on this thread.I stopped reading at

3. His first true real failure is La liga 2012 and Chelsea 2012.

Why is he trolling the thread with references to Ronaldo. He writes very similarly to a well know Ronaldo fanboy on a big Engosh fans forum. Not-stop anti-Messi agenda on a Barcelona forum. It's a shit look, it really is!!

[BBZ8800]

Mods why is this troll tolerated on this thread.I stopped reading at
Why is he trolling the thread with references to Ronaldo. He writes very similarly to a well know Ronaldo fanboy on a big Engosh fans forum. Not-stop anti-Messi agenda on a Barcelona forum. It's a shit look, it really is!!

Are you 9 years old or what?

Don't be a snowflake.

I have posted cold stats of all Messi's away/neutral KO matches since 2014, and stats are more or less horrible.

This is not Fc Barca/Fc Messi fanpage where only: omg, what a game, what a goal, Goat and similar posts are allowed.

If you can't handle the truth, there are plenty of delusional fanpages of every player all over the internet where everything is perfect.

If you want to live in that type of illusion, good luck.

** about Cr7, it is obvious that both Messi and Cr7 are egoistic and care about every single award, trophy, goal and record.

There is a reason why Messi never wants to be benched.
He wants to break all individual records.

[Fati_Future_BallonDor]

Mods why is this troll tolerated on this thread.I stopped reading at
Why is he trolling the thread with references to Ronaldo. He writes very similarly to a well know Ronaldo fanboy on a big Engosh fans forum. Not-stop anti-Messi agenda on a Barcelona forum. It's a shit look, it really is!!

chill sickboy, everyone is allowed to post his opinions here.

[Vilarrubi]

Interesting one.

[Daniele]

Interesting one.

It is interesting.
This confirms my theory that there is a bias towards Messi.
Let me explain:
the parameter for judging him is the Prime Messi level (a totally oversized parameter compared to the history of football).
According to this parameter, his current performances are catastrophic and his decline evident.
But what happens if we compare him to more "human" standards?
In this case he is a player who despite a period of decline (definitive? Transnitory? We will see - for me more mental than technical) remains, for now, one of the most gifted

[FinBarcelonafan]

His finishing has declined a lot. That's fair to say and the biggest difference.

[Daniele]

His finishing has declined a lot. That's fair to say and the biggest difference.

This is correct but there is another consideration to be made.
Many of the shots are from more unfavorable positions to score:
an indication of a lower impact of the team's offensive play

[BBZ8800]

This is correct but there is another consideration to be made.
Many of the shots are from more unfavorable positions to score:
an indication of a lower impact of the team's offensive play

A team had shots from favourable positions in the last two matches without him, though.

What does it say?
1. a team is not creating chances from good positions at all?
2. or Messi is not getting into a good positions due to him dropping to a CM position?

Braithwaite and Griezmann had quite an easy chances in the last two matches.

Interesting.

If you'll reply that Messi needs to drop deep because a team is not creating enough = we created more than enough without him on a field in the last two matches.

So:
1. He is dropping deep for no reason. He just wants to be involved in every single action.
2. He is shooting from bad position because he is guilty for it with his dropping too deep, inability to dribble past 5 players from a CM position, a lack of pace and poor off the ball movement

[Laplacian]

Name me one user here that complains about his creation. Literally everyone's complaining about his finishing, and to a lesser degree his pace, work-rate, and movement.

Also, "unfavorable positions to score" lmao. I swear the vast majority of those shots are clear chances on goal.