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Thread: 6 - Jean-Clair Todibo

  1. #556
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luftstalag14 View Post
    Apparently several clubs have shown interest in signing Todibo and we are listening to the offers. If we sell him without a buyback clause it would be another piece of evidence that we have turned into a piece of laughing stock. No young player would want to sign with us in the future since we will just sell him to another club six months later. We are not Monaco or Porto.

    This kid is very good and has the potential to be a great player in my opinion. He definitely needs minutes, loan him out like Real Madrid did so many times with no friggin’ buy option, why can’t we do that?
    Why would we be a laughing stock and why would young players avoid us?

    1. if a player turns to be good enough=a win-win, he will be the happiest player in the world
    2. if a player turns out to be not good enough for us=we will resell him for the same amount of for even more

    Do you know players which career we have ruined? Players who were treated badly here but turn into winners in the next BIG club?
    Denis got a chance to play here. We didn't ruin him. He just sucks and he would suck in any big club.
    Gomes also.
    Marlon also.
    Mina also.
    Halilovic also.

    Those players also get their name hyped and get a chance for more lucrative offers from midtable teams because they came from a mighty Barca.

    Your "problem" is because you are assuming that every signing is a player good enough for us and that THEN coaches and Barto are idiots for not giving 30-50 matches to that young "gem" to prove himself.

    Again, our club is not ONLY Barto or Ernesto.
    We have 10s or 100s of coaches, scouts and guys who are doing a scouting and assessing job their whole life.
    In 90% of cases, if Malcom, Mina, Marlon, Todibo and similar are not playing=there is a strong reason for that.
    If they will get sold soon=there is a very strong reason for that.
    There will always be one KDB here and there, but in general, our coaches and 10s scouts in a technical staff are not idiots.

    So, if they have already gave up from Todibo, they probably assessed that he is ok, but not good enough for Barca (and it is not worth to invest too much time and chances in him, but to turn to another hit-and-miss-lottery signing).

    People whined at EV for being an idiot for not playing Mina.
    We fooled Everton, but now, 1 year later, it seems that Mina is a total fraud and he will be shipped to a Turkish 1st division.
    Today, it is way clearer why "stupid Ernesto" didn't trust to Mina.
    Because Mina sucks for Barca's standards and a coach and his technical team have figured that out after watching him for 2 weeks at training grounds.
    Our fans, as always, needed waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay more time to figure out that a player is actually not good enough for us.

    Or Marlon. Played for a 11th placed Sassuolo this season.
    I haven't followed him, but stats say that he played as a starter in the first part of a season and he didn't play much in the 2nd half.
    I don't know whether he god injured or just dropped down in the pecking order.

    Now, if you listened to our fans, they would say:
    1) if we gave chances to Mina (30-50 matches)=maybe he would have improved and turned into a player good enough for us.
    Well, a future confirmed that he wouldn't improve.
    He just sucks.
    And actually, NOT PLAYING him was a good move and our staff actually were quite correct about him and his true future potential. Unlike our fans.

    2) Marlon? The same.
    People will say: if we gave him 1-2 seasons, he would have improved, but we have IDIOTS as coaches and as technical staff.
    But again, they were right.
    They figured out quite soon that Marlon is just meh for the highest level and not worth it.

    A lesson for the future: when guys like Malcom, Arthur and Puig are not playing (or are not called by youth NT coaches like Alena and Arthur), always ask yourself:
    1) is it everyone else's fault: a coach is dumb, a coach hates him, we are idiots in developing young players, we have no vision, youth NT coaches hate him for some reason
    2) or WAY MORE LIKELY: these players have obvious flaws which coaches, technical staff and NT coaches can see right away. But our fans will figure it out in 2-3-4 years.

  2. #557
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    Quote Originally Posted by BBZ8800 View Post
    Why would we be a laughing stock and why would young players avoid us?

    1. if a player turns to be good enough=a win-win, he will be the happiest player in the world
    2. if a player turns out to be not good enough for us=we will resell him for the same amount of for even more

    Do you know players which career we have ruined? Players who were treated badly here but turn into winners in the next BIG club?
    Denis got a chance to play here. We didn't ruin him. He just sucks and he would suck in any big club.
    Gomes also.
    Marlon also.
    Mina also.
    Halilovic also.

    Those players also get their name hyped and get a chance for more lucrative offers from midtable teams because they came from a mighty Barca.

    Your "problem" is because you are assuming that every signing is a player good enough for us and that THEN coaches and Barto are idiots for not giving 30-50 matches to that young "gem" to prove himself.

    Again, our club is not ONLY Barto or Ernesto.
    We have 10s or 100s of coaches, scouts and guys who are doing a scouting and assessing job their whole life.
    In 90% of cases, if Malcom, Mina, Marlon, Todibo and similar are not playing=there is a strong reason for that.
    If they will get sold soon=there is a very strong reason for that.
    There will always be one KDB here and there, but in general, our coaches and 10s scouts in a technical staff are not idiots.

    So, if they have already gave up from Todibo, they probably assessed that he is ok, but not good enough for Barca (and it is not worth to invest too much time and chances in him, but to turn to another hit-and-miss-lottery signing).

    People whined at EV for being an idiot for not playing Mina.
    We fooled Everton, but now, 1 year later, it seems that Mina is a total fraud and he will be shipped to a Turkish 1st division.
    Today, it is way clearer why "stupid Ernesto" didn't trust to Mina.
    Because Mina sucks for Barca's standards and a coach and his technical team have figured that out after watching him for 2 weeks at training grounds.
    Our fans, as always, needed waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay more time to figure out that a player is actually not good enough for us.

    Or Marlon. Played for a 11th placed Sassuolo this season.
    I haven't followed him, but stats say that he played as a starter in the first part of a season and he didn't play much in the 2nd half.
    I don't know whether he god injured or just dropped down in the pecking order.

    Now, if you listened to our fans, they would say:
    1) if we gave chances to Mina (30-50 matches)=maybe he would have improved and turned into a player good enough for us.
    Well, a future confirmed that he wouldn't improve.
    He just sucks.
    And actually, NOT PLAYING him was a good move and our staff actually were quite correct about him and his true future potential. Unlike our fans.

    2) Marlon? The same.
    People will say: if we gave him 1-2 seasons, he would have improved, but we have IDIOTS as coaches and as technical staff.
    But again, they were right.
    They figured out quite soon that Marlon is just meh for the highest level and not worth it.

    A lesson for the future: when guys like Malcom, Arthur and Puig are not playing (or are not called by youth NT coaches like Alena and Arthur), always ask yourself:
    1) is it everyone else's fault: a coach is dumb, a coach hates him, we are idiots in developing young players, we have no vision, youth NT coaches hate him for some reason
    2) or WAY MORE LIKELY: these players have obvious flaws which coaches, technical staff and NT coaches can see right away. But our fans will figure it out in 2-3-4 years.

    BBZ, you write too much and I didn't bother reading your entire message. I think your message will hit home a lot more if you write less and be precise.

    Why are we going to be a piece of laughing stock? Because we signed a player, didn't give him many chances to prove himself and 6 months later we are selling him (assuming if we sell him without buy-back clause). Your whole point (without even reading three quarters of your post) is he is not good enough, right? How the heck did they know he is not good enough? He did well in those very few games he played (Catalan Supercopa for example). He didn't do well in training? That alone makes us want to sell him? Anyways, if we are saying he is not good enough, then what the hell was our scout thinking? Shouldn't they have been more careful and prudent?

    What is even the point of signing him in the first place if he isn't good enough? Are our scouts and sporting department folks a bunch of idiots?

    What is the point of buying a player and selling him several months later? Are we going for the resale values?
    Sóc Culer. Go HUAWEI!

  3. #558
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luftstalag14 View Post
    Because we signed a player, didn't give him many chances to prove himself and 6 months later we are selling him (assuming if we sell him without buy-back clause). Your whole point (without even reading three quarters of your post) is he is not good enough, right? How the heck did they know he is not good enough? He did well in those very few games he played (Catalan Supercopa for example). He didn't do well in training? That alone makes us want to sell him? Anyways, if we are saying he is not good enough, then what the hell was our scout thinking? Shouldn't they have been more careful and prudent?

    What is even the point of signing him in the first place if he isn't good enough? Are our scouts and sporting department folks a bunch of idiots?

    What is the point of buying a player and selling him several months later? Are we going for the resale values?
    I have explained all why's in a previous post.
    Shorter, one more time:
    1. Our club is not only EV.
    We have 10s or 100s of coaches, assistants, scouts and directors.
    They are watching and assessing players, their potential, their pros and cons and their chances for a success here.
    2. Why did we buy him or similar players?
    = because he was a good, cheap opportunity.
    We are not UNICEF who is concerned about happines and development of our kids (players).
    A kid was cheap. And had potential.
    From a business point of view, we paid him 5-10m, right?
    1. If he'll make it=we bought a gem for cheap
    2. If he'll be meh for Barca, but good for EPL midtable teams=we'll sell him for 15-30m and earn some easy money
    3. If he'll suck badly, which is unlikely=we will sell him for 2-5m and recoup some money.

    So, why did we bought him?
    = because he was a good market opportunity
    Why are we not playing him?
    = because 10s of our coaches changed their mind after watching him for a few Months on training grounds and they decided: he probably won't be good for us, but he will be good for Everton
    If you ask: how do they know that.
    = well, they are doing that for 30-40-50 years. They have more knowledge and experience than you and me.
    They have worked with 100-1000s Todibos during their careers.
    You will ask: but WHY did we buy him then if they think that he is average?
    = again, he had potential and he was cheap.
    You get more information about player's true abilities, IQ, personality, potential when you watch him every day in tackles on your training grounds.
    Not to mention that he played only 830 minutes in his career at Toulouse.
    And:
    1) scouts can't predict too much from 800 minutes
    2) plus, he played in a different league against weaker opponents
    After signing for us, our staff had 1000s of hours of material of him defending against Messi and our players on training grounds
    =to get info for a decision=what is his true potential, and should we keep him and wait or cash on him and move on to the next Todibo and Marlon.

    Btw, I have nothing against Todibo.
    This guy looked more promising than Mina or Marlon.
    I am just giving you answers to 100s of why's.
    Since people will ask the same question regarding young players until the end of time.
    Last edited by BBZ8800; 10th June 2019 at 03:28 PM.

  4. #559
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    Quote Originally Posted by BBZ8800 View Post
    I have explained all why's in a previous post.
    Shorter, one more time:
    1. Our club is not only EV.
    We have 10s or 100s of coaches, assistants, scouts and directors.
    They are watching and assessing players, their potential, their pros and cons and their chances for a success here.
    2. Why did we buy him or similar players?
    = because he was a good, cheap opportunity.
    We are not UNICEF who is concerned about happines and development of our kids (players).
    A kid was cheap. And had potential.
    From a business point of view, we paid him 5-10m, right?
    1. If he'll make it=we bought a gem for cheap
    2. If he'll be meh for Barca, but good for EPL midtable teams=we'll sell him for 15-30m and earn some easy money
    3. If he'll suck badly, which is unlikely=we will sell him for 2-5m and recoup some money.

    So, why did we bought him?
    = because he was a good market opportunity
    Why are we not playing him?
    = because 10s of our coaches changed their mind after watching him for a few Months on training grounds and they decided: he probably won't be good for us, but he will be good for Everton
    If you ask: how do they know that.
    = well, they are doing that for 30-40-50 years. They have more knowledge and experience than you and me.
    They have worked with 100-1000s Todibos during their careers.
    You will ask: but WHY did we buy him then if they think that he is average?
    = again, he had potential and he was cheap.
    You get more information about player's true abilities, IQ, personality, potential when you watch him every day in tackles on your training grounds.
    Not to mention that he played only 830 minutes in his career at Toulouse.
    And:
    1) scouts can't predict too much from 800 minutes
    2) plus, he played in a different league against weaker opponents
    After signing for us, our staff had 1000s of hours of material of him defending against Messi and our players on training grounds
    =to get info for a decision=what is his true potential, and should we keep him and wait or cash on him and move on to the next Todibo and Marlon.

    Btw, I have nothing against Todibo.
    This guy looked more promising than Mina or Marlon.
    I am just giving you answers to 100s of why's.
    Since people will ask the same question regarding young players until the end of time.
    I didn't bring up Valverde at all.

    How come he did well in those few games he played? Those coaches and assistants and scouts and directors know something we don't? Sure they do, but considering how many flops they have bought in the last several years I doubt it.

    Anyways, I would be very disappointed if we sell him without a buy-back, without giving him more chances to grow, improve and impress. The message we are sending out to the whole wide world will be: When you are signing with FC Barcelona, you are not necessarily signing with FC Barcelona, especially if you are young and relatively cheap. Soon you will end up in another club.
    Sóc Culer. Go HUAWEI!

  5. #560
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    Quote Originally Posted by BBZ8800 View Post
    1) scouts can't predict too much from 800 minutes
    This is a recent BBZ gem!
    800 minutes (12 full games) is not enough to predict too much... Hmmmm...

  6. #561
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    Quote Originally Posted by Potroh View Post
    This is a recent BBZ gem!
    800 minutes (12 full games) is not enough to predict too much... Hmmmm...
    Ironically BBZ writes of some players in less than 800 minutes.
    On why Valverde is suited for Barca :

    -not playing naive in CL away and getting thrashed everytime (roma was dembele fault for missing empty net). ~ Enjoy your life.

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    Quote Originally Posted by messi2140 View Post
    Ironically BBZ writes of some players in less than 800 minutes.
    and worships EV and Rakitic for more than 800 mins a day.


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    Adam Leventhal who is tier one for Watford news said this.



    I can't see us loaning/selling him if we miss out on De Ligt. Especially that we have other big matters such as a new LB, Striker+the additions of Griezmann and De Jong I think if we miss out on De Ligt, the CB positions takes a back seat kinda like the RB one if we sell Semedo.

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    We are terribly managed.

    Did this guy play like 1 single game with a decent team at Camp Nou? I mean even one game?

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    Watford are interested in Todibo, Barcelona are interested in Joao Pedro.

    Do we entertain the thought of a swap? This lad looks like a proper striker. Or do we use a Todibo loan to sign Joao Pedro ahead of other suitors like Liverpool on the much talked about 20m release fee (pennies compared to Vinicius and Rodrygo).

    Todibo has been on evaluation since moving in January. I don't buy that we will assess him in pre-season as he has pretty much been assessed for the past 6 months by Valverde. Meanwhile Watford with an experienced Spanish manager is a great loan option. I say take it and sign Joao Pedro leaving him at Watford for a season two aswell.
    Last edited by Porque; 12th June 2019 at 10:02 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jair Ventura
    You can prove anything with facts. Facts cloud my judgement, I prefer to rely on instinct and blind prejudice.

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    Loaning him to the Prem would be massive for him. IMO we should scout and loan more to the Prem than to France etc. It is the best league after all and Liverpool has found some gems there.

    The intensity and psychique in the Prem would do wonders for Todibo if he play weekly.
    Last edited by Riordon; 12th June 2019 at 11:47 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Luftstalag14 View Post
    BBZ, you write too much and I didn't bother reading your entire message. I think your message will hit home a lot more if you write less and be precise.

    Why are we going to be a piece of laughing stock? Because we signed a player, didn't give him many chances to prove himself and 6 months later we are selling him (assuming if we sell him without buy-back clause). Your whole point (without even reading three quarters of your post) is he is not good enough, right? How the heck did they know he is not good enough? He did well in those very few games he played (Catalan Supercopa for example). He didn't do well in training? That alone makes us want to sell him? Anyways, if we are saying he is not good enough, then what the hell was our scout thinking? Shouldn't they have been more careful and prudent?

    What is even the point of signing him in the first place if he isn't good enough? Are our scouts and sporting department folks a bunch of idiots?

    What is the point of buying a player and selling him several months later? Are we going for the resale values?
    Wish I could like this TWICE

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    We got Todibo on a free. If he becomes a squad player, fantastic, if he doesn't but he gets even 10 million euros that is good business. Whatever happens with him is not worth getting worked up about--very low risk move with some upside, hopes he makes it at Barca but it is never probable that he will.

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    According to MD, if we don't get De Ligt, we will stick with Todibo.

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    I can see him becoming world-class, however, it will never happen under the weasel, he played 1 friendly game last 6 months, next season he would get about 4 friendly games (including quarter against random spain c team). He has already ruined his development, would be crazy if he's not pushing for a move this summer.