snowy
New member
haha that ending!
People are starting to see the players are a big part of the problem, good. Some people were acting like you could swap the manager and it’s all going to fix itself.
Those players would still be past it and have a shit attitude with a new manager. They are equivalent to Ronaldinho and Deco when Guardiola arrived. Even a manager like Pep couldn’t just them around with good man management, they were beyond saving and needed to be replaced.
The clubs problems are at all three levels (players, manager, sporting department), it is too simplistic to just scapegoat the manager alone, or the players alone.
Those players would still be past it and have a shit attitude with a new manager. They are equivalent to Ronaldinho and Deco when Guardiola arrived. Even a manager like Pep couldn’t just them around with good man management, they were beyond saving and needed to be replaced.
The clubs problems are at all three levels (players, manager, sporting department), it is too simplistic to just scapegoat the manager alone, or the players alone.
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FCBfan22
Senior Member
True that the problem is in all those departments, but we have a coach with no spine and that amplifies the complacency problem in the squad amongst the seniors. In a perfect scenario, we would have a coach with strong personality who would evaluate all players and give all of them a chance to prove themselves. You become comfortable and don't perform on the required level? Off to the bench.
messi2140
6racies Xavi
A competent manager with authority would have still solved most of the problems. Since no way would a WC manager with attacking football as vision :
Play Roberto over Semedo
Make that fraud Rakitic a starter
Would have developed Dembele
Would actually play attacking football and not park the bus against la liga fodders
etc...
So yes , while the senior players are a bunch of entitled pricks that really feel comfortable under this coward. I still believe a WC manager would have solved the majority of the issues this club is having.
serghei
Senior Member
It's not new. Rakitic, Suarez, even Busquets, Coutinho etc., had been criticized here a lot for over the years. We've been demanding for Rakitic to play less for a lot of time. Over 2 years. Regarding Roberto, we have Semedo who could have played more, especially when dealing with good attackers on his side, like Mane. Regarding Coutinho, we have Malcom who could have play more. We've had options.
The no1 supporter of under-performing veterans was and still is Valverde. So the blame is inevitably directed towards him as well in regards to under-performing veterans. No wonder these veterans love him and every single one of them is campaigning for him to remain.
I'd say on the contrary. It's puzzling how Valverde supporters are against the veterans, considering Valverde is their no1 supporter. If logic is still a thing nowadays, Valverde's fans should defend Busi, Rakitic, Suarez, and others since they are clearly backed a lot by their favorite, at the expense of the new young guys.
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henias
New member
Nobody is "scapegoating" the manager, neither is the manager a scapegoat. You're talking about huge egos but in the case of Valverde, he simply allowed them to walk all over him. Any player would feel entitled under him and it's no coincidence it's all a large bunch of them who all were previously under Pep or Enrique.
Everyone knows there's layers of problems from the club, how this has been mentioned countless times if you read the forums enough. Ideally, I have always wanted the board and manager to be out.
But one of the biggest factor that comes into play is that the squad is just poorly managed, period. Week in, week out you see the same. Which is why it is heavily mentioned. I said before, a manager who doesnt depend on the old core players would largely alleviate this problem, allow for a balanced reward system not one with heavy bias towards some just because they played for Enrique or Pep. And for Esterno's competence and knowledge in general tactics I don't even wish to dwell into because he has no idea what he is doing as opposed to how people made him to be some sort "genius". He just sticks to old core players hoping they could do the job.
You expect such an amateur to not be copiously discussed? And refer that to some kind of "scapegoat"? Tough luck mate.
At such high levels, such mediocrity stands out. Simple as that.
Ironically, Valverde supporters were defending the likes of golden boy Roberto, Suarez and Rakitic and have no problem with them being overused, so all of a sudden they are pressing issues?
Speaking for myself, I have been critical of Busquets, Roberto, Suarez for a while. I was also critical of Rakitic to a lesser extent but appreciated some of his qualities, so my views on him were mixed, ideally I saw him as a rotation player. With Rakitic, I like having a player of his profile in the squad because I think it’s important. (Rakitic in his current form isn’t the ideal player for this role anymore).
With Valverde, I gave him credit because he joined when Barca was at a bad moment and brought a stabilising influence. He saw the limitataions of some senior players and played a pragmatic style which put them in a position to succeed, instead of playing tiki taka foolishly with a team that can’t execute it. I hoped at the end of the first season that he would transition to a more familiar style and integrate the technical players as they joined the club. In the second season he didn’t really do that, but was still playing a pragmatic style and getting results, so I gave him credit for that. Still I knew that Barca needed a new direction and was saying before the Liverpool game that Barca needed a new coach in the summer that can develop youth and return to a familiar style.
The reason I may have appeared as a “Valverde supporter” is that I was giving credit for the pragmatism, and felt that it was being under appreciated. Long term, I don’t want Barca to play that style, but I thought it was a good move in the short term. I think long term, Barca should try to play the familiar style, with some experienced/physical players thrown in because it keeps a balanced squad, lets Barca play a different style when needed, be able to match physical teams if they need to while still being a technical team overall.
With Valverde, I gave him credit because he joined when Barca was at a bad moment and brought a stabilising influence. He saw the limitataions of some senior players and played a pragmatic style which put them in a position to succeed, instead of playing tiki taka foolishly with a team that can’t execute it. I hoped at the end of the first season that he would transition to a more familiar style and integrate the technical players as they joined the club. In the second season he didn’t really do that, but was still playing a pragmatic style and getting results, so I gave him credit for that. Still I knew that Barca needed a new direction and was saying before the Liverpool game that Barca needed a new coach in the summer that can develop youth and return to a familiar style.
The reason I may have appeared as a “Valverde supporter” is that I was giving credit for the pragmatism, and felt that it was being under appreciated. Long term, I don’t want Barca to play that style, but I thought it was a good move in the short term. I think long term, Barca should try to play the familiar style, with some experienced/physical players thrown in because it keeps a balanced squad, lets Barca play a different style when needed, be able to match physical teams if they need to while still being a technical team overall.
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serghei
Senior Member
[MENTION=2258]Hamzah[/MENTION], that's fair imo.
I personally don't believe we were in such a crisis in La Liga. Based on what? Far from it. And he didn't bring any stabilizing influence in CL whatsoever, in fact we're playing the worst football in the last decade and our CL results are terrible.
I personally don't believe we were in such a crisis in La Liga. Based on what? Far from it. And he didn't bring any stabilizing influence in CL whatsoever, in fact we're playing the worst football in the last decade and our CL results are terrible.
FinBarcelonafan
Well-known member
The team lost the belief for him. Look at this game vs Valencia. Embarrassing shitshoW!!!
FIRE HIM! NOW!!!
FIRE HIM! NOW!!!
Luftstalag14
Culé de Celestial Empire
Why are you guys so happy? Losing to the final in Valencia in this fashion shows either (1) our players are still traumatized by the loss to Liverpool and are mentally broken or (2) they don't give a damn anymore. Either case it is spelling huge trouble for the next season because if this get carried over to the next season and I think it will, our next season could be a total wash. And come on, you all know Bartomeu will not fire Valencia no matter how hard we get spanked today. Valverde will be here next season.
So I really question your motive in celebrating this spanking today. How many times do we have to be humiliated??
So I really question your motive in celebrating this spanking today. How many times do we have to be humiliated??
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