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Thread: Retardo

  1. #4366
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    Neymessi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devils View Post
    We weren't second best against Chelsea and Roma lol.

    Those two teams had comical defending at Camp Nou. No way you can say a team that defended as poor as those two were better than Barca.
    In terms of dangerous chance creation, chelsea was better than us. Never said roma was better but we were mediocre against roma. All 3 goals we scored a good GK which courtois is should have easily saved 2. FFS who conceedes a nutmeg from that angle. We were lucky they didn't put away their chances and had plenty of noob errors at the back. As for roma 4-1 scoreline is very misleading. The game put me to sleep until 2-0 happenned and roma mentally collapsed slowly after that but before that it was shit game from us.

    Quote Originally Posted by LeeRomeno View Post
    We cannot be honest and state completely random and wrong statement at the same time. Only fixture where we were considerably worse than opponent and had massive luck was Sevilla away, which is also quite understandable due to the circumstances, key players being injured, first game after international break and Sevillas good form (which they showed again vs Bayern btw). We dominated the tie against Chelsea, did exactly what we had to do, held it tight away and scored a goal and were leading at home 2-0 by 20th minute. Dont know how this is in any way being second best team. Chelsea put up a good fight sure, but they were never close to winning it.
    As for Roma, winning 4-1 at home and dominating the match for most part, how is this mediocre performance. Once again, our goal was to win by big margin and keep them from scoring. Unfortunately we had lapse in concentration after leading 3-0, but 4-1 is still a result most of people would have been happy before.
    As always you use final results as the parameters to judge the performance. We did what we needed to do away? How? We didn't have a single good chance against chelsea away. The one we scored was a defensive error and they hit the post 2 times and scored once. Did EV know they would hit the post twice and make a noob error in the dying minutes?

    We may have been better than roma but we were still mediocre. It was hard watching us trying to attack. No chemistry no fluidity nothing. We ended up winning but both goals which were the most important ones were own goals and one can say pressure forces own goals but those would have definitely been avoided. We won 4-1 but had we won 2-0 but with playing good overall and by that I don't mean play like pep days I wouldn't be too worried.
    RESULTS CAN BE MISLEADING. LOOK DEEPER

  2. #4367
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neymessi View Post
    As always you use final results as the parameters to judge the performance. We did what we needed to do away? How? We didn't have a single good chance against chelsea away. The one we scored was a defensive error and they hit the post 2 times and scored once. Did EV know they would hit the post twice and make a noob error in the dying minutes?

    We may have been better than roma but we were still mediocre. It was hard watching us trying to attack. No chemistry no fluidity nothing. We ended up winning but both goals which were the most important ones were own goals and one can say pressure forces own goals but those would have definitely been avoided. We won 4-1 but had we won 2-0 but with playing good overall and by that I don't mean play like pep days I wouldn't be too worried.
    We scored from a good chance, fact that it came due to defensive error shows how effective our pressuring was. The posts came from longshots outside the area, which are usually less dangerous and they were more or less down to 1 player Willian being brilliant. Nothing to do with Chelsea being better or more effective in any way. So it is okey to trash our squad and say we need Messi to save us, while if some opposition player has game of a season, it is "opposition team dominating us"?. EV did not know they would hit the post twice, but our gameplan always involved being cautious, to avoid what happened in away games last season vs PSG and Juve and try to seek possibilities to score from counters and opposition mistakes by pressing them high. The latter worked.

    No chemistry? What kind of game were you watching. I remember sequences where our passing was absolutely brilliant and fast, but usually some last touch or through-ball was cancelling out good attack. First own goal was last second effort from De Rossi to avoid Messi getting ball. He was 1 toe-length away from reaching it, which would have meant Messi getting ball 1 on 1 against goalkeeper. It was not some clumsy 3-bounce own goal and it happened due to our dangerous attacking movement.
    Same thing with second goal, which Umtiti should have scored in the first place after good work from Rakitic.
    We only took off foot after leading 3-0, which is something that makes sense. It was result that satisfied us and we focused on keeping opposition from scoring. Only issue i have with Roma game was we did not do that properly and allowed Dzeko to score.
    Other than that, it was not a mediocre game, but dominating and controlling entire match like it should be.
    Some people just cannot be satisfied no matter what.

  3. #4368
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neymessi View Post
    In terms of dangerous chance creation, chelsea was better than us. Never said roma was better but we were mediocre against roma. All 3 goals we scored a good GK which courtois is should have easily saved 2. FFS who conceedes a nutmeg from that angle. We were lucky they didn't put away their chances and had plenty of noob errors at the back. As for roma 4-1 scoreline is very misleading. The game put me to sleep until 2-0 happenned and roma mentally collapsed slowly after that but before that it was shit game from us.



    As always you use final results as the parameters to judge the performance. We did what we needed to do away? How? We didn't have a single good chance against chelsea away. The one we scored was a defensive error and they hit the post 2 times and scored once. Did EV know they would hit the post twice and make a noob error in the dying minutes?

    We may have been better than roma but we were still mediocre. It was hard watching us trying to attack. No chemistry no fluidity nothing. We ended up winning but both goals which were the most important ones were own goals and one can say pressure forces own goals but those would have definitely been avoided. We won 4-1 but had we won 2-0 but with playing good overall and by that I don't mean play like pep days I wouldn't be too worried.
    Pep days

    Let's remember Pep days:

    -Chelsea 2009: we scored thanks to the only shot on target we had at Stamford Bridge, a shot from Iniesta when the match was going to finish;

    -Inter 2010: typical Italian team that parks the bus, terrible performance away, I don't remember a shot on target from us except Piqué goal and a Messi shot;

    -Real Madrid 2011: 0 shots on target, Pepe gets sent off, Messi dribbles the entire Madrid defence(hardly a team goal);

    -Chelsea 2012: the only good performance from us, created plenty of chances but that team was 6th in PL and easily a worst side than this Chelsea team.

    How many chances did create Real Madrid against Juve?

    The first goal is a clear mistake by Barzagli, similar to the mistakes Roma made yesterday.

    The second is a mess between Chiellini and Buffon, sure Ronaldo's goal was spectacular but Lucas Vazquez should have scored before, he was alone in the box.

    The first two goals were own goals but if De Rossi didn't touch the ball Messi would probably have scored or at least have a shot on target, in the second if the Roma defender didn't touch the ball Umtiti would have scored an easy tap in.
    Last edited by Stoichkov1; 5th April 2018 at 03:01 PM.

  4. #4369
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devils View Post
    We weren't second best against Chelsea and Roma lol.

    Those two teams had comical defending at Camp Nou. No way you can say a team that defended as poor as those two were better than Barca.
    Chelsea didn't have comical defending. They gave away very little. Nevertheless we have gone through deservingly as they weren't able to create much as well.
    Did think it was obvious we were stronger than Roma. We deserve to be in half-finals so far.

  5. #4370
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    Dont think there is single team in the world capable of playing football the way @Neymessi dreams of. There are also approximately 1 or maybe 2 good coaches in the world, rest are all trash. Same could be said about players.

  6. #4371
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neymessi View Post
    In terms of dangerous chance creation, chelsea was better than us. Never said roma was better but we were mediocre against roma. All 3 goals we scored a good GK which courtois is should have easily saved 2. FFS who conceedes a nutmeg from that angle. We were lucky they didn't put away their chances and had plenty of noob errors at the back. As for roma 4-1 scoreline is very misleading. The game put me to sleep until 2-0 happenned and roma mentally collapsed slowly after that but before that it was shit game from us.
    I disagree with that, we had more attempts on goal at Camp Nou against Chelsea and were comfortable. And it's not like Stamford Bridge is the easiest stadium to walk into and leave with a result, but we managed to get a result against them as well.

    Nothing was wrong with those goals, there are always these 'should have, could have, would have' arguments in any game. Juventus should have not let Ronaldo roam free in their box two days ago or Man City's 250m defense should not have turned into a amateur defense yesterday...Not really an argument worth discrediting our performance.

    Quote Originally Posted by LeeRomeno View Post
    Dont think there is single team in the world capable of playing football the way @Neymessi dreams of. There are also approximately 1 or maybe 2 good coaches in the world, rest are all trash. Same could be said about players.
    There seems to be this expectation with some fans that we need to play similar or follow the same principles that gave us such success in the past. i.e. midfield fluidity we had with Xavi and Iniesta and the hammer attacking force of MSN.

    In reality, we don't have the players for that anymore and if we tried to tactically play like that, I think we would be in for a VERY rude awakening.

    I do think we can still play better though. The 442 system we played in Dec/Jan was great and we were playing at a level and intensity above that we are at now. Think those should be the levels we strive to get to again before the semis.
    Puyol #5

  7. #4372
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    If we compete hard in the semifinal I'm ready to believe that Valverde us a great pragmatist.

  8. #4373
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neymessi View Post
    I really want to know where this crystal ball resides where the players knew what the end result was going to be. Here is yet another post of a user convincing him that everything is right because the ends justify the means.



    Were the players too comfortable against sevilla too? Chelsea too? Because they knew they would win in the end?

    Lets be honest for one second and admit we were the second best team against chelsea in both legs and we were very mediocre against roma which was by far the easiest draw of qf AT HOME. Last few fixtures, sevilla chelsea and roma have all been the same. If we had lost against chelsea and sevilla which we easily could have the forum would be singing a completely different tune.
    Chelsea first leg is the only match where we played with fully fit team and still were the second best

    Chelsea second leg, we were lead since at the start, and knowing that Chelsea threw it all. Hence, we created less chance than them, not because we could not but because we need not.

    Against sevilla, we played without our two best players. And sevilla gave their all. Their coach has said, they could not beat Bayern since they ran out of energy. And still, we were good enough to scrap the win in the final.

    Against Roma, it's very clear all the players are so exhausted and again our two best players are not fully fit.

    Estimate the team's performance in the semifinal second leg when we have already won the league and could rest in the preceding league match.

    And even then, we still have a lot of improvement in the final. And, at worst we could bring the tie to the second leg, even if we were tired and ill prepared for the semifinal first leg (considering that we play clasico before first leg).

    We are going for all. Unbeaten league, Copa and CL. We would struggle only until semifinal. Our only difficult tie is the semifinal. Once we're through the semi finals, we are the clear favourites.

  9. #4374
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    I don't like that passing map. Guardiola passing maps look nicer.

  11. #4376
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joan Laporta View Post
    Miles better than the Sevilla one with gaping hole in the middle (Paulinho). Rakitić played the role Paulinho was supposed to against Sevilla and did it miles better. Everybody was passing to everybody which is great. Also it shows that the setup was more of a 4-1-3-2.

  12. #4377
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    Quote Originally Posted by FCBfan22 View Post
    Miles better than the Sevilla one with gaping hole in the middle (Paulinho). Rakitić played the role Paulinho was supposed to against Sevilla and did it miles better. Everybody was passing to everybody which is great. Also it shows that the setup was more of a 4-1-3-2.
    One thing I forgot. Remember that Betis match? Rakitić was also the main man and we played with the same combo on the right, Semedo and Bob (who has good defensive stats in both matches). Freeing Rakitić doesn't just improves the flow but also the creativity of the team. One of the benefits I didn't think of when advocating this setup.

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    Valverde has finally found the lineup that will win CL. Semedo won his spot in the CL first 11 based on his performance yesterday.

    I feel better about the bench now, too. Having Dembele to bring in off the bench could be the difference in one of the remaining games. Paulinho and D. Suarez doing quite well now as subs, and even Gomes looks improved.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PhilS View Post
    Valverde has finally found the lineup that will win CL. Semedo won his spot in the CL first 11 based on his performance yesterday.

    I feel better about the bench now, too. Having Dembele to bring in off the bench could be the difference in one of the remaining games. Paulinho and D. Suarez doing quite well now as subs, and even Gomes looks improved.
    Eh, not really...

    I agree with the rest. I might add that Paulinho could benefit from 2 weeks off. He looks like a dead man walking right now.

  15. #4380
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    Quote Originally Posted by PhilS View Post
    Valverde has finally found the lineup that will win CL. Semedo won his spot in the CL first 11 based on his performance yesterday.

    I feel better about the bench now, too. Having Dembele to bring in off the bench could be the difference in one of the remaining games. Paulinho and D. Suarez doing quite well now as subs, and even Gomes looks improved.
    Roberto didn't perform so well yesterday though.