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Thread: Ernesto Valverde

  1. #721
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    Team look motivated...at least in this first match that is. I wish him all the luck.

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    team was motivated today, moving well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DonAndres View Post
    Said in the chat that the 4-2-3-1 won't work against a top side. It was either a 4-2-3-1 with Messi at striker or a 4-3-3 with Roberto going headless chicken, Messi false 9, and Paco/Deulo on the wings. Either way it won't work with our best lineup.

    Suarez would be totally fucked playing on the left, Messi would get smothered in the middle by any defensive side, a midfield 2 of Busi-Rakitic would get overrun so quickly. We need to buy Seri/Dembele and go back to a 4-3-3 or at least a 4-3-1-2 with Messi at the #10 if he doesn't want to play wide.

    I liked that he learned about Semedo, and that he played Vidal in attack. So far EV hasn't made the same mistake twice, which is at least promising. I thought things always looked stronger when he played 4-3-3 with high press in preseason and against RM, we just needed to stick to that formula which was working and add proper personnel. Hope he doesn't keep tinkering and just builds rhythm/momentum with our native and best formation/system.
    You're right about false 9. It was figured out years ago. The last time I remember us not being annihilated in a big game while playing false 9 is the first half of 2012. Freaking Milan schooled us when we played false 9. You're also right that Messi at CAM requires 3 midfielders behind him to cover his lack of defensive work without sacrificing virtually all creativity. I've been saying that for a while now. Every time Messi at #10 was successful, he had 3 midfielders behind him. 4-0 vs Milan, 6-1 vs PSG, etc. You either put 3 midfielders behind him, or you play a classic double pivot that can't create for shit, or your midfield can't defend for shit and gets overrun.

    -----------Mats------------
    Semedo-Umtiti-Pique-Alba
    ---------Busquets---------
    -------Seri-Iniesta/Rakitic/Roberto
    ----------Messi---------------
    -------Dembele-Suarez-----

    Messi gets a free role behind Suarez and Dembele. Only problem is the lack of width. Semedo and Alba would have their work cut out for them. When defending, Suarez and Dembele would need to drop back to the wings in a 4-3-3 formation to help them out. On offense, if we need to stretch the pitch, Alba/Semedo (it can really be either one because Dembele can play on either side) can bomb forward to form a front 3 in front of Messi. Though the majority of our offensive play would probably go through the middle.

    And the ability to learn from your mistakes that you mentioned cannot be overstated. It's what allowed Lucho to turn his first season around. His reluctance to do so arguably did him in in his last season.
    Last edited by Lelouch vi Britannia; 20th August 2017 at 09:05 PM.

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    Alcacer

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    A positive note:

    Pace of our gameplay is high. Many quick touch passes that destabilized the opponent defense. Positioning of the players is good resulting in a lot of quick short passes.

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    Not much difference between the 4-3-1-2 and 4-2-3-1 as it relates to Messi, if one thinks the DM will be all over him, all that will do his give him no options to the right or left to release the pressure to with one of his passes.

    Because there will be little width in that formation apart from the FB

    4-2-3-1 is the best option, it provides with and if we have a willing worker out wide it helps defensively, a narrow formation like 4-3-1-2 has no place in today's football really, especially with most teams pushing the fullback as high up as possible.

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    Not to mention who will we yet to play as the second striker in that formation, demebele? Nope
    Courtinho? nope
    Paco? Haha

    4-2-3-1 can't be brother to name the XI now but it's pretty obvious, especially if we get both courtinho & dembele who are both young willing runners who will go back and help the pivots.

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    Quote Originally Posted by xXKonan View Post
    The formation looks quite balanced with the obvious exception of Alcancer
    Romans 1:19-20
    Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse

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    He played Semedo and dropped Gomes. He's already better than Lucho (atleast in the stubbornness department).

    Now don't play Paco again until there's no other choice or we are winning 4-0.
    Every single fan who have once chanted my name at Camp Nou. I've loved every minute of fighting for you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gasgas View Post
    The formation looks quite balanced with the obvious exception of Alcancer
    It looks fine if you ignore Alcacer. If you don't it looks like a 2-8-0

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    Quote Originally Posted by gasgas View Post
    The formation looks quite balanced with the obvious exception of Alcancer
    Stats might be misleading. It is true that our team looks balanced and the pace of the game is high. But Rakitic was as bad as Alcacer. It is just fortune for him that he happened to be a central midfielder and was in receiving end of many passes. Though it has to be noted that when he received the ball all he did was look forward, wait for sometime, give time to opponent to pressure him and finally pass the ball sideways to Messi (when he is in midfield), Busquets and Semedo. I think he didn't even have one creative forward pass in the game. He did well in defense though.
    Last edited by Cruyff-Total Football; 20th August 2017 at 10:00 PM.

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    I have come to one big conclusion. Since Guardiola left, managers have no role in this club but to match the protocol. The players win everything when they feel like and they play horribly when they don't. This analysis sound too simplistic but i honestly believe so. How many managers came after guardiola and yet i can't distinguish the style of this from that. I also believe that we recruit the same profile of managers for the same purpose :the quite, humble, nice guy. all of those managers meet this criteria, leaving everything else to the crooks in the board and the mood of the players in the field.
    kilometers matter ..

  14. #734
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    Quote Originally Posted by DonAndres View Post
    Said in the chat that the 4-2-3-1 won't work against a top side. It was either a 4-2-3-1 with Messi at striker or a 4-3-3 with Roberto going headless chicken, Messi false 9, and Paco/Deulo on the wings. Either way it won't work with our best lineup.

    Suarez would be totally fucked playing on the left, Messi would get smothered in the middle by any defensive side, a midfield 2 of Busi-Rakitic would get overrun so quickly. We need to buy Seri/Dembele and go back to a 4-3-3 or at least a 4-3-1-2 with Messi at the #10 if he doesn't want to play wide.

    I liked that he learned about Semedo, and that he played Vidal in attack. So far EV hasn't made the same mistake twice, which is at least promising. I thought things always looked stronger when he played 4-3-3 with high press in preseason and against RM, we just needed to stick to that formula which was working and add proper personnel. Hope he doesn't keep tinkering and just builds rhythm/momentum with our native and best formation/system.
    Messi staying centrally in a 4-3-3 would lead to that ugly 'thing' of a formation with Messi and Suarez stepping over each others' toes, and with nobody playing in the right wing, like in the home clasico from last season. We need to talk to Messi and move him back to the right wing and keep the 4-3-3, especially now that he has a good RB who he can combine with and bring some of that Alvessi magic back.

    The best thing is to sign Seri, move Messi to RW, get a LW who can do the things Neymar did for us, and we can talk differently. Iniesta/Roberto can play as LCM next to Busi and Seri (first option), or Busi and Paulinho/Rakitic (second option).
    Last edited by serghei; 20th August 2017 at 10:17 PM.

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    Watched only 1st half.
    I said it before that if we decided to go for same false 433 with one winger then it should be RW, was pleasant surprise that we actually played that way.
    Right side has been our weakest link since Messi moved centrally early in 2016. but back then we had Neymar and it didn't made any sense to play him in RW, now he is gone it is better to play with RW since RB has been our weakest position and Alba is still very fast and can cover a lot of ground, and that is even more applicable with Iniesta out.
    The good news is that Deulofeu/Denis & Dembele all can play LW/RW which keep our options open