10 - Lionel Messi - v5

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JamDav1982

Senior Member
raskolnikov said:
That would be only logical due to the pressure but its actially the other way around I think. He missed a shitload in pointless copa games but always scored in classico’s cl ko’s (bar chelsea+city) and nt penalties /shoot outs (bar chille last time).
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How many pens he scored in CL knockouts?
 
raskolnikov

raskolnikov

Well-known member
JamDav1982 said:
Haha top of your head?

Guess it is relevant what of those pens had anything at stake.
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Arsenal twice, milan twice, psg once, city once. But thats the point if its a malaga away 80minute penalty at 0-0 while we are level in points 3 games before the end for ecample thats way more pressure than a cl return where this first match was 3-0.
 
Kerrybai

Kerrybai

New member
Including shootouts he has 23 misses..... what do we consider pressure kicks ?

Copa final, Chelsea , Sevilla 11/12 , valencia cup 11/12, Atletico 13/14 super cup ?? Man City away, bilbao 15/16 league opener, espanyol cup.
 
raskolnikov

raskolnikov

Well-known member
CanadianBlaugrana said:
Agreed JamDav1982, the last Copa America Final comes to mind.
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He scored in the copa america in 2011 vs uruguay in a shoot out, was the only guy to score vs Chile the year before the initial miss. He isnt the bottler you guys make him out to be. Not to say he is le tissier when it comes to important penalties but its way more likely he will score than misss. You just renember misses more if your team loses.
Most people dont even know Ronaldo missed against us in the cl semi’s in 2008 where everyone knows about Messi’s miss against Chelsea.
 
J

JamDav1982

Senior Member
raskolnikov said:
Arsenal twice, milan twice, psg once, city once. But thats the point if its a malaga away 80minute penalty at 0-0 while we are level in points 3 games before the end for ecample thats way more pressure than a cl return where this first match was 3-0.
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Yeah obviously that would be more pressure kick.

No idea what the stats are but would still think he had missed more of the important ones.
 
J

JamDav1982

Senior Member
raskolnikov said:
He scored in the copa america in 2011 vs uruguay in a shoot out, was the only guy to score vs Chile the year before the initial miss. He isnt the bottler you guys make him out to be. Not to say he is le tissier when it comes to important penalties but its way more likely he will score than misss. You just renember misses more if your team loses.
Most people dont even know Ronaldo missed against us in the cl semi’s in 2008 where everyone knows about Messi’s miss against Chelsea.
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Never called anyone a bottler.
 
raskolnikov

raskolnikov

Well-known member
JamDav1982 said:
Yeah obviously that would be more pressure kick.

No idea what the stats are but would still think he had missed more of the important ones.
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Isnt it confirmation bias though? We fear messi to miss since we support Barca. We also remember misses more than converted penalties. Where as for me it feels like Ronaldo never misses. Obviously he is better at penalties but their records is way closer than you would think beforehand. To me it feels he is like balo while with Messi its like flipping a coin.
 
M

Mitchell1978

Senior Member
The penaltystats aren't hard to find and they show, like raskolnikov says, that when the stakes are high he has usually scored.

He's also 4 for 5 in penalty-shootouts for Argentina which isn't counted in the stats.
 
J

JamDav1982

Senior Member
Mitchell1978 said:
The penaltystats aren't hard to find and they show, like raskolnikov says, that when the stakes are high he has usually scored.

He's also 4 for 5 in penalty-shootouts for Argentina which isn't counted in the stats.
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I think everyone knows where to find them.

What are the stats that show when stakes are high his percentage improves?
 
J

JamDav1982

Senior Member
raskolnikov said:
Isnt it confirmation bias though? We fear messi to miss since we support Barca. We also remember misses more than converted penalties. Where as for me it feels like Ronaldo never misses. Obviously he is better at penalties but their records is way closer than you would think beforehand. To me it feels he is like balo while with Messi its like flipping a coin.
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Can remember a few Ronaldo has missed at big moments so not for me.
 
raskolnikov

raskolnikov

Well-known member
JamDav1982 said:
Never called anyone a bottler.
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You implied that he chokes more often under pressure by saying it would cause his conversion rate to drop significantly.
It doesnt really matter though. It seems his conversion rate stays similair to his overal percentage regardless if its a pressure kick or not. I think for a lot top penalty takers with a large number taken it would be different. Dont have stats to back it up. Just a feeling.
 
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