They're pure bottlers. Up there with Roma.
Champions League 2016/17
- Thread starter Pablo Escobar
- Start date
They're pure bottlers. Up there with Roma.
FC B
Senior Member
That's precisely how I was thinking until last year draws... There are numreous scenarios but one thing is certain, you can't almost always get the easiest draws while almost always your arch rival gets pretty much the toughest, year after year after year, multiple times per year, that ain't luck but it is called system !
That's why they removed the old format with only one draw at the beginning so they can manipulate the competition to their own will/interest/benefit as much as they like and that's exactly what they did ever since.
And not, I'm not at all a conspirationist or a big fan of all the conspiracies theories but I can't help myself see the freaking truth as it is!
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FC B
Senior Member
Don't worry too much, they'll probably anyway get Sevilla/City in the next round...
Sevilla are a decent side. Better than anyone they played in the knockouts last season which was like a Europa League draw in every round. Man City would be a good draw again but they have got good players if Pep organises them properly.
Without a doubt, they always do get the easy draw. At least this year there shouldn't be a Wolfsburg or Apoel for them to draw in the quarters and Penaldo to whack in a load of easy goals. The frustrating thing is every year they make the semis (even the final last year) without facing a good side. At least Sevilla are a good side.
People boast about how many years in a row they've reached the semis. It's not hard when you never have to play anyone to get there.
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Mitchell1978
Senior Member
He knows Barca very well yet his record againt Barcelona is poor.
This is not the greatest draw but much better then Bayern.
mehdimike
New member
It is weird.
Luck paired with semi-rigged draws where they are trying to get all top teams into last 8.
Someone will ask probably: but why is then Barca getting tough opponents in the last 16?
Well:
Uefa could be bored with Barca winning titles in 2006, 2009, 2011 and 2015.
Last 11 years:
Barca 4 titles
Real 2
Bayern 1
Man Utd 1
Chelsea 1
Milan 1
Inter 1
-- so, on one hand, as I have said above, imo, it is NOT in Uefa's interest for Barca to rule the Europe for 10-20 years. We, as Barca's fans would like that, but my theory is that Uefa wants MORE top teams interchanging at top, like: Barca, Bayern, Real, English team, Barca, Italian team, Bayern, Real, English team etc
= all top countries would get some CL wins, more people would be interested in watching matches in all top 4-5 leagues, more top teams would get better sponsor deals, more money, more rivalry, more rivalry in media and social media (Barca vs Real, Messi vs CR7, Spanish teams vs Premier league etc)
So, again, on one hand, I could agree with you that ONLY Barca is punished and that we are getting tougher draws because Uefa doesn't want to see us on top too often because they want more top teams to interchange.
Ok, but still. Is he richer and more powerful than owners of City, Psg, Bayern?
If that is the truth, Real will rule the world and a CL in the next 20 years in a row.
Also, another question: Real was also powerful and rich in 00's, with all Galacticos.
If Uefa wants ONLY Real Madrid to rule the world, HOW COME that Real has zero CLs from 2002 to 2014 then?
So, it makes zero sense.
Why would Uefa suddenly decide in 2014 that RM will get a help and that RM will be the owner of Cls for the next 10 years?
Also, Flo is a president since 2009.
He won a CL in his 5th and 7th season.
He was rich and dirty already in 2009/10, and RM was a popular and influental club back then. Plus, they already had all sponsors and a CR7.
Then why Uefa waited 5 years to finally "help" them to win 1 trophy?
It doesn't make sense.
I still think that football (both Champions league, World cups and Euros) works this way:
1. Fifa/Uefa will help to big NT teams to some extent, like:
-- Brasil, Germany, Italy, France, England NT teams (plus to a host nation)=will always get a help from referees (if needed) in GROUP STAGE, so that ALL big teams can reach knockout rounds (also, in qualifying matches against weaker NT teams, if needed)
-- but, but, but... FIFA will give you only 50% of help. So, if you struggle, you will get 1-2 penalties, and the opponent will get a red card to push your key match into a 2:1 win for you
-- but if you totally suck and you are losing 0:3, 0:3, 0:3 in all 3 group stage matches, there is nothing what FIFA can do. You suck, and you will get knocked out
The same principle is applied in 1/8 of world cups (help to top teams), and then after that in quarters and semis, help from referees for top teams drops, let's say from 50% to 25% and 10%.
So, you will get a help from FIFA in group stage and 1/8, but after that, it is more or less: we (FIFA) got what we wanted (all top teams in last 8 or last 4=aka, a lot of money, a lot of interest, a lot of viewers and interesting matches), and now you (teams) can "kill eachother" and let the best team win (we, FIFA, don't care anymore).
2. the same works in a CL
-- in group stage, a draw is totally rigged so that ALL top teams can go through
-- also, in group stage matches, Barca, RM, Bayern usually won't need any help. But if they'll get in a danger of getting knocked out already in a group stage, UEFA will help them and Barca/RM/Bayern will surely get some penalties/red cards for the opponents in key matches, just to avoid any complications
-- so, if Barca/RM/Bayern can win on their own (which they should), Uefa won't intervene, everything will be 100% clear and fair
-- but if they do get in troubles, Uefa will try to help
-- also, if RM or Barca would be losing all matches in group stage by 0:3, again=well, nobody (not even Uefa) can help you then
Then, when a 1/8 draw comes, Uefa will again try to get Barca, RM, Bayern and some English teams into a last 8.
If possible, they will avoid big matches in 1/8 (Psg and Arsenal are not yet powerhouses, so Barcasg and Bayern:Arsenal are not risky matches).
If they can't avoid 1-2 big matches, they will usually give a tougher (but passable) opponent to Barca (since Barca will win against majority of teams, plus if they knockout Barca, it isn't that big deal, since Barca won too much in previous years).
Also, if needed, Barca/RM/Bayern will get a slight push from refs in 1/8 if something is not going well.
In a draw for quarters, it is less possible to rig things, so we will have more big matches there.
About top3 teams, ONLY Barca had very tough draws in recent 5 years.
RM had easy draw, but Bayern also had passable opponents.
So, let's say that Uefa got pissed off by Barca in 2011, when we won titles in 2006, 2009 and 2011, and when we looked too dangerous and too good (and Messi had 10 years of possible domination infront of him).
Imo, there is some logic that Uefa THEN started to hate on Barca and started to help to RM and Bayern.
Bayern:
2016: Juventus, Benfica (lol), Atletico (KO)
2015: Shakhtar (lol), Porto (lol), Barca (KO)
2014: Arsenal (meh), Man Utd (meh), RM (KO)
2013: Arsenal (meh), Juventus (meh back then), Barca, Borussia
2012: Basel (lel), Marseille (lol), Real, Chelsea (KO)
-- so, if a draw is semi-rigged in 1/8 and 1/4 (and in semis you can't do too much regarding rigging matches), out of 10 opponents in 1/8 and 1/4 for Bayern in the last 5 years:
-- weak: Basel, Olympique, Shakthtar, Benfica, Porto
-- average: Arsenal, Arsenal, Man Utd
-- strong: Juventus (not that strong in 2013), Juventus 2016
-- Bayern had 2 strong opponents, 3 average opponents and 5 weak opponents in the last 5 years
(We can never play against crappy teams like Shakhtar, Basel and similar)
Barca:
2016: Arsenal, Atletico
2015: City, Psg, Bayern, Juventus
2014: City, Atletico
2013: Milan, Psg, Bayern
2012: Leverkusen, Milan, Chelsea
Barca:
-- weak: Leverkusen
-- average: Milan, Milan, Psg, Psg, City, City, Arsenal
-- strong: Atletico, Atletico
Barca had 1 weak opponent, 7 avarage to very good opponents, and 2 strong opponents (Atletico).
Real:
2016: Roma, Wolfsburg, City, Atletico
2015: Schalke, Atletico, Juventus
2014: Schalke, Borussia, Bayern, Atletico
2013: Man Utd, Galatasaray, Borussia
2012: Cska (wtf), Apoel (wtf), Bayern
-- weak: Cska, Apoel, Galatasaray, Schalke, Schalke, Wolfsburg
-- average: Man Utd, Borussia, Roma
-- strong: Atletico
So, Real had the easiest draw out of Barca/RM/Bayern.
BUT, Bayern (imo) also had quite an easy job in 1/8 and 1/4 in the last 5 years.
Further, to strengthen my theory how Uefa isn't actually helping ONLY to Real, BUT they are HATING on Barca because we won too many titles (and Uefa wants new champions), so Uefa started to "push" RM and Bayern with easier draws.
Before 2011, when Uefa (imo) got pissed at us (after 2006, 2009 and 2011's title), these are RM's draw before 2012:
Real Madrid, ALL 1/8 opponents:
2011: Lyon (French champion for years like Psg today)
2010: Lyon (KO)
2009: Liverpool (KO)
2008: Roma (KO)
2007: Bayern (KO)
2006: Arsenal (KO)
2005: Juventus (KO)
2004: Bayern
2003: Man Utd
So, in 9 years, back then, they got only one weaker opponent (Roma), and they still lost in that year.
Lyon, Lyon, Bayern, Bayern, Juventus, Man Utd, Arsenal, Liverpool.
So, if we look at stats more deeply, Real surely wasn't "protected" by UEFA always.
(In fact, to some extent, we could say that Uefa also started to "hate" them after 2002 when THEY won too many trophies in 1998, 2000 and 2002).
Something happened in the last 5 years.
And once again, there are several options:
1. just an insane good/bad luck and random
2. Uefa pushing ONLY RM (I don't believe in that)
3. Uefa pushing RM and Bayern and HATING on Barca (my pick)
4. Flo's money (but there are other insanely rich teams also, imo)
In shorter, I don't believe that UEFA is helping ONLY to Real.
It is a mixture of a classical:
1. semi rigged draw in group stage and early knockout rounds
2. plus, some hate on Barca because we won too much and we are "boring" and Uefa wants new idols, new posterboys, new heroes
= and because of that, Uefa IS helping to other 2 biggest teams RM and Bayern to create more interchanging of winners, and not to allow Barca's boring hegemony.
What about Atletico's drawing in 1/8?
Milan
Leverkusen
PSV
Leverkusen
!!
Hardy
Senior Member
Last year in all 4 games was a pain in the ass. I don't think is so stupid to play an open game vs Barca, that's what i mean.
BarcaVillain
New member
Napoli are massively inconsistent, yes. They did play possibly the best first half of football I've seen of any team this season in the 3-0 win against Inter. They're in great form at the minute, whilst PSG aren't. The problem is its nailed on the fortunes of both will have reversed come feb.
JerseyAddict
Well-known member
I think it has direct connection with some people in UEFA. If you remember 0:4 win in Madrid, fans were yelling Perez to leave. RM fans were on the edge. His chair was shaking. Benitez, realy bad team play, his shit... he needed soemthin to win or to leave. La Liga was then already lost, he needed somethin... CDR was lost due idiotic mistake with supended player playing. He was left with only UCL. So what happend. All of a sudden (YEAH RIGHT, coincidence my ass) he gets easy draw for a eas draw and "shitty team" drags itself with luck and eas draws in to the final. Loosert Atletico shits things up again and the have UCL people are happy and Perez is back on track. It doesn't have anything with UEFA. It has with few right people doing wrong things in right time. It is an conspiracy theory but this is a shitty world and lost of theories are in the end proven right. Money makes the world go round. They help RM to some extent and say you are here and after that you are on your own. You can always count on Atletico. LOL
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