11 - Ousmane Dembélé - V1

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Pepe Silvia

Active member
Ustari said:
Yeah Valverde tactics have nothing to do with the win. Basically it was the players that won the game. . . Jeez
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In other situations, I can clearly say that that was the case, but this weekend, he let his hands go... he swung, bobbed and weaved... and punched back! Credit where it's due to EV
 
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Centauri B

New member
Potroh said:
The line-up was a typical EV 4-4-2 often 4-5-1 that has little to do with any Barca-style and even less with attacking football.

- Messi more or less screwed up all free-kicks for two months or so, it's not Valverdes merit that this time Messi was more punctual.
- The second goal was the result of individual play by the only two attackers, who know each other quite well. Not Valverde's merit.
- The third goal was the result of an individual attempt by Suarez, who always tries that dribble in his awkward and clumsy way, but almost never succeeds. Exceptionally he did, after screwing up two much clearer chances. It's luck.
- The fourth goal doesn't even need to be mentioned, it was pure individual brilliance by Messi.

None of the goals have anything to do with any tactical move, or anything that has to do with the coach.
The coach was lucky because some of the exceptional players saved him and the team.

But during the first 15-20 minutes, the team was under strong pressure, could have conceded at least two goals easily, once again it's not EV's merit that luckily they did not.

So to sum it up, the result was anything but Valverde's merit, he did nothing but his usual thing to defend and leave the rest on Messi and Co.
Had he started with 4-3-3 or anything else, the result could have been the very same, because individual factors played in every goal scored.
All these can easily and simply depict that this time the coach had NOTHING to do with the favorable result...
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I hate to break it to you, but most of the time (if not all of the time) the manager has little-to-nothing to do with the result. Football results are determined by the following factors: a) Quality of players, b) Conditioning of the players, c) Luck (especially in the short-term)

You are absolutely right to say that all four of our goals were down to individual brilliance, but we also created some very easy chances that Suarez did not take. Betis did indeed put a lot of pressure on us, but they only got half-chances, nothing more. The current version of our team does not have the capability to dominate games the way the Xavi-Iniesta team did. The good news for us, is that in the past few months or so, we have massively improved in terms of traditional defending, which was something we sucked at for many years now.

My point is that we should not exaggerate the influence that EV can have on the team. If you follow most posters on here, you would think that EV is hellbent on destroying Barca. I think it's just that we cannot play the Xavi-Iniesta way anymore, since Xavi-Iniesta are long gone by now.
 
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PhilS

Active member
Valverde likes to play his best players. The 4-4-2 in the last game liberated the Barca offense: the team was much better able to attack than it usually is in the 4-3-3. The reason the formation worked so well, as usual, was because the players played so well. Vidal and Arthur had fantastic offensive games. Coutinho was put to the bench by players who played a lot better than Coutinho usually has recently.

Not to say that I am not worried about overplaying some of the veteran players.
 
FCBarca

FCBarca

Mike the Knife
Ustari said:
Yeah Valverde tactics have nothing to do with the win. Basically it was the players that won the game. . . Jeez
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I am not a fan of Valverde but there's no question he determined the tactics against Betis, tactics that along with the obvious (Leo) made the difference.

Great result, great performance and great goals but many will likely overlook the fact that better finishing from Setien's side could've led to a very different result
 
Potroh

Potroh

New member
PhilS said:
The 4-4-2 in the last game liberated the Barca offense: the team was much better able to attack than it usually is in the 4-3-3
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So hail the 4-4-2 once again and forget about players like Dembele, Malcom and Coutinho???

I can easily tell you that "tactically" it was nothing else but a typical "Russian Roulette" - the exact EV "safety hope" that this time worked, but the very same thing did not work against Rome last year and will NOT necessarily work this season either.
It's fine, because both Messi and the usually quite comically clumsy Suarez picked an exceptional day, but not all days are exceptional, or exceptionally lucky...

It's not tactics as such, it's simply distrust in the midfield and defense, but before all: it is FEAR...
 
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Horatio

Horatio

You're welcome
FCBarca said:
Great result, great performance and great goals but many will likely overlook the fact that better finishing from Setien's side could've led to a very different result
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The ‘if only the opponent finished their chances’-argument is only valid if we created far less chances. Suarez, again, missed some sitters, Messi could have scored 5 etc...

So in a reality where both teams(not just one) were more efficient with their chances, we still wouldve come out on op.
 
Blaugrana Bull

Blaugrana Bull

HiiiPoWeR
Usually Valverde thanks Rakitic after every match. Whole team was very surprised. Rakitic was seen leaving the stadium quicker than usual. [cat radio]
 
Horatio

Horatio

You're welcome
Potroh said:
The line-up was a typical EV 4-4-2 often 4-5-1 that has little to do with any Barca-style and even less with attacking football.

- Messi more or less screwed up all free-kicks for two months or so.
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Wouldnt say he screwed them up. There were some well-taken ones among those. But some were well-saved. Like the one recently where an opposing player ran back to the goalline to block it.
 
Potroh

Potroh

New member
Horatio said:
Wouldnt say he screwed them up. There were some well-taken ones among those. But some were well-saved. Like the one recently where an opposing player ran back to the goalline to block it.
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You are right. To "screw those up" was a too harsh way to put it. That's why I tried to soften it by "more or less"...
(His free-kicks have never been truly strong, that's why his great precision is the killer ingredient. But he actually banged some of them 2-3 meters too high, which lacked his usual precision...)
When the kick was give at the left, I frankly wouldn't have minded Coutinho to try at least some of them...
 
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