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Thread: Gianluigi Donnarumma

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by JamDav1982 View Post
    Think Barca playing from back and Valdes had bigger impact than Neuer.
    I disagree with that. Valdes sweeping was never at the level that Neuer has been, Valdes has been a great example of how its done right, so were van der Sar, Schmeichel and others, but none of them ever gave this role that much spotlight as Neuer has done. Sweeper keeping was a known thing, and after a controversial start thanks to Higuaita it became more popular when better goalkeepers did it and succeeded. But it never went viral.
    The point were the spark leaped over and caused the fire was when Neuer played Algeria in the World Cup. People were divided in calling him either lunatic or genius, and he went under public observation. He underlined his good performances in the following year and now everyone actually agrees that sweeper keeping is more than just sidepass accurately.
    Even Donnarumma said in an interview that his role was inspired by Neuer. Not saying Valdes wasnt great at what he did, he even did it before Neuer was known for it, but Neuer was the one who sold this role. He isnt the best gk of all times, surely not, but if w'd be talking about the most influental then I would say yes and i'm not the only one there.

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    Not saying Valdes was at the same level on the ball as Neuer but the way Barca played using Valdes to play out from back has had a bigger influence than any teams looking to replicate what Neuer does.

    Keepers being good with ball at feet became important more so through Barca than Neuer who may be the best at it now and the one people look up to. But he didn't really reinvent or change the way teams play or the way keepers play as much as Valdes and Barca did.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JamDav1982 View Post
    Not saying Valdes was at the same level on the ball as Neuer but the way Barca played using Valdes to play out from back has had a bigger influence than any teams looking to replicate what Neuer does.

    Keepers being good with ball at feet became important more so through Barca than Neuer who may be the best at it now and the one people look up to. But he didn't really reinvent or change the way teams play or the way keepers play as much as Valdes and Barca did.
    That is just wrong IMHO ,Neuer impact is way way bigger .

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    Thats another thing though, although I would still say that Neuer's role is a bit more influental then.
    Neuer is almost solely responsible for a drastic increase of kids training into the general role of a sweeper keeper.
    While barca and Valdes, as you say, have more of a use in how they are used by their coaches. The fact that Pep's barca is a blueprint to almost any position is undeniable and I agree with that.
    But we're basically saying Neuer is laying the fundament and Valdes in hsi Barca role is doing the fine-tuning of keepers who are already familiar with that role (mostly thanks to Neuer in the future).

    Of course Neuer didnt invent or reinvent anything, he just raised it to a level, were it became recognized. Facebook didnt invent or reinvent social media, but it was the first platform that made it to a level that led to viral publicity and everyone joining it. Now everyone is living 50% of his life on a digital timeline. Similar thing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yannik View Post
    Thats another thing though, although I would still say that Neuer's role is a bit more influental then.
    Neuer is almost solely responsible for a drastic increase of kids training into the general role of a sweeper keeper.
    While barca and Valdes, as you say, have more of a use in how they are used by their coaches. The fact that Pep's barca is a blueprint to almost any position is undeniable and I agree with that.
    But we're basically saying Neuer is laying the fundament and Valdes in hsi Barca role is doing the fine-tuning of keepers who are already familiar with that role (mostly thanks to Neuer in the future).

    Of course Neuer didnt invent or reinvent anything, he just raised it to a level, were it became recognized. Facebook didnt invent or reinvent social media, but it was the first platform that made it to a level that led to viral publicity and everyone joining it. Now everyone is living 50% of his life on a digital timeline. Similar thing.
    Teams put a huge focus on what keepers could do with the ball at their feet long before Neuer v Algeria.

    Can remember it being a big thing when Man Utd signed De Gea or Totenhham Lloris or when Barca were scouting Ter Stegen and signing Bravo.

    Since Pep introduced the passing style including the goalkeeper in build up and making it a success every keepers kicking/passing distribution has became a huge focus like never before.

    Long before Neuer v Algeria.

    Honestly can't see one keeper or team that have changed their style to try and copy how he played there anyway. Most passing GKs and teams tactics still reflect what Barca/Valdes did than Neuer did in that game.

    Seems to me Neuer is more of a one off and players/coaches see him as such.

    Maybe you are right and the kids are copying him in Germany and more playing in his style will come through.
    Last edited by JamDav1982; 10th January 2016 at 07:46 PM.

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    I would say Pep affected defenders more than GKs .more defenders caring about their passing and on the ball ability .Also their ability to play highline but really can't feel his influence on GK .
    Specially with the fact that outside Barca VV was always considered the weakest point in the team

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    Quote Originally Posted by khaled_a_d View Post
    I would say Pep affected defenders more than GKs .more defenders caring about their passing and on the ball ability .Also their ability to play highline but really can't feel his influence on GK .
    Specially with the fact that outside Barca VV was always considered the weakest point in the team
    Pep completely changed the way teams used their keeper on the ball and used him as another player with the ball at his feet.

    Nothing completely knew but showed how it could be done successfully and swathes of teams and how keepers were looked at changed.

    Valdes was seen as a bit of a weak link as people thought he made errors but they knew how good he could be with ball at feet.

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    I didnt depicture Neuer's Algeria performance as the bible of sweeper keeping. I said that this was the point where every 8 year old on this planet that likes football or not, got to know what "sweeper keeping" means. The point where "Sweeper keeper" got finally introduced in the dicitionary of every football hipster worldwide, next to other fancy sounding terms such as "Tiki Taka", "Catenaccio" or "Gegenpressing" and more importantly became something that every kid wants to do now.
    Barca with valdes have influenced a lot, but the gk position was probably the worst example for that. Its not like every team plays Barca football now, only handful of them have actually adapted comparable styles. But those are mostly top teams, because having good players was always a massive requirement for those tactics. So 90% of the teams today are relatively unbothered by how Barca played under Pep, they could not even do that if they wanted to.
    But Neuer's influence is purely individual and accessable to everyone. With every year passing all teams have access to million talents in an evergrowing pool of sweeper keepers, such as Donnarumma here. And can use those guys for Barca-tactics or whatever other purposes they want to.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yannik View Post
    I didnt depicture Neuer's Algeria performance as the bible of sweeper keeping. I said that this was the point where every 8 year old on this planet that likes football or not, got to know what "sweeper keeping" means. The point where "Sweeper keeper" got finally introduced in the dicitionary of every football hipster worldwide, next to other fancy sounding terms such as "Tiki Taka", "Catenaccio" or "Gegenpressing" and more importantly became something that every kid wants to do now.
    Barca with valdes have influenced a lot, but the gk position was probably the worst example for that. Its not like every team plays Barca football now, only handful of them have actually adapted comparable styles. But those are mostly top teams, because having good players was always a massive requirement for those tactics. So 90% of the teams today are relatively unbothered by how Barca played under Pep, they could not even do that if they wanted to.
    But Neuer's influence is purely individual and accessable to everyone. With every year passing all teams have access to million talents in an evergrowing pool of sweeper keepers, such as Donnarumma here. And can use those guys for Barca-tactics or whatever other purposes they want to.
    Ok we will see what influence Neuer has on keepers in coming years as of now can't see any teams searching for that type of keeper or anyone replicating it.

    The way Barca played totally changed the way keepers were looked at and discussed and teams tried to replicate playing out from back.

    It was One of the main things teams copied as they could. As Valdes clones could be found. Teams could not find Xavi or iniestas to completely copy tiki taka or a Messi to play false nine.

    Seen Donnaruma play a few time and has never looked anything like Neuer style yet.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JamDav1982 View Post
    Ok we will see what influence Neuer has on keepers in coming years as of now can't see any teams searching for that type of keeper or anyone replicating it.

    The way Barca played totally changed the way keepers were looked at and discussed and teams tried to replicate playing out from back.

    It was One of the main things teams copied as they could. As Valdes clones could be found. Teams could not find Xavi or iniestas to completely copy tiki taka or a Messi to play false nine.

    Seen Donnaruma play a few time and has never looked anything like Neuer style yet.
    Of course it isnt extremely visual as for now. If we say that the global hype about sweeper keeping started by Neuer in 2014, then thats just one and a half year ago. Those things take longer to be visible. I also never said that Donnarumma or any upcoming sweeper keeper is absolutely identical to Neuer. I just meant that they are more likely to become sweeper keepers instead of just being the traditional demotivated woodplanks in goal who wouldnt touch the ball with his foot when their lifes depended on it. And its affirmative that there is now a young italian keeper stepping up on the scene, claiming that his inspiration has been Neuer when being asked to his goalkeeper style. That surely won't be the last time this happens.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yannik View Post
    Of course it isnt extremely visual as for now. If we say that the global hype about sweeper keeping started by Neuer in 2014, then thats just one and a half year ago. Those things take longer to be visible. I also never said that Donnarumma or any upcoming sweeper keeper is absolutely identical to Neuer. I just meant that they are more likely to become sweeper keepers instead of just being the traditional demotivated woodplanks in goal who wouldnt touch the ball with his foot when their lifes depended on it. And its affirmative that there is now a young italian keeper stepping up on the scene, claiming that his inspiration has been Neuer when being asked to his goalkeeper style. That surely won't be the last time this happens.
    Don't see the global hype though.

    If it changes we will soon see.

    Goalkeepers being 'tradiditional wood planks' changed before Neuer.

    Again though Neuers impact will not be on keepers suddenly looking to play ball with feet that has already happened largely influenced by success of Barca.

    We will see if keepers start trying to replicate the more risky side of actually coming out and sweeping as Neuer does.

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    Worst possible song ever to put on an otherwise pleasant compilation video
    Last edited by slicknick; 19th January 2016 at 07:56 PM.

  13. #43
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    Love the song, what's the name of the band

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ode to Django View Post
    Love the song, what's the name of the band
    Axero - Struggle, apparently, that's what the caption says.... Not my cup of tea as far as music is concerned but did put up with it, as the video contains some properly good saves

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    Quote Originally Posted by slicknick View Post
    Axero - Struggle, apparently, that's what the caption says.... Not my cup of tea as far as music is concerned but did put up with it
    The song is incredible IMO.
    Last edited by Jombi; 19th January 2016 at 09:43 PM.