Would you say that PSG is the 4th to 7th largest football club in Europe ?
- Thread starter TornAndFrayed
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linetty
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This
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Ryu Hayabusa
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That wholly depends on the definition of "star". If you go by what most would already consider a "star" on the international football stage, Bayern and Real are quite clearly ahead of Barca. If you go by a much more restrictive definition, Barca are likely to come out ahead. (Suarez&Messi + Neymar in the waiting = 2.5, Real: Penaldo&Bale = 2, Bayern: Robben, Neuer = 2)
Antimadridista1
New member
The hell is this ?
StarLord
New member
I am really sorry mate, but this is precisely what a Premface would say.
How can United be considered the biggest club in the world? Most popular in SE Asia and "biggest club in the world" are two things that are totally different.
It's a bit like someone saying that Avatar is the greatest film of all time, or that "Furious 7" is a masterpiece!
If the question was over which league is the most successful marketing/revenue-generating enterprise then it would of course be the EPL by an astronomical difference. The rest of Europe have to react, or they will be crushed by BPL money-power.
I may be mocking the statements of some (as in my signature) but over time, money always tells. It's inevitable.
But back the the matter of who the biggest clubs are. Here popularity (in faraway countries) has little bearing in my view. What matters here are titles, and specifically European titles. On that count, United are nowhere near the top. They are historically barely a Top 10 team (I have not looked at the figures for quite some time tbh) and nowhere near the success of Real Madrid or AC Milan. Bayern, us and Liverpool are also biggest clubs historically.
Leo_Messi
New member
I was obviously talking about "star players" in a historical context. This is also reflected in the reality when we realize that the club has won a record number of Ballon d'Or awards (10), as well as a record number of FIFA World Player of the Year awards (7).
In terms of "stars" nowadays then we are obviously up there with the very best today as well. Only RM and Bayern are comparable.
BBZ8800
Senior Member
ALL TIME CL titles, top 10:
1. Real 10
2. Milan 7
3. Bayern 5
4. Liverpool 5
5. Barcelona 4
6. Ajax 4
7. Inter 3
8. Man. Utd 3
9-12: Juve, Porto, Benfica, Nottingham 2
Last 25 years, 1989-2014:
1. Milan 5
2. Barcelona 4
3. Real 3
4. Bayern 2
5. Man Utd 2
6-14. Inter, Liverpool, Chelsea, Porto, Borussia, Juventus, Ajax, Marseille, Red Star Belgrade 1
For example:
-- Arsenal 0, Psg 0
Anyway, about your post, Man. Utd. should be in Top10 on any list, both EVER and in the last 10-20 years (top 5 in the last 20 years)
-- they played 4 CL finals since 1999'
-- for example, from English teams:
-- Man Utd 4 finals in the last 20 years
-- Liverpool 2 finals in the last 20 years
-- Chelsea 2 finals in the last 20 years
-- Arsenal 1 final
-- Man. City 0 finals
So, no matter which criterias you look, Man Utd is the greatest English team both domestic and in Europe from EPL teams in the last 20-30 years.
JamDav1982
Senior Member
I dont think CL titles is that much of a defining rule as to biggest club, otherwise Aston Vill and Nottingham Forrest would be considered bigger clubs than Arsenal, Man City, Valencia, Atletico.
Personally the biggest clubs for me are the ones that currently have a mix of strongest financial position and pull for top players.
So would say Barca, Real, Bayern, Man Utd, Arsenal, Chelsea and PSG are biggest clubs at moment.
Not in that order but those lot are the biggest clubs for me just now.
Personally the biggest clubs for me are the ones that currently have a mix of strongest financial position and pull for top players.
So would say Barca, Real, Bayern, Man Utd, Arsenal, Chelsea and PSG are biggest clubs at moment.
Not in that order but those lot are the biggest clubs for me just now.
Bertus
New member
For example, Dortmund is higher than PSG in my book.
Having money and buying good players doesn't mean you become a Top 8 world class club.
PSG proved nothing since QSI bought them. Only this year they reached the 1/4 after beating a big opponent. The past years, they never managed to beat a big club after the group stage.
And if we had the prestige talks, PSG is nowhere near plenty of other clubs.
As a PSG fan, I wish PSG the best, but so far, no they are not amongs the top 8. Unless people just look at the CL ranking, and yeah they are amongs the top 8 every years, but it means nothing in my book.
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JamDav1982
Senior Member
To me 'biggest' means most powerful and most likely to succeed.
History means little.
Most prestige is a different debate really.
The biggest companies in the world for example have no relation to how old they are but how much power they have now.
All open to interpretation I suppose.
BBZ8800
Senior Member
Again, Arsenal, so I just can't agree with that.
Imo, the great clubs should be measured with:
1. CL titles
2. domestic titles
3. popularity around the world
4. and if we are talking about current times, then we should add current times and current teams into that estimation
For example, Atletico was never considered as a big European team.
Atletico emerged in the last 2-3 Season as a European team.
-- but Valencia and Deportivo had similar spells around 2000, and they later disappeared again from the European map
About other teams, the only teams that have both:
1. a lot of CL titles
2. a lot of domestic titles
3. a lot of fans around the world are:
= Barca, Real, Man. Utd, Bayern, Milan, Juventus
If we want to add the current teams and current history from the last 5 years:
-- then Milan is out, and we have:
= Barca, Real, Bayern, Juve and probably one level below them Man. Utd
People are mixing in this topic historical "greatness" of some clubs with the current era.
Chelsea is not historically great club. Nor Man City.
Liverpool and Milan are, but they are poor lately.
So, the question is whether you want to look more historically CL and domestic trophies, or the bigger emphasis should be on current times, and then Psg, Man. City, Chelsea and Atletico can also be considered as Top10 teams.
Or you want to have a mix of both history and current era.
-- in that case teams like Milan, Liverpool and Inter are much "bigger" than Chelsea, City, Psg and Atletico, again
-- while again, if you look only at the last 3-4-5 years, Milan, Inter and similar teams are pretty crappy and nowhere near the top
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JamDav1982
Senior Member
By that rules a club like Celtic could claim to be bigger than Arsenal or Atletico. No way is that the case.
Or is Ajax bigger club now than Arsenal? Not for me.
Too much is focused on history if we are discussing who are the biggest clubs NOW.
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