6 - Carles Alena

khaled_a_d said:

1-I was sarcastic
2-Lucho has called this guys from his 1st day even before we know the end outcome of the ban and when we had the chance to sign players at summer of 2014 and Munir even played after the ban was over. Both under performed to Barca standards.
Lucho promoted 3 players in his 1st 3 seasons(Munir,Sandro & Masip) same number as Pep did for example at same period (Busquets,Pedro & Jeffren).
And other than Grimaldo there is yet a player who Lucho didn't promote who proved he deserved to be in the 1st team. Some of them are struggling into average/awful teams like Gerard,Halilovic,Munir & Samper.

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Masip doesn't really count as a promotion unless you're just trying to fill out Lucho's numbers. The guy was going to be promoted no matter what because we didn't have a 3rd keeper and upon being promoted he's gone on to be irrelevant to the team as expected.

There's obviously the case with Grimaldo (I don't understand how that isn't seen as a MASSIVE FUCKING DEAL to you instead of being just a "Yeah he got it wrong"), but this is a common theme from him towards La Masia defenders in general. We don't have a single RB on the roster but Lucho has done fuck all with even giving the B team fullbacks a chance, which is really just a much worse form of the mistake he made with Grimaldo.

God Serena said:

Masip doesn't really count as a promotion unless you're just trying to fill out Lucho's numbers. The guy was going to be promoted no matter what because we didn't have a 3rd keeper and upon being promoted he's gone on to be irrelevant to the team as expected.

There's obviously the case with Grimaldo (I don't understand how that isn't seen as a MASSIVE FUCKING DEAL to you instead of being just a "Yeah he got it wrong"), but this is a common theme from him towards La Masia defenders in general. We don't have a single RB on the roster but Lucho has done fuck all with even giving the B team fullbacks a chance, which is really just a much worse form of the mistake he made with Grimaldo.

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Grimaldo has been doing well for few months and his situations was dealt wrongly from everyone not just Lucho,I won't rant until we have bigger sample or at least playing in some bigger league. It is a "MASSIVE FUCKING DEAL"if Grimaldo proves to be a barca starting material and I still don't think he is gonna be better than a Back up level for us.
And I calculated Masip b/c I've calculated Jeffren in the comparison,both are basically no bodies who stayed too long for Barca B and had to be promoted regardless the coach.

khaled_a_d said:

Grimaldo has been doing well for few months and his situations was dealt wrongly from everyone not just Lucho,I won't rant until we have bigger sample or at least playing in some bigger league. It is a "MASSIVE FUCKING DEAL"if Grimaldo proves to be a barca starting material and I still don't think he is gonna be better than a Back up level for us.
And I calculated Masip b/c I've calculated Jeffren in the comparison,both are basically no bodies who stayed too long for Barca B and had to be promoted regardless the coach.

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Even if Grimaldo was only going to be backup material do I really need to remind you what our backup LB situation looked like? We were dropping points quite frequently with our LB spot being one of the major reasons why. Lucho's refusal to acknowledge Adriano and Mathieu's shortcomings while also flatly ignoring what is proving to be quite a good LB with our B team is not just a bad decision, it's a baffling one.

And Masip and Jeffren aren't really the same. Masip hardly even counts as a member of the squad. At least Jeffren got to be a rotational player... And Munir/Sandro are hard to compare to the promotions of Busquets and Pedro as well, since neither was ever really played in their position and were ultimately discarded the moment a chance to sign a real striker came.

Grimaldo backup material? You must be joking. Yes, to start off with because he was 20, but he would've easily have knocked off Alba after 1-2 seasons. Lucho also called Samper up from day 1 and look what happened. They waited too long, and now he's fucked. Aleñá must be promoted next summer and Arda sold.

Once Messi is gone we'll be screwed if Barto and co. continue treating youth like this.

There is no more system in place either.

God Serena said:

And Masip and Jeffren aren't really the same. Masip hardly even counts as a member of the squad. At least Jeffren got to be a rotational player... And Munir/Sandro are hard to compare to the promotions of Busquets and Pedro as well, since neither was ever really played in their position and were ultimately discarded the moment a chance to sign a real striker came.

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Jeffren is an attacking player which was easier to give him minutes here and there. Basically an attacking version of Masip.
And Munir& Sandro can't be compared to Busquets & Pedro level either. Both were gr8 players who contributed from day one while Sandro & Munir under performed to our standard even when played in their positions.
I actually agree with Bojan comment,Those are the type of talents that was handed to Lucho. The club was a mess since Zubi was appointed and got responsibilities in the B team and the whole restructuring done under Rosell.Lucho had to work with the worst time for Barca B and he still tried. During the past half decade we have done some bad job in the final phase of youth development.
I mean since losing Pique how many talents we lost to other clubs that proved themselves until Rosell era? In 2011 alone we have lost Bellerin,Icardi & Keita Balde. While the likes of Dongou & Godswill who were hyped almost as much at that time ended up being busts.
Lucho also put huge faith in the likes of Rafinha/Roberto/Denis.Tried both Munir & Sandro too. He might not fulfill everyone hopes for their favorite young players but the problem isn't from him IMHO.

navidjaan said:

Grimaldo backup material? You must be joking. Yes, to start off with because he was 20, but he would've easily have knocked off Alba after 1-2 seasons. Lucho also called Samper up from day 1 and look what happened. They waited too long, and now he's fucked. Aleñá must be promoted next summer and Arda sold.

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That is your opinion and I respect it,but I am talking facts here.for now Grimaldo hasn't proven he is a starting material for a club like Barca. He has done well in Benfica which is way different than doing well in Barca. What either of us projecting him to be in couple of years is a matter of opinions and I honestly don't share yours about him.

IIRC you were saying previuosy you would prefer Alena to stay one more year with Barca B and I think that is the best choice for him too. A season in Barca B but with more calling and playing time in 1st team hopefully.

Two years ago Kaptoum was the next Xavi/Iniesta and was being put in the same line with Alena in terms of talent, potential and chances of reaching the 1st team, suddenly same people who were thinking that ignored Kaptoum in a strange way and now Alena is everything and suddenly even Carbonell is ahead of him lol. So I don't trust people judgment these days, a couple of years ago Godswill was better than Palencia and now Godswill is playing somewhere in 3rd division in England and Palencia is a guy who has to be promoted instead of going for Srna/lichtsteiner, Same with Quntilla who was the next Abidal back in his time at Juvenil A ! Argh, and you want me to take cules' stuff about Lucho-Grimaldo seriously. Not to forget what happened to Lucho when Gambled with Munir/Sandro and they didn't perform lol, if I was him I wouldn't do it again with that kind of fan base

And talking about performing for Benfica, Jonas has been a GERD MULLER for Benfica

navidjaan said:

Grimaldo backup material? You must be joking. Yes, to start off with because he was 20, but he would've easily have knocked off Alba after 1-2 seasons.

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What facts do you present for the sake of such a claim?

I know you like youth more than anyone but that statement is delusional, with all due respect. Grimaldo has been a good player in Benfica. So what? It´s not even the best left back in Portugal. And he´s in a team that attacks most of the time. He suffers when defending and against decent teams. And you rate him higher than Digne and Alba?

F4THi said:

And talking about performing for Benfica, Jonas has been a GERD MULLER for Benfica

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And he was average for Valencia. The Portuguese league is weak. I´m from Portugal, i know. Jonas scores only against small teams, he´s very bad against good teams. But since most teams are weak he scores many goals. My point is : being good in the PT league does not mean nothing. I always wait for the CL or good teams tests.

Yeah that's exactly my point, some people trying to say that losing Grimaldo is like losing a Roberto Carlos for two good months in Primeira Liga of Portugal !

I promise to get back to you khaled but it's late and I've only got time to do one of these and I'm gonna go for the low hanging fruit.

F4THi said:

Two years ago Kaptoum was the next Xavi/Iniesta and was being put in the same line with Alena in terms of talent, potential and chances of reaching the 1st team, suddenly same people who were thinking that ignored Kaptoum in a strange way and now Alena is everything and suddenly even Carbonell is ahead of him lol.

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I don't recall even a single person hyping Kaptoum up as the next Xavi/Iniesta. He was always hailed as a great young midfielder but I can't even recall any of the big time hype machines predicting Kaptoum becoming a first team player one day, so I have to ask you... What are you talking about?

So I don't trust people judgment these days, a couple of years ago Godswill was better than Palencia and now Godswill is playing somewhere in 3rd division in England and Palencia is a guy who has to be promoted instead of going for Srna/lichtsteiner,

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Godswill was only considered to be better than Palencia because he was older. Palencia is a player who really snuck under the radar until Barca B level anyways, because in general the kid isn't very talented, he's just an insanely hard worker and it's hard not to fall in love with him.

Same with Quntilla who was the next Abidal back in his time at Juvenil A !

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Quintilla was a solid wall with Juvenil A alongside Tarin in the Juvenil A side that dominated Europe. Poor management is why he didn't work out with Barca B, and the same has happened to Tarin even after Tarin carried Barca B defensively for an entire season right after being promoted.

Argh, and you want me to take cules' stuff about Lucho-Grimaldo seriously.

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Nobody here cares if you take them seriously because you yourself are a fucking joke. You defend players like Douglas, Gumbau, Vidal, and any other player here who is actually just shit.

Not to forget what happened to Lucho when Gambled with Munir/Sandro and they didn't perform lol, if I was him I wouldn't do it again with that kind of fan base

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Lucho is the one who gambled on Munir and Sandro. Nobody was asking Lucho to promote either one of them. Munir hadn't even had a single season with the B team when he was first being used and Sandro was tipped by almost nobody as being first team potential. In fact, when both were still B team players playing while Suarez was suspended, most people seemed happy at them both being sent back to the B team.

[MENTION=20420]God Serena[/MENTION]

It seems like the principle of your life is to lie, lie and lie until people believe you, you're going for the low hanging fruit and have to lie and dodge in order to prove that the " fucking joke " you're talking to is wrong lol. Imagine pretending that you've never seen anyone predicting that Kaptoum will be a first team player one day ? I've just checked dozens of tweets on twitter and comments here in the thread of Kaptoum that can make you look like the real fucking joke here, then you lie again and say that Godswill was considered to be better than Palencia just because he was older, not because he was doing wonders with Juvenil A in that 2013-2014 season. OMG and that lie that I have been defending Vidal you're completely a joke, fucking disgusting joke who keeps lying trying to hide how helpless he is, and don't think either I really care about what people like you think about me or I do even give a fuck if you care about what I say or not, you're some shameless person who can't just get in the heart of the topic and instead you go for that " you defend Gumbau who is shit " stuff, if you really want me to make you look really a joke then tell me to bring those tweets and comments about Kaptoum, or you can just bring another lie of yours or start with " you rate gumbau " stuff which looks and easier way to escape

raki said:

What facts do you present for the sake of such a claim?

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What facts do you present for the sake of such a claim?

Alba is constantly injured, has many moments of losing it completely, is average defensively and messes up so many good balls in the final 3rd that everyone stopped counting 2 years ago. This has NOTHING to do with me liking La Masia. Last time I checked, Alba was from La Masia too. Watching them both regularly for 3 years now, it's not even worth discussing who has the most talent. That is my opinion based on watching them both every week for 3 years. What do you base your neglect of Grimaldo on? Claims that his excellent performances in the Portuguese league, where Porto, Benfica and Sporting over the years have produced some of Europe's best players, doesn't reflect his incredible potential, not to forget the immediate interest he has generated from Manchester United, City and Juventus.

you rate him higher than Digne and Alba?

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Right now, no. He's younger and is just beginning to start for a good club. Would he still be a good backup for Alba? yes. Does he have higher potential than both and will he outperform both of them in two years? yes, not a single doubt in my mind. Will Digne ever be good enough to knock off Alba? I don't believe so. Will Grimaldo? no doubt in my mind.